Albany, New York Seminar

Originally Posted By: bbadger
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Why would someone keep posting to a forum if they are unhappy with the way the forum is run icon_question.gif


Kind of a puzzler.

When I had posts deleted and / or edited at certain forums I took that as a sign it was time to move on.


--
Bob Badger
Electrical Construction & Maintenance
Moderator at ECN

Originally Posted By: Aimee Jalowsky
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



bbadger wrote:
Why would someone keep posting to a forum if they are unhappy with the way the forum is run ![icon_question.gif](upload://t2zemjDOQRADd4xSC3xOot86t0m.gif)

Kind of a puzzler.

When I had posts deleted and / or edited at certain forums I took that as a sign it was time to move on.



Well said


Originally Posted By: jhagarty
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



bbadger wrote:
Why would someone keep posting to a forum if they are unhappy with the way the forum is run ![icon_question.gif](upload://t2zemjDOQRADd4xSC3xOot86t0m.gif)

Kind of a puzzler.

When I had posts deleted and / or edited at certain forums I took that as a sign it was time to move on.


Bob:

With Membership comes Benefit.

The Modification was done in direct violation of the Posted Rules of this Bulletin Board. As such an explanation should be forthcoming.

To Non-Members (such as yourself) explanations are generally not offered.

One of the benefits of Membership is an explanation when requested.

If an explanation can not be given, that should also be stated as well.


Originally Posted By: jhagarty
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



ajalowsky wrote:
bbadger wrote:
Why would someone keep posting to a forum if they are unhappy with the way the forum is run ![icon_question.gif](upload://t2zemjDOQRADd4xSC3xOot86t0m.gif)

Kind of a puzzler.

When I had posts deleted and / or edited at certain forums I took that as a sign it was time to move on.



Well said


I respectfully request a Full Explanation of your agreement with this comment.


Originally Posted By: bbadger
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:
Bob:

With Membership comes Benefit.


Well I all see is you complaining and whining. ![icon_rolleyes.gif](upload://iqxt7ABYC2TEBomNkCmZARIrQr6.gif)

In my unsolicited opinion only a fool pays for a membership of an organization that they detest.


--
Bob Badger
Electrical Construction & Maintenance
Moderator at ECN

Originally Posted By: jhagarty
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



bbadger wrote:


In my unsolicited opinion only a fool pays for a membership...



Is that why you have not joined NACHI?


Originally Posted By: bbadger
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:

Is that why you have not joined NACHI?


A more likely reason I have not joined NACHI is that I am not, nor intend to become a home inspector, I am happy in my present career as an electrician.

I live in MA and becoming an HI in MA takes a major commitment that at this point in my life I am not prepared to undertake.

I 'hang' at NACHI as I think HIs provide a valuable service and I think I can help them with the electrical portion of that.

I also learn things about other trades and practices while I am here. ![icon_cool.gif](upload://oPnLkqdJc33Dyf2uA3TQwRkfhwd.gif)

I have no interest in becoming anything more than a helpful guest at NACHI.

I trust that answers your question.


Bob


--
Bob Badger
Electrical Construction & Maintenance
Moderator at ECN

Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



bbadger wrote:



A more likely reason I have not joined NACHI is that I am not, nor intend to become a home inspector, I am happy in my present career as an electrician.

I live in MA and becoming an HI in MA takes a major commitment that at this point in my life I am not prepared to undertake.

I have no interest in becoming anything more than a helpful guest at NACHI. ![icon_smile.gif](upload://b6iczyK1ETUUqRUc4PAkX83GF2O.gif)

I trust that answers your question.


Bob


Glad to have your help I am a retired sparky and I still learn about different things.
Please continue we all can learn and do learn from each other.

Roy Cooke sr A HAPPY NACHI Member


Originally Posted By: kwilliams
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we all can learn and do learn from each other.


AMEN ![icon_exclaim.gif](upload://kW92MliyHA8ygoXI0UsgtBSn4ZO.gif)


Originally Posted By: bkelly1
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



rbrown1 wrote:
To all,

These test boards, some with a closed back and some not, have been wired incorrectly. Obviously, this has been done on purpose.

Prior to allowing anyone to go near the boards, a discussion was held with everyone in attendance regarding safety (which you Joe participated in) and how home inspectors should conduct themselves during an inspection. This was directly related to electrical safety.

A statement regarding the booklets was also directed to everyone who attended. It was suggested that everyone who received a booklet, to check the NEC as well as their local codes etc., for any differences, and to update the booklets as necessary.

Yes, the larger test board was connected to an extension cord however, I do not believe this to be a problem as the board was set up for testing purposes only. It was not built to accomodate any device (which consumes power) to be plugged into any outlet on this board. Therefore, the board itself is safe.

Attendees were also asked not to open the A.C. box as wires in there were live and therefore that box should have been left alone.

Obviously, even with instructions, someone did open the box as is shown in one of your pictures, Joe.

Yes, I did take it as an attack on me and the well being of my fellow man.

It would have been far more professional of you Joe to talk to me at the training seminar with regards to any concern regarding any of the test boards or at the very least emailed me prior to the improper post.

I am glad you enjoyed the seminar and learned something, so did I.

In regards to your gifts, I do Thank You for them, as I did publicly during the meeting.

I would have posted earlier however, I too have a company or two to run, therefore my time as of late is limited to get on the board.

The harm has already been done by the original post Joe, so removal of any posts thereafter becomes mute.

I would like to re-iterate one point though. If you (Joe) had any suspision that any of the test borads were unsafe, you, in your capicity should have brought it to my or anyone's attention prior to the session, not after the fact on the message board.

Best Wishes to you and all for a Safe and Happy Holiday!



Well, there we have it. Did it have a built in gfi or other protection into the board. Just wondering now that the can is open.


Originally Posted By: Aimee Jalowsky
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Quote:
Why would someone keep posting to a forum if they are unhappy with the way the forum is run

Kind of a puzzler.


This makes perfect sense to me. If you are not satisfied with the postings in a forum, you have every right not to visit the thread, correct?

Quote:
When I had posts deleted and / or edited at certain forums I took that as a sign it was time to move on. icon_smile.gif


Actually, no one knows who deleted your posts, Joe H. I am just as befuddled as you are. Mr. Tedesco's posts have been edited due to the fact in his suspension from NACHI it clearly states he is NOT to post on the message board at any time dating one calendar year from his suspension.


Originally Posted By: gwells
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Are they hot? I have always told my apprentice electricians NEVER to assume ANY conductor is not hot. To do so could be a fatal mistake.


Originally Posted By: lewens
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



There goes Joe Hagerty again, he just has to go and kick the pile. I would like to know how in the world you get 240 volts through a 110 circuit. Believe me I teach for Bob and Helen and their boards are very safe. If we make a board live the 3 ft. rule comes into effect and anybody crowding is told in no uncertain terms to back away and the student is sternly reminded to maintain a safe zone around him or her. The boards that are built are a rats nest of common problems you will encounter in the field and in no way are representative of any code in the books. Bob goes to great lenghts to make sure the people taking a class are not going to be hurt in any way and I personnaly take offense at any one even suggesting such a thing. The board we teach on at the school is only powered up for the practical exam and upon finishing the exam is immediately powered down. The breaker panel we use is not powered at all and the class is told to treat as if it were live. If we catch anyone probing in the board unsafely they are told that they failed that part of the exam. To even suggest that Bob and Helen would put any one in danger for a demonstration is, in a word, ludicrous. Again Joe Tedesco has proven he has his own agenda and is only out for himself. In my never humble opinion this is just sour grapes.


As for Joe Hagerty, Joe if you keep kicking the pile eventaully you too will get s#!t on your boots.


Larry


Originally Posted By: jhagarty
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:


Are the dangling wires in this photo Live?

![](upload://s1T7d9H09IdsYqqX789u3ZEJGF4.jpeg)



To this question there are 3 possible answers.

1. The receptacles are dummies without a power supply.

2. The receptacle was live and will be corrected for safety.

3. Delete the posting. Pretend nothing happened. If someone asks again we will attack the individual and create a conspiracy theory.

Which answer do you believe NACHI Staff found to be most correct.




Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:


Are the dangling wires in this photo Live?

[ ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)


POOOR JOE He sure likes to get milage. I have to think his picture above has to be the number one photo posted on the BB.

He is a lot like the old 8 track tape never ending
.
He must have the ever ready batteries in his pace maker he just keeps GOING AND GOING AND GOING ECT.

Roy sr


Originally Posted By: bkelly1
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



bkelly1 wrote:
rbrown1 wrote:


Yes, the larger test board was connected to an extension cord however, I do not believe this to be a problem as the board was set up for testing purposes only. It was not built to accomodate any device (which consumes power) to be plugged into any outlet on this board. Therefore, the board itself is safe.



Best Wishes to you and all for a Safe and Happy Holiday!



Well, there we have it. Did it have a built in gfi or other protection into the board. Just wondering now that the can is open.


Mr. brown , I hope it was not this post that upset you. I figured it was a sensible question since the discussion was now open. I take it the board is plugged into a wall outlet and is only supplied with 120v. I am assuming b/c no one has answered that as of yet. (Unless I missed it)

My question was only if there was protection if a student was to make a mistake, would it shock him, trip the breaker in the convention hall, or is there built in device in the board to stop both scenarios from hapening.

Its amazing how this got so big over a simple question. Maybe the people who should not have answered ..did, and didn't help.... ?


Originally Posted By: jhagarty
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:


Are the dangling wires in this photo Live?

![](upload://s1T7d9H09IdsYqqX789u3ZEJGF4.jpeg)



To this question there are 3 possible answers.

1. The receptacles are dummies without a power supply.

2. The receptacle was live and will be corrected for safety.

3. Delete the posting. Pretend nothing happened. If someone asks again we will attack the individual and create a conspiracy theory.

Which answer do you believe NACHI Staff found to be most correct.




rcooke wrote:


POOOR JOE He sure likes to get milage. I have to think his picture above has to be the number one photo posted on the BB.

He is a lot like the old 8 track tape never ending
.
He must have the ever ready batteries in his pace maker he just keeps GOING AND GOING AND GOING ECT.

Roy sr


That is 1 vote for:

3. Delete the posting. Pretend nothing happened. If someone asks again we will attack the individual and create a conspiracy theory.

from Mr. Roy Cooke.

Thanks for your predictable response.


Originally Posted By: cmccann
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jbowman wrote:
Joe H.

To answer your question. The majority of the board was hot. However these to outlets were dummy's. Absolutely not hot. No wires are even remotely close to the boxes.


The question was answered on page 1. What's the issue again?


Originally Posted By: cmccann
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



kwilliams wrote:
jhagarty wrote:
!!

Are the dangling wires in this photo LIVE?
*********************************************

I don't have any idea where Joe T was picking up
voltage from...

As chapter president, I was concerned about the safety also

I pulled both plugs and tested them
with a meter, they where both dead, I looked at the back
of the board and there where no wires going to them


And again on page 1. You people are just plain nuts'o.


Originally Posted By: rbrown1
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Well first let me say Thanks to all who have supported my efforts.


Second, let me say Thanks to all who were and are concerned for their fellow man/woman.

Third let me say the simple answer to all questions is that the boards are safe.

Ok you can count, this is forth (LOL).

Question: are the dangling wires shown in the picture live?
Answer: NO!

Question: were the other test boards (not shown) live?
Answer: YES!

Question: Were the exposed wires on the other test boards live?
Answer: NO!

Question: Are there "built-in safety devices" installed on the large test
board?
Answer: YES!

Do any other of these test boards have safety devices built in? Yes!
Are any of these protected by a G.F.C.I.? Yes!

Is there any other form of safety that can be built into these boards?
Quite possibly.

As of now, these boards will be re-visited to see what, if any improvements can be made to protect unsuspecting home inspectors from getting a shock due to not paying attention when being instructed on how to use the boards. (ie. as apparently J.T. did not listen when instructions were given).

I was under the impression that I was dealing with adults not students that had to put their hand up to go to the washroom. Apparently I was wrong in certain instances. I'll let you all decide when and where that took place.

A cover was removed by someone (again I'll let you people determine who that was) so that a photo could be taken of parts on the board that should have been left alone as it did pose a slight danger to those who stood around the person who removed the cover.

I have not taken anyone's post as an insult nor did I get upset with anyone other than Joe Tedesco, who was in attendance, who took the pictures, who posted an improper statement, which was derogatory, not to mention slanderous, as his post was TOTALLY wrong.

Those wires that are shown to be dangling in the above photos are NOT live. They ARE dead, no power, no current, no low voltage (to try to fool anyone), nothing, nannada, zip, no where!

The current Joe (or any other inspector) was picking up, were the live wires which were running to the outlets around the DUMMIE, 220 Volt, Dryer and Range outlets.

Part of my instructions PRIOR to allowing anyone to test these boards has and always will be, that the inspector get to know the limits of his/her equipment as some are more sensitive that others. Therefore, as people are testing the boards together, they can also find out how their own test equipment performs.

We teach home inspectors, NOT electricians. There is a vast difference in knowledge and education required for each. Electricians need to know far more than any home inspector is required to understand.

Sometimes, some electricians who test the boards go way too deep and therefore find themselves in hot water.

These boards are meant to challenge most home inspectors. To date there is one deficiency on the larger board that noone has found, including seasoned electricans. This deffect will not show up on the normal hand held circuit tester. It in fact will fool the tester, not to mention the person holding the tester.

It was set up this way (safely) to show NOT to always believe what is written on the instructions which accompany most testers and equipment.

Anyway, I am sure by now this subject is getting stale, so hopefully this is the end.

If anyone would like to contact me directly please email me at:

bob@aciss.biz

or call me at: 484-429-5465 (after Wed. Dec.14, 2005)

Again, Best wishes to all, and to all a Goodnight! ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)

Phew, talk about your long winded posts! ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)