Stupid question about CO detectors

[Hans Coleman]

Stupid question about CO detectors. I have a few realtors that are fighting me about if the CO2 detector should be permanently installed or if they can just use the ones that plug into the wall.
I just want to make sure sure I was telling them the right thing

[Vince Santos]

Why are you worried about carbon dioxide, beer been a little flat lately?

When I report on the lack of carbon monoxide (CO) detectors I just recommend installing. To me it doesn't matter if it's hardwired or a plug in system and I don't know of any requirements for one or the other.

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

There is no requirement in the IRC for a CO monitor. Some local ordinances require it, but it's not a national thing.

[Vaughn Hill]

House builders in Colorado are required to install carbon monoxide detectors in new homes in a bill signed into law in March 2009 by the state legislature.
House Bill 1091 requires installation of the detectors in new and resold homes near bedrooms as well as rented apartments and homes. It took effect on July 1, 2009. The legislation was introduced after the death of Denver investment banker Parker Lofgren and his family. Lofgren, 39; his wife Caroline, 42; and their children, Owen, 10, and Sophie, 8, were found dead in a multimillion-dollar home near Aspen, Colorado on Nov. 27, 2008, victims of carbon-monoxide poisoning.
In New York State, Amanda's Law,” (A6093A/C.367) requires one- and two-family residences which have fuel burning appliances to have at least one carbon monoxide alarm installed on the lowest story having a sleeping area, effective since February 22, 2010. Although homes built before Jan. 1, 2008 are allowed to have battery-powered alarms, homes built after that date need to have hard-wired alarms. In addition, New York State contractors have to install a carbon monoxide detector when replacing a fuel burning water heater or furnace if the home is without an alarm. The law is named for Amanda Hansen, a teenager who died from carbon monoxide poisoning from a defective boiler while at a sleepover at a friend's house.
In July 2011, California will require installation of carbon monoxide detectors in existing single-family homes, with multifamily homes following in 2013.

[Michael Larson]

CO detectors are required in MN and WI

[dmcauley]

Illinois has required them since January 1, 2007. Doesn't matter if hard wired or plug ins, as long as they are within 15 feet of sleeping areas.

[rspermo]

In these states that require CO detectors, I am wondering at what PPM of CO do they require that they actually go off? Most of the ones I see produce an alarm at 60 - 70 ppm after 1 - 4 hrs. I consdier these UL approved CO detectors to be almost useless.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rspermo

In these states that require CO detectors, I am wondering at what PPM of CO do they require that they actually go off? Most of the ones I see produce an alarm at 60 - 70 ppm after 1 - 4 hrs. I consdier these UL approved CO detectors to be almost useless.

Why?

At what level does carbon monoxide become toxic?
For healthy adults, CO becomes toxic when it reaches a level higher than 50 ppm (parts per million) with continuous exposure over an eight hour period.. When the level of CO becomes higher than that, a person will suffer from symptoms of exposure. Mild exposure over a few hours (a CO level between 70 ppm and 100 ppm) include flu-like symptoms such as headaches, sore eyes and a runny nose. Medium exposure (a CO level between 150 ppm to 300 ppm) will produce dizziness, drowsiness and vomiting. Extreme exposure (a CO level of 400 ppm and higher) will result in unconsciousness, brain damage and death.

http://www.carbon-monoxide-poisoning...co-levels.html

[Jeffrey R. Jonas]

http://www.health.state.mn.us/divs/e.../co/index.html

Minnesota State Law requires that homes have at least one operational CO alarm within 10 feet of every room legally used for sleeping (see Minnesota Statute, 299F.50). All CO alarms should be certified by a nationally recognized testing laboratory to conform to the latest Underwriters Laboratory (UL) Standards. Follow the manufacturer's instructions for placement of your CO alarm and also note the suggested replacement date. For additional information on CO alarms, call 651-201-7200 or visit www.fire.state.mn.us

[David Hays]

A Precise Home Inspections in Colorado Springs has a nice article about the placement of the detectors.

Thanks Lance!

http://aprecisehomeinspection.com/CO2article.html

[Vince Santos]

Originally Posted by dhays

A Precise Home Inspections in Colorado Springs has a nice article about the placement of the detectors.

Thanks Lance!

http://aprecisehomeinspection.com/CO2article.html

Interesting article. My question is if carbon monoxide is lighter than air and tends to rise what difference would that make? If the furnace is running and forcing air into various room and that air is also being drawn into the returns, wouldn't that circulate the carbon monoxide too?

"High or low in a room; It makes no difference where you put the detector
-- but not because carbon monoxide and air have approximately the same
density. Both are gases and as a result, diffusion alone and the entropy
effect will take care of mixing them. Any convection currents and/or
forced-air turbulence present will also enable the gases to mix and affect
the detector."
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasc.../chem03364.htm

[Hans Coleman]

WOW major typo... That why I should not post at 5AM

[Bob Elliott]

Originally Posted by vsantos

Why are you worried about carbon dioxide, beer been a little flat lately?

When I report on the lack of carbon monoxide (CO) detectors I just recommend installing. To me it doesn't matter if it's hardwired or a plug in system and I don't know of any requirements for one or the other.

It should be within six inches of the ceiling corner.

[Jeffrey R. Jonas]

Originally Posted by belliott

It should be within six inches of the ceiling corner.

Is that a Chicago thing? Certainly not a manufactures instruction.

[David C. Macy]

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/466.html

How should I install a CO Alarm?

CO alarms should be installed according to the manufacturer's instructions. CPSC recommends that one CO alarm be installed in the hallway outside the bedrooms in each separate sleeping area of the home. CO alarms may be installed into a plug-in receptacle or high on the wall. Hard wired or plug-in CO alarms should have battery backup. Avoid locations that are near heating vents or that can be covered by furniture or draperies. CPSC does not recommend installing CO alarms in kitchens or above fuel-burning appliances.