Permit research for inspection

[rgrizzle]

Done an inspection on a Multi Million dollar home today. First of all when I booked the inspection I done some permit research, and found that an addition had been added in 2003 a pool and some other work like electric, plumbing and so on. What I found was most of the inspections were never called in and there was only one final inspection done and that was the roof.

The question is should I add this to the report, even though I told the owner and the buyer's agent?

[Michael R. Boyett]

I would remind them that they should do a thorough permit search to ensure all permits were obtained and closed as needed. I personally would not be specific as to what you posted above. I would not want them to think I had done an exhaustive permit search for the property unless I had been hired and paid to do that. Put the responsibility on the buyer to do that due diligence.

Here's my standard wording for this:

The home has evidence of modifications or remodeling after the original construction date. This work may or may not have been permitted by the proper authorities and may or may not have been constructed to the applicable building codes that were in effect at the time. I recommend the client inquire with the seller and research permits applicable for the address with the City of Austin Building Permit Dept or the Authority Having Jurisdiction (AHJ) if the home is outside the city limits and ETJ. Un-permitted remodeling may conceal hidden defects due to poor workmanship and may be subject to certain penalties and fines in addition to repairing any violations. This could result in a significant financial outlay.

The City of Austin Permit Dept is located at:
Reviews & Permits Residential Reviews11th floor)
One Texas Center Walk In Customers: 8:00 a.m. - 1:00 p.m.
505 Barton Springs Road Monday - Friday, 512-974-2380
Austin, Tx 78704

[rgrizzle]

Originally Posted by mboyett

I would remind them that they should do a thorough permit search to ensure all permits were obtained and closed as needed. I personally would not be specific as to what you posted above. I would not want them to think I had done an exhaustive permit search for the property unless I had been hired and paid to do that. Put the responsibility on the buyer to do that due diligence.

I work in the local building department also, so looking up the permits and inspections was easy, I also have worked with the seller before, the bad thing is, is that he is a licensed contractor.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by mboyett

The home has evidence of modifications or remodeling after the original construction date. This work may or may not have been permitted by the proper authorities and may or may not have been constructed to the applicable building codes that were in effect at the time. I recommend the client inquire with the seller and research permits applicable for the address with the City of Austin Building Permit Dept or the Authority Having Jurisdiction (AHJ) if the home is outside the city limits and ETJ. Un-permitted remodeling may conceal hidden defects due to poor workmanship and may be subject to certain penalties and fines in addition to repairing any violations. This could result in a significant financial outlay.

Nice writing. You have an abbreviation with which I am not familiar in the seventh line: ETJ. What does that stand for? Thanks.

[Michael R. Boyett]

Extra-Territorial Jurisdiction. Cities here have the right to define an ETJ that is outside the current city limits whereby they can have a say in the building permit process so that if/when those areas are annexed into the city they will more closely comply with the city's codes and ordnances.

From wikipedia:

Municipal law
In the U.S., many states have laws or even constitutions which permit cities to make certain decisions about the land beyond the town's incorporated limits. Texas, Alaska, North Carolina, and Arkansas are all examples of states which allow cities to claim ETJ over zoning laws, which is the most common use of ETJ. In California, ETJ is referred to as a city's "Sphere of Influence". Some examples include Los Angeles which has a sphere of influence over the unincorporated islands of census designated places in and around its boundaries, and Palmdale which has a large sphere of influence on its unincorporated suburbs as well as the cities within its U.S. government designated Foreign Trade Zone. Some states even require that ETJ be established over an area for an extended time period (usually one year) before it can be subject to annexation. Most set the ETJ distance based upon a city's population.

[James H. Bushart]

St Louis is made up of 90+ municipalities that apply a variety of building codes and most require inspections/occupancy permits with each sales transaction.

The seller is to obtain an inspection by the city who then creates a punch list for the seller to get the residence up to code.

The buyer is responsible to go to the city hall and purchase an occupancy permit which will not be provided if the house was (1) not inspected or (2) not brought up to code.

Sometimes the sellers comply and sometimes they conceal from the buyer the existence of these violations and the city's record of them and pass on the house "as is".

In other words, a buyer will be ultimately responsible to the city to see that the house they buy is up to code before they can occupy it.

Accordingly, it is prudent for inspectors who are looking at houses in these municipalities to check with the city and be sure to include at least a reference to all outstanding violations in the report.

It will be extremely embarassing to have the buyer be denied an occupancy permit for a condition not mentioned in my inspection report.

[Brian A. MacNeish]

Originally Posted by jbushart

St Louis is made up of 90+ municipalities that apply a variety of building codes and most require inspections/occupancy permits with each sales transaction.

The seller is to obtain an inspection by the city who then creates a punch list for the seller to get the residence up to code.

The buyer is responsible to go to the city hall and purchase an occupancy permit which will not be provided if the house was (1) not inspected or (2) not brought up to code.

Jeez, you guys are getting to be over-regulated....where's the land of the FREE?

[Raymond E. Wand]

Brian

I think its called due diligence.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by mboyett

Extra-Territorial Jurisdiction. Cities here have the right to define an ETJ that is outside the current city limits whereby they can have a say in the building permit process so that if/when those areas are annexed into the city they will more closely comply with the city's codes and ordnances.

From wikipedia:

Quote:
Municipal law
In the U.S., many states have laws or even constitutions which permit cities to make certain decisions about the land beyond the town's incorporated limits. Texas, Alaska, North Carolina, and Arkansas are all examples of states which allow cities to claim ETJ over zoning laws, which is the most common use of ETJ. In California, ETJ is referred to as a city's "Sphere of Influence". Some examples include Los Angeles which has a sphere of influence over the unincorporated islands of census designated places in and around its boundaries, and Palmdale which has a large sphere of influence on its unincorporated suburbs as well as the cities within its U.S. government designated Foreign Trade Zone. Some states even require that ETJ be established over an area for an extended time period (usually one year) before it can be subject to annexation. Most set the ETJ distance based upon a city's population.

Thanks. I had never heard of the term. We do, indeed, call it "Sphere of Influence" out here, and that's what we used back when I was in Texas and Louisiana. We ran into the "problem" in College Station, Texas, as they were building in the unincorporated areas southeast towards Houston. College Station couldn't annex property fast enough so they tried to exert authority due to their "sphere of influence."
El Cajon is doing the same thing right now out here in trying to block a very large Home Depot from being built. The lot is outside the city limits but is surrounded on three sides by the city.

[whandley]

It's actually ETJ - Extended Territorial Jurisdiction...

http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/ETJ

[Michael R. Boyett]

I suppose you can split hairs over this but it is definitely referred to as Extra Territorial Jurisdiction here:

http://www.cstx.gov/docs/etj_current.pdf (Russel will like this one )
or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extrate...l_jurisdiction

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by mboyett

http://www.cstx.gov/docs/etj_current.pdf (Russel will like this one )

I did! That was fine, fine, fine!

As far as terminology goes, I like "Sphere of Influence." I've been using that for 30 years in Texas, Louisiana, Ohio, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Florida, Utah, Washington, Oregon, and California.

I remember in late 1994 when I was working out of Farmington Hills, Michigan, trying to build a 700-ft cell tower out in what we thought were the boondocks in lower Michigan. Turns out there were a lot of "Spheres of Influence" amongst all them thar farmers and ranchers because them ol' tall towers might fall on them as they were plowing the fields, or the radiation from the towers might sterilize their livestock or, worse (maybe, maybe not) sterilize them! I would never have thought that one person with 10,000 acres of land would have a Sphere of Influence on his neighbor's land. Maybe it was just jealousy over us choosing his neighbor rather than him because, at that time, we were paying $10,000 a month for a 30-year lease with an annual CPI increase of 3%. Somehow I don't thing those guys are farming or ranching anymore after striking gold with Nextel.

[gporter]

Originally Posted by rgrizzle

I work in the local building department also, so looking up the permits and inspections was easy, I also have worked with the seller before, the bad thing is, is that he is a licensed contractor.

Use caution every computer stroke is traced at a government facility. An asst fire chief in florida was fired for using county equip (computer) for part-time business. I think he did construction.

[gporter]

He left blueprints lying at a computer and they searched his account.