First Fundamentals Course Available In Washington State

[hmiller]

Originally Posted by ssmith

Rhonda Meyers, State of Washington home inspector licensing manager, announced on Wednesday that the Fundamentals of Home Inspection course offered by Bellingham Technical College has received conditional approval. That means this course will be accepted by, and will meet, the state's requirements for 120 classroom hours of approved education. The course will, also, include a final (fourth) week which allows students to meet the field training requirements of the law. The first scheduled four week class will begin May 18, 2009. You can visit the BTC website for more information.

http://www.btc.ctc.edu/DegreesCertif...asp?Program=63

Steven
Let me be one the first in this long thread to actually congratulate you for your involvement in the first and only school who has been recognized by the state to provide this training which will be vital to many inspectors.

I have alot of respect for folks like yourself that make the sacrifice of teaching or being on the HI board, as there is little compensation for your time, effort, and all the moaning and groaning you endure....just like in many of the previous posts on this thread.

I am sure there are people that would complain if BTC put together a course, drove out to their house, and taught them for free....... Complaints would likely range from "You woke me up too early" to "This is not a good time, I have to manage all my posts on the I-NACHI board."

Keep up the good work and don't let these part time inspectors get you down.

[Steven C. Meyer]

THE REAL AGENDA HAS BEEN ACHIEVED IN WASHINGTON STATE


As I see it, now to qualify for a license and obtain one costs:

120 hours of a "approved class" $3,500
Firsrt time license 650 (+ or-)
(fee to be reduced in future years.
Probably as fast as property taxes
have decreased on the lower value of
our homes!!)

Other fees unknown
comes to 4,150

That's just for starters!! If that is not enough to discourage the next generation of inspectors, let us also add in business costs of:

That new truck $25,000
(after all, you have to look the part
of being sucessful)
Tools, computer, office furniture, misc
business supplies. 3,000.00 (probably
more)
Insurance (unless you are collection
proof) 2,000.00 (+ or-)

Total, just for starters 34,100

On top of that, add in marketing costs, advertising costs, and enough "cash on hand" to support yourself while you build up a viable business, you're talking real money here!

What the licensing junkies could't do throu competing in a free market place, they have managed to do by pricing out new competition.

"Protecting the consumer" and "asssuring quality inspections", was just the cover story, a smoke screen, and only serves to "protect" their own turf and position in the market place.

YOU WIN!!! FREE ENTERPRISE IS DEAD!!!

May I suggest, if any of you new guys have that kind of money hanging around, there are plenty of repo and/or distressed houses out there to buy, and you can do your "own inspection".

On a cost/benefit basis, might be a better use of available funds!!

And they asy Bernie Madoff fleeced people!!!???? Move over Bernie, you have new competition.

[Steven C. Meyer]

Steven L. Smith

Can you explain and/or justify the $3,500 cost for this 3 week course?

You state the course is "offered" by BTC.

BTC, like all tech colleges is government supported and very affordable to the average student.

Currently, it costs at LWTC, $800 per quarter, therefore a 2 year degree will be a total cost of $4,800. (plus books, etc) One summer class at UW, cost $800, and that's a full fledged university.

And a 3 week "home inspection" course costs $3,500??!! Taught by who? Certified and tenured professors?

Kindly explain and enlighten me, as to "price"/"cost" basis that this course was priced on. I seems quite high, in that a full time student, taking a full load of classes per quarter, that amount would pay two thirds of his 2 years of tuition, with a few hundered dollars left over to pay for books.

What, if any, is the relationship between the school and those "putting" this course together?

On a per class cost basis, this makes UW seem a real bargin.

[Steven L. Smith]

Steven,

I have no clue how it could be offered any cheaper. It is, again, a four week course and it goes eight hours a day. Read what I said above about it being four weeks and not three. It meets the field training requirements too. This fulfills all requirements of the state, except the tests, plus it prepares students to pass the WDO test. And, in a more practical sense, it prepares them to work in the real world.

Everyone teaching the course is a working inspector. Any one of us, on the days we teach, would make more if we took a single condo inspection. There are four of us. The Carson Dunlop Principles books are part of the course, they get all of them and at the cost of those books, take more than $1000 off the $3,500. If students already have the books, we have deducted them from their fees.

The cost is set by the school, not me. They have to pay for the class room, computer services, etc. I took the course myself years back, as did every other instructor. I can tell you I thought it was very reasonable after I also found out how intense it is. It is 8 hours a day, five days a week for four weeks. We have never had a student, who actually took the course and realized how intense it is, complain about the cost and the student reviews have always been exceptional.

However, if you believe that the course is too expensive -- I suggest that you put one together and compete. Anyone can apply with the state to run a course, you just have to meet all of the state guidelines and they are not tiny. If you have not read them, then do so. They are online at the DOL website.

We have run this course for 15 years. It took me, with an existing course that was proven, a month working with the other instructors to get it ready to be submitted and, even with that, there are some other things we have to adjust to meet the rules.

I suggest that those who feel the class is too expensive plan to get their own program approved. There is no rule that private operators cannot apply to run programs. It all comes down to the material, curriculum, etc.........go for it.

[David E. Helm]

I can only back up what Steve said. In my opinion, $3500 is a bargain. You not only get the books, but with real working inspectors teaching the course you get a lot of first hand inspection knowledge. The fourth week full inspections, with reports make the cost of the course tiny. The four instructors do get paid, but as Steve said, doing inspections on the days of teaching would make way more money. We all do it because we care.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by dhelm

I can only back up what Steve said. In my opinion, $3500 is a bargain. You not only get the books, but with real working inspectors teaching the course you get a lot of first hand inspection knowledge. The fourth week full inspections, with reports make the cost of the course tiny. The four instructors do get paid, but as Steve said, doing inspections on the days of teaching would make way more money. We all do it because we care.

No offense.....but the State of Washington has required state licensed educators long, long before state licensed home inspectors.

It seems that the argument that O'Handjob and others made for controlling their market with a licensing law is going to apply here, as well....since any Tom, Dick or Harry home inspector can hang a sign in the window and simply call himself "a teacher" and be paid as one.

Don't take it personal, guys. The proponents of your foolish law started it with their argument for licensing.....and now have circumvented their own logic by allowing unlicensed and uncredentialled educators to be a step toward licensing.

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by Steven C. Meyer

I tried, my antique computer would not respond.

Thanks for the info!!

Your prior post had it at 4,500. Just wanted to confirm the the price, before I commented on the outragious price.

CHEERS

Yeah, looks like it's 3,500 for the class, 680 for the license and 300 for the test........plus gas and lodging.

[kpierce]

Originally Posted by Steven C. Meyer

PSS: are you going to take the course???

I doubt the Bellingham one. I live 2 1/2 hours away. Hopefully, a college closer will jump on board. I have until July 2010 though.

[Steven C. Meyer]

Originally Posted by kpierce

yeah, looks like it's 3,500 for the class, 680 for the license and 300 for the test........plus gas and lodging.

pennies over the life of the product!!!

[Steven C. Meyer]

Originally Posted by kpierce

I doubt the Bellingham one. I live 2 1/2 hours away. Hopefully, a college closer will jump on board. I have until July 2010 though.

What's a couple of hours??? And doesn't this price include motel and food?

I would have a 2 hour flight, plus car rental, and the drive from Sea tac! Would be a tough commute. If I submit to this, will have to wait till summer.

Take care!!

[Steven C. Meyer]

Originally Posted by dhelm

I can only back up what Steve said. In my opinion, $3500 is a bargain. You not only get the books, but with real working inspectors teaching the course you get a lot of first hand inspection knowledge. The fourth week full inspections, with reports make the cost of the course tiny. The four instructors do get paid, but as Steve said, doing inspections on the days of teaching would make way more money. We all do it because we care.

A BARGIN??? If you are married, hope your wife does not let you do the shopping. BTW, I have a bridge I would like to get rid of, call 800 U sucker.

[Steven L. Smith]

James,

If you read the education guidelines, you will see that any Tom, Dick and Harry might be able to apply for a course, but that Tom, Dick or Harry is going to have to spend a substantial amount of time and dollars getting a curriculum that the state will approve. Heck, our class has been around 15 years and, believe me or not, it is a darn good class. Yet there are parts of our class that are having to be adjusted to meet the strict guidelines. I believe that is the reason that, so far, nobody else has submitted a class. The work is onerous. I know because I had to restructure an existing class and that took a really long time. Had I been required to start at zero, I would not have even given it a try. Also, I think if you knew Mike you would probably not call him by that name. Whether you like him or not, he is a very hard worker.

In your last sentence are you saying that you think those teaching the class ought to be certified teachers? For the record, that is not required at the college level. In law schools, medical schools, journalism schools, often the instructors are those from the industry. I find it hard to imagine that an inspector would prefer to have a class taught by a teacher than working professionals.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by ssmith

James,

If you read the education guidelines, you will see that any Tom, Dick and Harry might be able to apply for a course, but that Tom, Dick or Harry is going to have to spend a substantial amount of time and dollars getting a curriculum that the state will approve. Heck, our class has been around 15 years and, believe me or not, it is a darn good class. Yet there are parts of our class that are having to be adjusted to meet the strict guidelines. I believe that is the reason that, so far, nobody else has submitted a class. The work is onerous. I know because I had to restructure an existing class and that took a really long time. Had I been required to start at zero, I would not have even given it a try. Also, I think if you knew Mike you would probably not call him by that name. Whether you like him or not, he is a very hard worker.

Mike's a loser who numbers himself with a few others who can't compete without the help of his state government....but that's an entirely different point, all together.

Whatever hoops the licensing board is making you jump through....a kindergarten student in the State of Washington will be taught how to tie his shoes by a higher credentialed educator than a licensed home inspector will have had in your course.

The Process for Washington Teacher Certification

The process to obtain a Residency Certificate is relatively straightforward. To obtain a Residency Certificate, an individual must:

• Earn a Bachelor's degree or higher in an area of endorsement form a regionally accredited college or university.
• Complete a state-approved teacher preparation program at a regionally accredited college or university. The program must include teaching methodology and internship.

[Steven C. Meyer]

Originally Posted by ssmith

Steven,

I have no clue how it could be offered any cheaper. It is, again, a four week course and it goes eight hours a day. Read what I said above about it being four weeks and not three. It meets the field training requirements too. This fulfills all requirements of the state, except the tests, plus it prepares students to pass the WDO test. And, in a more practical sense, it prepares them to work in the real world.

Everyone teaching the course is a working inspector. Any one of us, on the days we teach, would make more if we took a single condo inspection. There are four of us. The Carson Dunlop Principles books are part of the course, they get all of them and at the cost of those books, take more than $1000 off the $3,500. If students already have the books, we have deducted them from their fees.

The cost is set by the school, not me. They have to pay for the class room, computer services, etc. I took the course myself years back, as did every other instructor. I can tell you I thought it was very reasonable after I also found out how intense it is. It is 8 hours a day, five days a week for four weeks. We have never had a student, who actually took the course and realized how intense it is, complain about the cost and the student reviews have always been exceptional.

However, if you believe that the course is too expensive -- I suggest that you put one together and compete. Anyone can apply with the state to run a course, you just have to meet all of the state guidelines and they are not tiny. If you have not read them, then do so. They are online at the DOL website.

We have run this course for 15 years. It took me, with an existing course that was proven, a month working with the other instructors to get it ready to be submitted and, even with that, there are some other things we have to adjust to meet the rules.

I suggest that those who feel the class is too expensive plan to get their own program approved. There is no rule that private operators cannot apply to run programs. It all comes down to the material, curriculum, etc.........go for it.

It is obvious a Private operator has found a easy way to sell its wares, make it manditory. $1,000 for what in reality is a "text book" is outragious! And BTC fell for this, the promotion of a private, for profit, education useing, taxpayer funded facilities, talk about a double hit! My tax dollars
again mis spent! BTC, like all tech colleges are tax payer supported, and now they are in the "resale" business,and not
for the benefit of the students!

So, we now know that the "text book" is $1,000. that still leaves $2,500 unaccounted for. Is it "room rent", "salaries",
"profit margin" for the school.

To help me with this accounting, just how many paying students do you project per class schedule??

No offence to you. Steven, you and others are entitled to a fair price for your time as are all teachers at BTC. But even being a 4 week course, at a net of 2,500 after book price, does not compute to the costs of other course offerings.

As always: FOLLOW THE MONEY

[Steven C. Meyer]

jAMES

Thankyou for finding that Washington teachers certificate info. I thought Steven was wrong, but now you validated my opinion.

A bachelors degree, at a minimum, is required of teachers (full or "part time") in this state. My self, with an advanced degree from out of state, am not elegiable. My sister, years ago, came to Wa. state, and with 10+ years in the San Diego school distric, and a masters in education, did not meet the "standards" of Washington State.

With no offense to Steven et al, I do question their qualifaction (state rules) to teach. It could be that this course is NOT an accredited course at BTC, in other words, can not apply toward a degree.

Won't touch the Mike O debate. Think my opinion of the licensing push by Mike O is well known!@