... They Used the "L" Word!

[klott]

Originally Posted by kpierce

Far from moot. One's salvation, according to Christianity, very much depends on your adherence to the writings of the Bible. Evolution directly contradicts the Bible.

Common sense contradicts evolution.

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by mlarson

Not having read their position I am unable to answer.
This should help:
"In a major statement of the Roman Catholic Church's position on the theory of evolution, Pope John Paul II has proclaimed that the theory is 'more than just a hypothesis' and that evolution is compatible with Christian faith. In a written message to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, the pope said the theory of evolution has been buttressed by scientific studies and discoveries since Charles Darwin ... "It is indeed remarkable that this theory has progressively taken root in the minds of researchers following a series of discoveries made in different spheres of knowledge', the pope said in his message Wednesday. 'The convergence, neither sought nor provoked, of results of studies undertaken independently from each other constitutes, in itself, a significant argument in favor of this theory..."
IMHO if that includes that we descended from a slime puddle I disagree.
While not very descriptive, that is correct. So you agree that the Catholic religion is wrong. Given that, why do believe your religion is right and parts of the Catholic religion are wrong. And also, in your unqualified opinion, what gives the Pope the right to re-write parts of the Catholic religion?
If they simply state that some form of survival of the fittest is akin to evolution I have no problem with that.
As you can see above that is not the case. They embrace all parts of the evidence.

.................

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by klott

Common sense contradicts evolution.

How so?

[klott]

Originally Posted by kpierce

The many books that discuss the Big Bang are supported by the evidence that has been observed. This is not the case for the Bible.

The Big Bang theory says that everything came into existance all at once, the Bible says the same thing. But to say that everything came from nothing is ridiculous, think about it, everything man does starts with a thought, then he creates it in his mind, then he forms it with his hands, which is exactly what God does, and since we are made in his image, it makes a whole lot more sense than evolution. You do not understand the Bible because you read it and try to understand it according to your wisdom, it cannot be done, you can only understand the things of God, with the help of God's spirit. Ask him with sincerity, and he will prove his existence to you.

[klott]

Originally Posted by kpierce

How so?

If man came from an Ape, then why are not all Apes men?

[klott]

Kevin,if you want to talk about God, we have all agreed to do it in the Dirty Joke section, we need to take it over there.

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by klott

The Big Bang theory says that everything came into existance all at once, the Bible says the same thing. But to say that everything came from nothing is ridiculous,
And it's not ridiculous to say a supreme being magically created everything?
think about it, everything man does starts with a thought, then he creates it in his mind, then he forms it with his hands, which is exactly what God does, and since we are made in his image, it makes a whole lot more sense than evolution. You do not understand the Bible because you read it and try to understand it according to your wisdom, it cannot be done, you can only understand the things of God, with the help of God's spirit. Ask him with sincerity, and he will prove his existence to you.
Believe it or not, I've tried this at one point in my life to no avail.

.........

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by klott

If man came from an Ape, then why are not all Apes men?

It's people like you who continue to spread the misconception of evolution. No where does it say that man came from apes. It says apes and men have a common ancestor.

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by klott

Kevin,if you want to talk about God, we have all agreed to do it in the Dirty Joke section, we need to take it over there.

We have? Although discussions about religion should be in the joke section, why did this go on for 13 pages?

[mnahrgang]

Originally Posted by kpierce

The opinion of the Pope is irrelevant? The opinion of the 10,000 clergymen that signed that letter is irrelevant? Isn't the Bible written by prophets and their opinions on the way you should live your life? My understanding of religion is that you rely 100% on the opinions given in the Bible. Am I wrong?

Yes I believe you are. The opinions of other people who may or may not be as well informed on a specific subject as I am, are irrelevant to the conclusions that I come to based on my own study. Only those who are patently lazy rely on the opinons of others to base their own opinions upon.

As to the Bible, and your understanding of religion, that you just need to resolve that you have never read it, and have no understanding of it, therefore you should reserve your opinion on it until you become better read.

[mnahrgang]

Originally Posted by kpierce

Far from moot. One's salvation, according to Christianity, very much depends on your adherence to the writings of the Bible. Evolution directly contradicts the Bible.

Once again, your ignorance of the Bible brings you to an incorrect conclusion. Salvation has nothing to do with ones adherence to any writings.

Evolution does not contradict the Bible. That is of course if you are speaking of evolution meaning change within a species. As a matter of fact, much of what it taught in the Bible fits nicely with that. However if you define evolution as man being a form of ape, that is contradictory to good science.

[mnahrgang]

I've had enough of this thread. Much of this has already been hashed over in other threads on this board. If anyone would like to have a serious discussion, please feel free to PM me and I will be more than happy to continue with you off line.

[klott]

Originally Posted by kpierce

It's people like you who continue to spread the misconception of evolution. No where does it say that man came from apes. It says apes and men have a common ancestor.

I have heard that since grammar school, however I'm sure they have adjusted how it reads to strengthen the argument. But I agree that we have a common ancestor,that will be God, who created both of us, he did not pull us from a hat, as in magic. Louis Pasteur's jar of water is still sitting there, waiting for life to come forth from sterilized water, guess what, nothing has happened. How sincere were you and how long did you pray for God to reveal himself to you? It took 5 months of hard prayer with me. But I promise you, he will answer you, but you have to open your ears and mind to hear him.

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by mnahrgang

Yes I believe you are. The opinions of other people who may or may not be as well informed on a specific subject as I am, are irrelevant to the conclusions that I come to based on my own study. Only those who are patently lazy rely on the opinons of others to base their own opinions upon.
So what you are saying is that you study and learn and come to your own conclusions and base your beliefs on the information provided. That's far from what I'm talking about here. I was under the impression that you followed a specific religion.
As to the Bible, and your understanding of religion, that you just need to resolve that you have never read it, and have no understanding of it, therefore you should reserve your opinion on it until you become better read.
I can understand the concept of religion without reading every word of the Bible. What makes you think I have no understanding of the Bible? The teachings of it have been pounded into my head for my whole life.

Since Michael's silence is speaking volumes, what are your thoughts about the Catholic religion accepting evolution?

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by mnahrgang

Evolution does not contradict the Bible.
Wow! You sound like the Pope.
That is of course if you are speaking of evolution meaning change within a species.
Yes, change within a species (natural selection) is one of many parts of the theory.
As a matter of fact, much of what it taught in the Bible fits nicely with that.
What about all the other parts of evolution?
However if you define evolution as man being a form of ape, that is contradictory to good science.
Mark, I thought you were well read in everything to do with evolution and the age of the Earth. If you were, you would clearly understand that no one, except for the religious, says that evolution is defined as man being a form of ape. Shame on you for spreading false facts.

.....