I found something very strange in the FL HI licensing law.

[Joseph Burkeson, CMI]

Originally Posted by jfarsetta

This says it all...

Chaos is our friend.

[Gary Farnsworth]

Licensing solves nothing. Only adds to the chaos.

Laws are put into play by people for their own benefit, and for the benefit only of their "special interest groups", friends, pocketbooks, and campaign coffers.

Attorneys add to the confusion, by putting in laws language that will cause lawsuits so they can make money. Insurance companies make money off of the insurance. Board members make the money because they get reimbursed for "expenses". Associations make money off of the educational requirements. Inspectors are having to raise rates due to these expenses, and causing home buyers not to get home inspections. Contractors are doing them for free, and reaping the benefits of the repairs, needed or not. We, and the consumers, lose. ASHI is already in Washington presenting ideas to the feds, and are already controlling their own interests in vertually every state. ASHI members are paying for this to happen. These things are all huge conflicts of interest.

[Douglas Wall]

YOU ARE AN IDIOT, DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT AND HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE IN THIS BUISINESS. PEOPLE LIKE YOU IN THIS INDUSTRY ARE DESTROYING IT. I HOPE YOU DIE SOON.
There are no inspections that can be completed in 30 minutes you MORON.

Now that's the way to start your day
Beautiful day here in South Florida, to much work, to little time, when will it let up.
Gotta go, have fun ya'll

[John Cahill]

Originally Posted by bhoagland

YOU ARE AN IDIOT, DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT AND HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE IN THIS BUISINESS. PEOPLE LIKE YOU IN THIS INDUSTRY ARE DESTROYING IT. I HOPE YOU DIE SOON.
There are no inspections that can be completed in 30 minutes you MORON.

Any experienced inspector on this forum can discover patent material defects in 30 minutes. I do these inspections by request often.

Your temper may be your undoing. An inspector cannot last in this business with that attitude. You could be disciplined by Florida regulatory authorities and kicked out of INACHI for that post.

I suspect there is something deeper inside bothering you. If I can be of any help email me and I will share my cell number.

Peace be with you

[Brian C. Hoagland]

Originally Posted by jcahill

Any experienced inspector on this forum can discover patent material defects in 30 minutes. I do these inspections by request often.

Your temper may be your undoing. An inspector cannot last in this business with that attitude. You could be disciplined by Florida regulatory authorities and kicked out of INACHI for that post.

I suspect there is something deeper inside bothering you. If I can be of any help email me and I will share my cell number.

Peace be with you

I apologize for the die comment, I didn't mean it. The job isn't to find some patent defects it is to identify all the defects. Just because you locate or describe a roof leak it isn't sufficient unless you have found all roof leaks. The SOP's exist not because the inspectors made them up but because the public demands these standards and expects a minimum standard of performance be defined.
This crap that has been spewed regarding the time it takes by inspectors on this board is utter nonsense. It takes as long as it takes to be confident that all deficiencies in the major components functionality are uncovered. $100.00 half hour inspections can't accomplish that goal and fail to meet any standard. This is why I lose my temper about this, clients will be dissattisfied leading to more legislation and governmental intervention. We are being legislated here in Fl. not due to the wishes of any association but due to several high profile court cases where poor inspections were done. I hope you accept my apology, sincerely.

[John Cahill]

Originally Posted by bhoagland

I apologize for the die comment, I didn't mean it. The job isn't to find some patent defects it is to identify all the defects. Just because you locate or describe a roof leak it isn't sufficient unless you have found all roof leaks. The SOP's exist not because the inspectors made them up but because the public demands these standards and expects a minimum standard of performance be defined.
This crap that has been spewed regarding the time it takes by inspectors on this board is utter nonsense. It takes as long as it takes to be confident that all deficiencies in the major components functionality are uncovered. $100.00 half hour inspections can't accomplish that goal and fail to meet any standard. This is why I lose my temper about this, clients will be dissattisfied leading to more legislation and governmental intervention. We are being legislated here in Fl. not due to the wishes of any association but due to several high profile court cases where poor inspections were done. I hope you accept my apology, sincerely.

Apology fully accepted. Don't think a thing about it. Delete the post if desired. I have been known for a rant or two myself.

A conflict that may be bugging you is the belief the purpose of the inspection is to find all the defects. Following is the INACHI SOP

1.1. A Home Inspection is a non-invasive, visual examination of a residential dwelling, performed for a fee, which is designed to identify observed material defects within specific components of said dwelling. Components may include any combination of mechanical, structural, electrical, plumbing, or other essential systems or portions of the home, as identified and agreed to by the Client and Inspector, prior to the inspection process.

I. A home inspection is intended to assist in evaluation of the overall condition of the dwelling. The inspection is based on observation of the visible and apparent condition of the structure and its components on the date of the inspection, and not the prediction of future conditions.

II. A home inspection will not reveal every concern that exists or ever could exist, but only those material defects observed on the day of the inspection.

III. A home inspection can include a survey and/or analysis of energy flows and usage in a residential property if the client requests it.

1.2. A Material Defect is a condition of a residential real property, or any portion of it, that would have a significant, adverse impact on the value of the real property, or that involves an unreasonable risk to people on the property. The fact that a structural element, system or subsystem is near, at or beyond the end of the normal useful life of such a structural element, system or subsystem is not by itself a material defect.

Still a MORON?

My guess is you have worked hard in this business for many years. You have become experienced and educated. The problem is the better you become the less marketable you are. Instead of building referrals your loosing them to the guys who do major defect inspections for less money. The foundation is OK but the roof is shot, then refer the roof to their brother who kicks them back $500 under the table. That is my whole point. You cannot beat these guys. You have to learn how to do it ethically.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by bhoagland

I apologize for the die comment, I didn't mean it. The job isn't to find some patent defects it is to identify all the defects. Just because you locate or describe a roof leak it isn't sufficient unless you have found all roof leaks. The SOP's exist not because the inspectors made them up but because the public demands these standards and expects a minimum standard of performance be defined.
This crap that has been spewed regarding the time it takes by inspectors on this board is utter nonsense. It takes as long as it takes to be confident that all deficiencies in the major components functionality are uncovered. $100.00 half hour inspections can't accomplish that goal and fail to meet any standard. This is why I lose my temper about this, clients will be dissattisfied leading to more legislation and governmental intervention. We are being legislated here in Fl. not due to the wishes of any association but due to several high profile court cases where poor inspections were done. I hope you accept my apology, sincerely.

There is no other way of saying this...and it is certain to condemn me to an early death.....but you are very, very wrong.

First, it is sufficient to report that the roof leaks. From exactly where and from how many points of entry is not only unnecessary (for the roofer will take it from here) but usually impossible for a non-invasive inspection to detect on many flat or metal roofs.

Second, the SOP is not a minimum standard. It is an industry standard. It is how what we do is defined in advance for our clients and upon which we base our fees and our liability. You either comply with it, or you do not.

[Bob Elliott]

Mr Cahill
I hope your business model works for you but I sure as He-l will never operate that way.
If a client that knows nothing about the trades ,is a first time buyer, and called you for expertise gets nothing but a major componant check list you have cheated them out of several hundred dollars so you can do your 4 Inspections a day.
If the Furnace is 25 years old and functioning it is your obligation to let them know either in the report or verbally for all i care that they may need to buy a new one in the near future and should plan their funds accordingly.
I do not need any SOP to tell me that is morally what should be done.
I nspectors can sell all the flyby, drive through,run past inspections they want but i will not join them in helping to ruin the entire industry for their own personal gain.
This is what certain A-ho-es did to major corporations just before they bailed out with a golden parachute.
This type of thinking is Piranha,slash and burn approach of someone that wishes to squeeze the life out of the industry and leave the people behind to clean up the mess.

Opps never mind.

[John Cahill]

Originally Posted by belliott

Mr Cahill
I hope your business model works for you but I sure as He-l will never operate that way.
If a client that knows nothing about the trades ,is a first time buyer, and called you for expertise gets nothing but a major componant check list you have cheated them out of several hundred dollars so you can do your 4 Inspections a day.
If the Furnace is 25 years old and functioning it is your obligation to let them know either in the report or verbally for all i care that they may need to buy a new one in the near future and should plan their funds accordingly.
I do not need any SOP to tell me that is morally what should be done.
I nspectors can sell all the flyby, drive through,run past inspections they want but i will not join them in helping to ruin the entire industry for their own personal gain.
This is what certain A-ho-es did to major corporations just before they bailed out with a golden parachute.
This type of thinking is Piranha,slash and burn approach of someone that wishes to squeeze the life out of the industry and leave the people behind to clean up the mess.

Opps never mind.

Well I have decided to be polite even though I've been told to die, called a moron and now maybe a toothy fish. I modifed my first mean spirited reply. Best regards Robert.

[Michael Larson]

I suggest Mr. Cahill show us how it is done on NACHI TV.

[John Cahill]

Originally Posted by mlarson

I suggest Mr. Cahill show us how it is done on NACHI TV.

No Problemo Send the film crew Nick. Uh if I do the show do I get the dough?

[rstrahan]

Originally Posted by belliott

Mr Cahill
I hope your business model works for you but I sure as He-l will never operate that way.
If a client that knows nothing about the trades ,is a first time buyer, and called you for expertise gets nothing but a major componant check list you have cheated them out of several hundred dollars so you can do your 4 Inspections a day.
If the Furnace is 25 years old and functioning it is your obligation to let them know either in the report or verbally for all i care that they may need to buy a new one in the near future and should plan their funds accordingly.
I do not need any SOP to tell me that is morally what should be done.
I nspectors can sell all the flyby, drive through,run past inspections they want but i will not join them in helping to ruin the entire industry for their own personal gain...

yada

....

Mr. Elliot,

That post is patently ridiculous.

You are a noob who has no idea who is talking to. Cahill is a pillar of this business. He WROTE the earliest ethics requirements in the country. Twice. I guarantee he was doing HI before you ever heard of it. He has already done more inspections than you AND I will ever do. John has no need of your advice (or mine).

Cahill is not advocating an ethic. He is simply telling you the truth in terms very few can. His only fault is venturing opinions in a place like this. Home inspectors are just like homebuyers - they don't take free advice.

You should read and learn a bit.

Russell in Texas

[Russell J. Hensel]

Kinda confusing here....What the hell does a GC have to do with Home Inspections. When will people realize General Contractors do NOT BUILD HOUSES...they hire numerous people to build houses. I as well as probably 99% of the people in this organization has inspected a new home and just laughed at all the discrepancies and defects.

I would love to ask a GC that a water heater is wired with a 40 amp breaker, using #10 aluminum solid strand wiring, in a sub panel that has hots and neutrals on the same bus bar, that panel is grounded and there is no disconnect and has a pullout disconnect with #8 copper.

Tell me the defects?.............I bet his response will wither be...It ok it passed code or hell if I know let me call my electrician. Two different professions. Hell since we are screwing the Real Estate Industry up, why not just let the Realtors perform the appraisals!

General Contractors are glorified babysitters and organizers...How hard is it? Lets see....get all the subs a set of plans and start making calls..site cleared and compacted...call for code..........foundation...call for code inspection....rough plumbing, call for inspection.....I have seen MANY GC'S never step foot on the site till near the end...they use their cell phones...Being a General Contractor does not make you a qualified inspector....But then again, neither does being a member of NACHI...I can name 3 NACHI certified Home Inspectors in my area....that have NEVER performed a Home Inspection....sad, but true...

[Nick Gromicko]

And in the entire Florida Home Inspection Law, "jumping jacks" and "push-ups" are mentioned only one time less than "experience."

That's right, the word "experience" is only mentioned once in the entire legislation... and it was used in very general terms. It has about as much to do with this law as jumping jacks and push-ups do.

The legislation is education-centric (not experience). Get used to it.

[Doug Edwards, CMI]

What Russell just said. We have some big time builders locally who have never been on site. They have site Supervisors who do all the thinking, scheduling, hiring, firing, deal with the headaches, while they sit in their air conditioned office and have a couple of secretaries to answer the phone and deal with irate customers. Ive seen it too many times. We do have some builders who do know what they are doing and are on site, but mostly small operations with a small crew of regulars. The big shots are "businessmen" who spend most of their time playing golf, or smoozing with some other big shots around town, doing lunch and working on their golf swing. Many wouldn't know a stair stringer from a stringer of fish. I have friends in the trade who couldn't lay out a wall if their children's lives depended on it. BTW, some of the big shots went bust when the market tanked because they were in hock up to their eyeballs. I can't tell you the number of big homes I have inspected that used to belong to a "builder" who had to move out of it and sell it at a huge loss. Not surprising, even their own homes were full of poor workmanship and discrepancies. More than average.