Watch what the Democrats do...

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by jburkeson1

I can tell you this we will not solve our problems using the failed old tired polices & techniques that the Bush Administration has enacted in its pitiful eight year reign.

Says who?
What policies? Congress controled by the enviros stopped meaningful energy policies of the Bush administrations

One thing we know for sure... the oil problem and the energy crisis will not be solved through more drilling. If we directed 1/3 of the resources we are currently pissing away attempting to become an empire through invading & occupying sovereign nations we would not be in this crisis.

Again says who?
Pure B.S. Joe. If Iraq had been allowed to run wild they would likely have a stranglehold on oil supply and potentially even higher prices than now.

There is no easy way out of this if there is a way at all, and there is no quick fix either. It is time to stop electing leaders who manage by crisis and put those folks in power who have a long range outlook and a world view that does not begin and end with the escalation of aggression as the first line of diplomacy.

Sticking our head in the sand and saying drilling known reserves will not help has been the Democratic line since the Carter administration.
I would remind you that extensive diplomatic means including sanctions was tried against Iraq.
The world view that includes-if we just leave them alone ,they will leave us alone has proven a miserable failure over many centuries.

[rmaday]

Mike,

You know I'm all for drilling, but didn't "W" sign an executive order prohibiting off shore drilling?

[William J. Decker]

1) Starting new drilling will not help the supply problem, immediately. Takes time for a new site to start being productive.

2) The ban on offshore drilling has also been a bad on offshore exploration. It is known that there are some substantial off shore deposits (and not just oil, but also natural gas) but the total number of these reserves and their size is not completely known. The exact extent and size of the ANWAR deposits is noty known.

3) Once exporation is done (which can be done very quickly) and the extent of the reserves is known, this WILL help to stop the rampet speculation that has been going on. This will cause an immediate, good result.

4) Remember, oil companies do not set the price of oil. That is set on the global market, where suppliers and buyers, from all over the world, bid on oil that has not even been produced yet. The price is set:

• Well in advance. They are currently bidding on oil that will be produced in August and September, and won't be gas in your tank until December of January.
• Based upon how much oil is being produced. The supplier countries set, through OPEC, determine (using a number of factors, including how much they want to screw the world) how much oil will actually be taken out of the ground and put on the market.
• By buyers, who try to anticipate their companies (or countries) needs in the future. If they messed up and need to cover a shortage, of they anticipate a future shortage in supply, they buy more, and have to bid higher against others. Prices go up.
• There are oil brokers, those not buying oil for their own use, but to hold the contract and hope that the price will go up. They buy a futures option, say for December, at $130 / bl., and hope that by December, the price will be $150 / bl. They then get the oil and sell it to someone else and make $20 / bl. These are the real speculators.
• Different countries want to screw with us, or other countries. Chavez owns the state oil company in Venesula. He can (and has) manipulated the price as a way to "punish" the U.S.
• Remember, we only get a little less than 14% of our oil from the Middle East. Most comes from Canada, with a little from Mexico and Venesula.
• We could put oil shale production on line in a little over a year. The shale is there and the production facilites are al ready in place, but their production was stopped (some years ago) when a) oil prices went down and b) the Sierra Club shut them down.
• What some congressional members call "huge profits" are not calculated like most people calculate profits (Revenue - costs) and do not include many of the costs that the oil companies incure. Remember, Congress has "investigated" the oil companies about 12 times, since 1977, and have NEVER found any illegality, problems or gouging. The loud calls for investigation always get heavily publicized, but the results of the investigation, you never hear about it. It serves the purposes of some people to call out blame, even when they know that what they are claiming is not true. Besides, it sells newspapers and helps get one re-elected.
• BTW: Based upon national averages, 8 cents per gallon of gas is oil company profits (i.e. paying the cost of the gas to be obtained, refined and delivered to the station) while the various governments (feds, state, county and local) get about 14 cents per gallon. Who is gouging us?
• Market forces, which always control these things, will work this out. how quickly they do will be based upon how much Congress and the Government messes with it. Let the market work, because no matter what you do, it will always work.

Hope this helps;

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rmaday

Mike,

You know I'm all for drilling, but didn't "W" sign an executive order prohibiting off shore drilling?

His Daddy did.

The Congressional moratorium was first enacted in 1982, and has been renewed every year since. It prohibits oil and gas leasing on most of the outer continental shelf, 3 miles to 200 miles offshore. Since 1990, it has been supplemented by the first President Bush’s executive order, which directed the Interior Department not to conduct offshore leasing or preleasing activity in areas covered by the legislative ban until 2000. In 1998, President Bill Clinton extended the offshore leasing prohibition until 2012.

[rmaday]

Originally Posted by mlarson

His Daddy did.

Thanks for the clarification.

[Joseph Burkeson, CMI]

Bush-McCain Energy Plan: Wrong on National Security; Wrong on Economic Security

June 18, 2008


According to media reports, Senator McCain will address the "national security implications of the country's reliance on foreign energy" today in Springfield, Missouri. What McCain won't say, however, is that his insistence on pandering to his friends in Big Oil by recycling the same old failed Bush policies will do nothing to make American more secure or end America's dependence on foreign oil. Not only has Senator McCain repeatedly voted against renewable energy and green jobs, but his "new" plan calls for expanding offshore oil drilling, protecting his friends in Big Oil from a windfall profits tax, and giving them a new gas tax holiday that won't reduce the price of gas. Meanwhile, his support for President Bush on the war in Iraq has helped make the Middle East less stable, which in turn has contributed to soaring oil prices.

Now, President Bush is helping push McCain's offshore drilling plan later today. [Associated Press, 6/17/08]

"After admitting he doesn't understand the economy, Senator McCain is now trying to pass off failed Bush policies that have undermined America's energy security, our national security and our economy as his 'new' approach to energy independence," said Democratic National Committee Communications Director Karen Finney. "Marching in lockstep on President Bush's failed Iraq policy, his willingness to keep our troops there for 100 years, and his votes against renewable energy all show that Senator McCain is committed to keeping America on a dangerous path that will cost American jobs, drive energy prices even higher, and do nothing to make America safer or less dependent on foreign oil."

BUSH-MCCAIN POLICIES HAVE DESTABILIZED MIDDLE EAST...

American Policies Have Destabilized Iraq and Emboldened Anti-Western forces from Iran to Lebanon, Argue Israeli Security Experts.
"After years of supporting the Bush administration's policy in the Middle East, a growing number of Israelis are openly criticizing the United States for creating more, not less, danger for Israel. Israeli experts contend that American policies have destabilized Iraq, emboldened anti-Western forces from Iran to Lebanon and paved the way for militant Islamists to gain control of the Palestinian Authority. 'The threats to Middle East security and stability worsened in 2006,' experts at Tel Aviv University's Jaffee Center for Strategic Studies recently warned. 'The American failure in Iraq has hurt the standing of the U.S. in the Middle East.'" [McClatchy/Knight Ridder, 1/12/07]

REGIONAL INSTABILITY DRIVES UP OIL PRICES...

Analyst: Regional Tensions Add $10 to $15 "Security Premium" to Per Barrel Price of Oil. "It has taken more than a quarter-century, but oil prices are once again approaching that level. And once again, saber-rattling between the U.S. and Iran is a significant factor. 'The current high prices have a 'back to the future' quality to them,' says oil historian Dan Yergin, chairman of Cambridge Energy Research Associates. He figures geopolitical tension in the Middle East adds a $10 or $15 security premium' to every barrel of oil. 'What the security premium reflects is a sense of uncertainty whether geopolitical events will lead to some kind of disruption that shuts off supply,' Yergin said. 'The security premium really reflects the fear of the unknown.'" [NPR, 11/12/07: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=16219677]

Iran Threat Drives Up Price of Oil. Oil prices shot up nearly $11 a barrel and settled Friday at a record $138.54 on geopolitical jitters, a dollar decline and a forecast that oil would hit $150 by July 4…Deputy Prime Minister Shaul Mofaz told Yediot Ahronot, Israel's largest mass-circulation daily that 'If Iran continues its program to develop nuclear weapons, we will attack it.' Mofaz's comments mean the return of the 'Iran risk premium,' said analyst Antoine Halff in a research report released Friday. While the market's reaction 'seems overplayed,' Halff said, the minister's remarks remind traders that 'the dispute over Iran's nuclear program remains unresolved and that the risks of military confrontation are indeed increasing.' 'This will likely be a growing source of market volatility until a solution to the dispute is found," he added." [CNN Money, 6/6/08: http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/06/news/economy/gas_prices/index.htm?cnn=yes]

MCCAIN REVERSES HIMSELF TO PANDER TO BIG OIL...

McCain Called For Lifting The Federal Moratorium On Offshore Drilling. "We have proven oil reserves of at least 21 billion barrels in the United States. But a broad federal moratorium stands in the way of energy exploration and production. And I believe it is time for the federal government to lift these restrictions and to put our own reserves to use."

• FLASHBACK: McCain Supports The Current Moratorium On Oil Drilling. "In response to a query of the candidates, Gore and Bradley promised to support the existing moratorium, in addition to opposing the leases. Both also say they will work with the seven oil companies holding leases to find alternatives to drilling. That could mean canceling the leases, or buying out the companies in a deal like the one that secured the Headwaters Forest. McCain supports the current moratorium, but hasn't decided on the pending leases. Steve Forbes hasn't replied to questions about oil drilling." [Ventura County Star, 11/15/99]

McCain Opposes Windfall Profits Tax For Oil Companies. "And now he supports new taxes on energy producers. He wants a windfall profits tax on oil, to go along with the new taxes he also plans for coal and natural gas. If the plan sounds familiar, it's because that was President Jimmy Carter's big idea too - and a lot of good it did us." [Excerpts of Remarks Prepared for Delivery, Houston, TX, 6/17/08]

• FLASHBACK TO LAST MONTH: McCain Said He Was Open to Windfall Profits Tax. "I don't like obscene profits being made anywhere-and I'd be glad to look not just at the windfall profits tax-that's not what bothers me-but we should look at any incentives that we are giving to people, that or industries or corporations that are distorting the market." [CNN Live Feed, Town Hall (Charlotte, NC), 5/5/08: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FP8eDdVzy9s]

FactCheck.org: McCain Gas Tax Holiday Will Not Drive Prices Down; Would "Give Federal Funds To Oil Refineries." "But economists say that the proposal is unlikely to actually lower the price of gasoline. McCain's plan would essentially give federal funds to oil refineries… But the nonpartisan American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials estimates that the total savings for the average American motorist works out to about $28; for a two-car household, that would be $54. That's IF prices actually dropped 18.4 cents per gallon. However, there's every indication that they wouldn't. Here's why: According to the basic principles of supply and demand, cutting the price of an item causes people to buy more of it. That's why stores put items on sale. But when something is priced too low, consumers will buy it faster than it can be manufactured, which leads to shortages. [Factcheck.org, 5/2/08: http://www.factcheck.org/gas_price_fixes_that_wont.html]

MCCAIN OPPOSED INCENTIVES FOR RENEWABLE ENERGY...

McCain Repeatedly Voted Against Tax Credits For Renewable Energy Production. McCain voted against several amendments aimed at encouraging renewable energy production. [2006 Senate Vote #42, 3/14/2006; 2005 Senate Vote #158, 6/28/2005; 2001 Senate Vote #125, 5/21/2001]

McCain Opposed $290 Million For R&D On Renewable Energy, Including Wind Power. McCain voted against an amendment to extend the renewable energy production tax credit and clean renewable energy bonds programs for four years including $290 Million for renewable energy R&D on Solar, wind, geothermal, biomass, hydropower. [2006 Senate Vote #42, 3/14/2006]

McCain Cast Deciding Vote to Cut Funding For the Rural Renewable Energy and Energy Efficiency Program From $23 Million To $3 Million. McCain voted for a motion to concur in the House amendment with the Senate amendment on the bill that made changes to programs for a net savings of $39.7 billion over five years. [2005 Senate Vote #363, 12/21/2005]

McCain Repeatedly Voted Against Tax Credits For Renewable Energy Production. McCain voted against several amendments aimed at encouraging renewable energy production. [2006 Senate Vote #42, 3/14/2006; 2005 Senate Vote #158, 6/28/2005; 2001 Senate Vote #125, 5/21/2001]

McCain Voted Repeatedly Against Establishing National Renewable Energy Standards. McCain voted against an amendment that would mandate that renewable energy sources must produce at least 10 percent of the electricity sold by electric utilities by 2020, a minimum of 2.5 percent must be produced beginning 2008 through 2011. [2005 Senate Vote #141, 6/16/2005; 2002 Senate Vote #50, 3/14/2002; 2002 Senate Vote #55, 3/21/2002; 2002 Senate Vote #59, 3/21/2002]

...AND GREEN JOBS.

Renewable Energy Tax Credit Extension Worth 116,000 Jobs Per Year. A 2008 economic study by Navigant Consulting finds that "over 116,000 U.S. jobs and nearly $19 billion in U.S. investment could be lost in just one year if renewable energy tax credits are not renewed by Congress, according to preliminary results released today by the American Wind Energy Association and the Solar Energy Industries Association. The study finds that over 76,000 jobs are put at risk in the wind industry, and approximately 40,000 jobs in the solar industry. The states that could lose the most jobs include: Texas, Colorado, Illinois, Oregon, Minnesota, Washington, Iowa, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, and California. The lion's share of these states would lose more than 1,000 jobs." [AWEA Press Release, 2/4/2008]

McCain Missed Key Votes On Extending Renewable Energy Tax Credits. McCain missed numerous votes in 2007 and 2008 on tax credits for renewable energy, due to his busy campaign schedule. Several of the votes he missed on extending existing tax credits failed by just a few votes. [2007 Senate Vote #98, 3/22/2007; 2007 Senate Vote #223, 6/21/2007; 2007 Senate Vote #416, 12/7/2007; 2008 Senate Vote #8, 2/6/2008]

But McCain did vote in favor of invading Iraq and has stated categorically that the United States may need to spend 100 years occupying Iraq.

[rmaday]

Worth repeating

Originally Posted by jburkeson1

McCain Called For Lifting The Federal Moratorium On Offshore Drilling. "We have proven oil reserves of at least 21 billion barrels in the United States. But a broad federal moratorium stands in the way of energy exploration and production. And I believe it is time for the federal government to lift these restrictions and to put our own reserves to use."

[Joseph Burkeson, CMI]

Originally Posted by rmaday

Worth repeating

The quote you used was part of a pair and you forgot the other half which really tells the tale.

McCain Called For Lifting The Federal Moratorium On Offshore Drilling. "We have proven oil reserves of at least 21 billion barrels in the United States. But a broad federal moratorium stands in the way of energy exploration and production. And I believe it is time for the federal government to lift these restrictions and to put our own reserves to use."

• FLASHBACK: McCain Supports The Current Moratorium On Oil Drilling. "In response to a query of the candidates, Gore and Bradley promised to support the existing moratorium, in addition to opposing the leases. Both also say they will work with the seven oil companies holding leases to find alternatives to drilling. That could mean canceling the leases, or buying out the companies in a deal like the one that secured the Headwaters Forest. McCain supports the current moratorium, but hasn't decided on the pending leases. Steve Forbes hasn't replied to questions about oil drilling." [Ventura County Star, 11/15/99]

[Michael Larson]

Reminder of "messiah" Obama's energy plan.

Tax the oil companies.

No understanding of reality. They truly are the party that loves to tax and spend while telling us that they are doing us a favor.

[rmaday]

Originally Posted by jburkeson1

The quote you used was part of a pair and you forgot the other half which really tells the tale.

Sorry, Joe I was trying to stick with quotes from the last 8 years. His opinions from 1999 just missed the cut.
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[Ventura County Star, 11/15/99]

[Joseph Burkeson, CMI]

Originally Posted by rmaday

Sorry, Joe I was trying to stick with quotes from the last 8 years. His opinions from 1999 just missed the cut.

Oh, I get it now... Flip-flopping on the issues is acceptable only if you are a Republican, thing is it really doesn't matter you see as McSame (like your narrowed scope of facts) will too likely make the cut when it comes to a long term stay sitting in the big chair at the White House during the next four years.

[nwagner]

Originally Posted by klott

now, when the President tries to make the situation better here. just so you know obama is fighting it too.

Umm, its pretty obvious this is nothing more than a thinly veiled political ploy to villianize the Demorats ...

Bush said that if congressional leaders head home for their July 4 recess without taking action, they will need to explain why "$4 a gallon gasoline is not enough incentive for them to act. And Americans will rightly ask how high gas prices have to rise before the Democratic-controlled Congress will do something about it."

Proof positive that the Big Oil lap dog President merely wants to deflect blame away from those that profit madly off of gouging us ...

What the president now proposes would rescind his father's decision — but the president took the position that Congress has to act first and then he would follow behind.

[nwagner]

Michael, is this true?

Originally Posted by Sen. Harry Reid

"The math is simple: America has just three percent of the world's oil reserves, but Americans use a quarter of its oil."

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by jburkeson1

Oh, I get it now... Flip-flopping on the issues is acceptable only if you are a Republican,

You want flip flops, we got your flip flops.

Top Obama Flip Flops

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by nwagner

Umm, its pretty obvious this is nothing more than a thinly veiled political ploy to villianize the Demorats ...

Some people earn their villain status.


Proof positive that the Big Oil lap dog President merely wants to deflect blame away from those that profit madly off of gouging us ...

More B.S. Nick. Please go and research "big oils" return on investment.
It's not what you may think it is.