Normally anti-licensing Gromicko comes out personally in favor of new Kansas law.

[Michael R. Boyett]

Originally Posted by gromicko

My point was that a licensing board has almost no power at all. It can't change the law.

Whew! I am so glad to hear that! I was beginning to be a little concerned about TREC.

[Nick Gromicko]

... and a licensing board certainly can't adopt rule changes that apply to some inspectors and not others. Everything they do, good or bad, is applied evenly over all inspectors. If they make InterNACHI do 10 jumping jacks, every inspector has to do 10 jumping jacks.

[John McKenna]

Originally Posted by mboyett

Whew! I am so glad to hear that! I was beginning to be a little concerned about TREC.

You have been warned not to say the "T" word on this forum.
Men in black suites will be at your front door in 20 min...

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by gromicko

... and a licensing board certainly can't adopt rule changes that apply to some inspectors and not others. Everything they do, good or bad, is applied evenly over all inspectors. If they make InterNACHI do 10 jumping jacks, every inspector has to do 10 jumping jacks.

Try to understand.

Prior to this law, Kansas home inspectors had the freedom to run their own businesses.

Now, the state (with the help of the Kansas Association of Realtors and the ASHI presidents who helped them) will be running their businesses.

You are hung up on the NACHI/ASHI parity issues. No one else is. No one in Kansas is expecting to see blatant anti-NACHI laws put into place. They are expecting the same special interest groups who manipulated their government to get this law....to manipulate the board to even further their agenda.

So far, the advantage seems to be in favor of those who bought this law.

Excuse us for not being as excited about it as you are, Nick.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by gromicko

InterNACHI was built from the ground up as a post-licensing trade association, and in a post-licensing world, inspectors care primarily about 3 things: member benefits, approved continuing education, and marketing tools. Sound like any association you know?

Yes.

Seriously, though, you have made the point I was trying to make on another thread.

You have made NACHI a fun and enjoyable hang out for home inspectors. It's fun and neat and we get lots of free stuff. Thanks.

Post licensing inspectors....as you and I have so often agreed....are working in a dumbed down environment. You know that whenever you try to book a class with a $150 training fee in several of our licensed states that do not require CEUs. I know of one instructor in a licensed state that has no CEU requirements have two students show up for his class....and by the end, the one who was still there asked to be dismissed early.

In the dumbed down environment of post licensing home inspecting, the priorities are pretty much as you described them. That cancer has now spread to Kansas.

But our profession is at the bottom of an industry that is sinking fast. To survive, we will soon need to throw away our marshmallows and start eating steak. The profession needs leadership...not more vendors...to resolve the issues that are holding us back.

This latest takeover by a state real estate association is a microcosm of a national disease.

[Michael R. Boyett]

Originally Posted by jmckenna1

You have been warned not to say the "T" word on this forum. Men in black suites will be at your front door in 20 min...

Yes, you are correct...I have been forewarned and I will refrain from any further references to such.

[John McKenna]

Originally Posted by jbushart

Yes.

Seriously, though, you have made the point I was trying to make on another thread.

You have made NACHI a fun and enjoyable hang out for home inspectors. It's fun and neat and we get lots of free stuff. Thanks.

Post licensing inspectors....as you and I have so often agreed....are working in a dumbed down environment. You know that whenever you try to book a class with a $150 training fee in several of our licensed states that do not require CEUs. I know of one instructor in a licensed state that has no CEU requirements have two students show up for his class....and by the end, the one who was still there asked to be dismissed early.

In the dumbed down environment of post licensing home inspecting, the priorities are pretty much as you described them. That cancer has now spread to Kansas.

But our profession is at the bottom of an industry that is sinking fast. To survive, we will soon need to throw away our marshmallows and start eating steak. The profession needs leadership...not more vendors...to resolve the issues that are holding us back.

This latest takeover by a state real estate association is a microcosm of a national disease.

Funny... the highest attendance at my classes come from licensed states and
the lowest has been in an unlicensed state. It really means nothing, but
I know that already.

Nick and I have asked you to provide solutions, but so far, all you keep
saying is nachi is not providing the solutions and you won't tell us either.

Perhaps it is you who are in survival mode, not the entire industry.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by jmckenna1

Funny... the highest attendance at my classes come from licensed states and
the lowest has been in an unlicensed state. It really means nothing, but
I know that already.

Nick and I have asked you to provide solutions, but so far, all you keep
saying is nachi is not providing the solutions and you won't tell us either.

John,

In the last hour and a half since you have been a vendor, I would venture to say that your very few and limited experiences have been far from indicative of what has been happening in other places.

Adding to that is the fact that the states you have been in that are licensed states....also require CEUs, do they not? Re-read my post and understand my frustration with your continuous irrelevant responses.

I have no duty to provide you with anything. Nick has asked for and has been provided what I propose as a solution. It is nothing that is within NACHI or ASHI's ability to provide. If we see it at all, it will come from an association that does not exist today.

[John McKenna]

Originally Posted by jbushart

John,

In the last hour and a half since you have been a vendor, I would venture to say that your very few and limited experiences have been far from indicative of what has been happening in other places.

That's what I said... A few class attendance numbers means
nothing and you should not use them to prove a point... agreed.

Adding to that is the fact that the states you have been in that are licensed states....also require CEUs, do they not? Re-read my post and understand my frustration with your continuous irrelevant responses.

Not always... your wrong... please see my calender of previous classes
and I can give you the teleconference logs as well.

I have no duty to provide you with anything. Nick has asked for and has been provided what I propose as a solution. It is nothing that is within NACHI or ASHI's ability to provide. If we see it at all, it will come from an association that does not exist today.

The only thing I see is that you want is a political activist association to
rise up and stop licensing, make inspectors stop working for the realtors,
and for inspector fees to go up. But you have offered no solutions on how
to get from point A to point B.

The licensing issue does not cause successful inspectors to fail. I just
don't buy it. Too many thousands prosper in licensed states. Here
is a newbie that does... http://www.nachi.tv/episode11

Only the inspector can break the immoral temptation to write soft
reports for the realtor. It is an individual choice.

Only the inspector can raise his fees. BTW... one of the reasons
so many fail, is because it is so easy to get started. 'Easy in' makes
for many who will be 'easy out'. They try it for a while and then
they try something else.

When it is too hard to approach inspecting on a casual basis, then
you will see less failures.

[William J. Decker]

Originally Posted by gromicko

My point was that a licensing board has almost no power at all. It can't change the law. It, at most, can approve CE course providers... and they always approve all of ours everywhere.

Not true in Illinois.

The State HO board approves courses, but also adjudicates the HI law discipline actions (in truth, the board adjudicates and sends their recommendation to the Director, who rules and sets the fine, but the Director very rarely over rides the board's recommendation).

As to changing the law.

Most states, like Illinois, have a administrative rules board (in Illinois, it is called JCAR. Joint Commission on Administrative Rules). These commissions take the recommendations from the HI board, after the Director has seen them, and go over them for changes. There are currently changes, for Illinois, that are in the pipeline for higher CE requirements, more pre-licensing requirements and a lot of other stuff. Could this also include, say, a requirement for E&O or some such? Sure.

But I do not see the problem. I cannot think of any decent HI (ethical and professional) that would not already have E&O.

If we see ourselves as a profession, and not just a trade, then we must accept the responsibility (fiduciary) that professionals have.

Doctors, Lawyers, SEs, Architects all have E&O. Why not home inspectors? I tell my clients that, since my primary job is to protect them from liability, my first duty is to ensure that protection by protecting them from any liability that my mistakes would place on them.

Just my thoughts.

[Nick Gromicko]

Good thoughts.

[Nick Gromicko]

BTW, Illinois really, really, really, needs to up their CE requirements. IL is almost as bad as AZ.

[Nick Gromicko]

And while we're on the subject of Illinois CEs and getting state approvals.... http://www.nachi.org/moreillinoislicenses.htm

[William J. Decker]

Look, before a lot of guys start slamming me, I am not saying that E&O should be a requirement or anything. I just see it as a good business practice and something that any real professional would have to better serve their client's interest.

Our state HI board is very professional, balanced and fair. The new CE requirement wil, most proably, 18 hrs per two year license, with 12 "basic" (i.e., plumbing, electric, roof, etc) and 6 "elective" (i.e., thermal, green, mold, radon, etc.) They will also start requireing X number (between 5 and 10, not yet set) "inspection events" (less than a full inspection but more than a ride along) for licensing.

That is iNACHI's next challange. Providing these "events" to new guys at a fair and low price rather than have them ripped off by some of the predators around here. One company charges the new guys $1000 for 10 ride alongs. That is just obsene!

And, I know, Nick. I wrote a lot of them, remember?

[John McKenna]

Will has done a huge amount of labor for the CE needs of inspectors. Thanks.