For those in favor of licensing

[Gerry Beaumont]

Originally Posted by roconnor

I cant even imagine how some could think licensing would actually "Lower the bar for inspectors" ... lower the bar compared to what if there are no current requirements ...

Hi Rob,

I know of many home inspectors whose level of knowledge and CEU compliance is solely dedicated to their states minimum requirements, conversely I also know of many inspectors in both licensed and unlicensed states who far exceed the mandated minimums to make themselves (a) more employable and (b) less liable. Licensing at best only enforces a minimum standard.

Regards

Gerry

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

Licensing at best only enforces a minimum standard.

Agreed ... similar to a driving license.

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

I know of many home inspectors whose level of knowledge and CEU compliance is solely dedicated to their states minimum requirements ...

I believe those types of inspectors likely did less before any licensing became effective.

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

... conversely I also know of many inspectors in both licensed and unlicensed states who far exceed the mandated minimums to make themselves (a) more employable and (b) less liable.

I believe those motivated to exceed what any licensing minimums would be are going to do that anyway regardless of licensing.

So that would not be lowering the bar.

JMO

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by roconnor

I cant even imagine how some could think licensing would actually "Lower the bar for inspectors" ... lower the bar compared to what if there are no current requirements ...

Arizona has licensing.
- The state requires no continuing education. Although every licensed home inspector in Arizona has met the basic minimum standard to get a license and, in the minds of the consumer, is equally qualified and competent to inspect a home....many have never cracked a book since preparing for their initial (and only) test.
- With the higher qualified/paid inspectors getting ony $275 for a 2000 sq ft house, and no requirement for continued education, try filling a class for CE in Phoenix.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by roconnor

I believe those motivated to exceed what any licensing minimums would be are going to do that anyway regardless of licensing.

So that would not be lower the bar.

JMO

Your belief has not been substantiated by fact.

In states where the government (instead of the consumer) has determined the basic minimum standard...there is the Soviet Union Syndrome effect where there becomes no incentive to exceed it. The client is led to believe that a license reflects the quality and competency that is required and...frankly...can find no reason to pay for more than that. And why should they?

As an educational vendor in a newly licensed state, you are motivated to turn out as many new inspectors as are willing to sign up for your training program. Each graduate will hit the street - if you trained them properly - with the ability to obtain the same license you have. What will distinguish you from them that will justify, to your client, why they should pay you more?

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by jbushart

Each graduate will hit the street - if you trained them properly - with the ability to obtain the same license you have.

No, because I have a more general and much harder to obtain PE license. I also have a significant amount of experience and additional training/qualifications ... but I also charge more for inspections.

Originally Posted by jbushart

What will distinguish you from them that will justify, to your client, why they should pay you more?

Some people are looking to pay the least amount possible. Licensing doesn't change that. Licensing usually only helps weed out those less/under qualified who probably shouldn't be doing inspections anyway, and usually charge very little to get the work. That actually helps raise fees for those more qualified/serious about the profession. That has been the effect in NY with the recent licensing from the local inspectors I know.

Originally Posted by jbushart

Your belief has not been substantiated by fact.

The converse has not been substantiated by fact. We are talking about individual opinions on both sides of the fence.

However I would be willing to bet the family ranch that on average countrywide the amount of training hours for HI's has increased over the years as licensing has become effective in more and more states. ITA could probably verify that.

JMO & 2-nickels ...

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by jbushart

Arizona has licensing.
- The state requires no continuing education. Although every licensed home inspector in Arizona has met the basic minimum standard to get a license and, in the minds of the consumer, is equally qualified and competent to inspect a home....many have never cracked a book since preparing for their initial (and only) test.
- With the higher qualified/paid inspectors getting ony $275 for a 2000 sq ft house, and no requirement for continued education, try filling a class for CE in Phoenix.

And before licensing, they packed the rooms for HI educational courses in AZ?

What was the average yearly HI training hours before and after licensing to substantiate the apparent position that licensing in AZ actually lowered the amount of training HI's signed up for?

[Gerry Beaumont]

Hi to all,

However I would be willing to be the family ranch that on average countrywide the amount of training hours for HI's has increased over the years as licensing has become effective in more and more states. ITA could probably verify that.

Rob I suspect that inspectors doing more CE has more to do with our ever increasing liabilities and our understanding of them than it has to do with legislation. Goods conciensious inspectors do more CE, in order to better serve their clients and reduce their liabilities. How else do you explain 200 members attending a chapter event in FL where there is no licensing ?

Regards

Gerry

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

Rob I suspect that inspectors doing more CE has more to do with our ever increasing liabilities and our understanding of them than it has to do with legislation.

We have been living in a highly litigious society well before HI licensing became so widespread.

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

Good conciensious inspectors do more CE, in order to better serve their clients and reduce their liabilities.

I agree. Licensing doesn't change that.

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

How else do you explain 200 members attending a chapter event in FL where there is no licensing ?

So you truely believe that if just basic licensing provisions without substantial training/CE requirements are instituted in FL that the HI training statewide will actually go down? Are you feeling okay mate? Did ya have one too many pints at the local pub? ...

[duck]

[Gerry Beaumont]

Hi to all

So you truely believe that if just basic licensing provisions without substantial training/CE requirements are instituted in FL that the HI training statewide will actually go down? Are you feeling okay mate? Did ya have one too many pints at the local pub? ...

No Rob what I am saying is that there is no corolation between licensing and knowledge, there are good inspectors and not so good inspectors. Licensing does not bring the less able upto the level of the able, it encourages the minimum only.

Regards

Gerry

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

Licensing does not bring the less able upto the level of the able, it encourages the minimum only.

So if licensing is instituted in FL with no substantial CE requirements do you believe that HI's there will actually sign up for less training?

[Gerry Beaumont]

Originally Posted by roconnor

So if licensing is instituted in FL with no substantial CE requirements do you believe that HI's there will actually sign up for less training?

Rob, a large percentile of any group will never aspire to anything more than mediocrity.

Regards

Gerry

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by roconnor

So if licensing is instituted in FL with no substantial CE requirements do you believe that HI's there will actually sign up for less training?

Yes. As in all licensed states, to the majority of the licensees and the clients that hire them, the license - itself - means I am qualified and competent. Why blow a couple hundred bucks on a seminar?

[Joseph T. Burkeson, CMI]

Originally Posted by jbushart

Yes. As in all licensed states, to the majority of the licensees and the clients that hire them, the license - itself - means I am qualified and competent. Why blow a couple hundred bucks on a seminar?

Besides with the reduced prices post licensing brings, why do any more then the base minimum SoP? That way you can do twice as much work and still receive the same profit that you used to make before licensing went into effect.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by jburkeson1

Besides with the reduced prices post licensing brings, why do any more then the base minimum SoP? That way you can do twice as much work and still receive the same profit that you used to make before licensing went into effect.

It all boils down to this...

Historically, when the government decides what is fit for a consumer (try looking at the FDA standards for how much rat ***** can be in govt approved balogna) the acceptable "standard" is normally less than what the consumer would decide on his own.

Competition in an unlicensed state seems to be centered on qualifications...where, in licensed states, it seems to be centered on the inspection fee. "Where can I find the cheapest licensed inspector?"

[Gerry Beaumont]

Originally Posted by jbushart

It all boils down to this...

Historically, when the government decides what is fit for a consumer (try looking at the FDA standards for how much rat ***** can be in govt approved balogna) the acceptable "standard" is normally less than what the consumer would decide on his own.

Competition in an unlicensed state seems to be centered on qualifications...where, in licensed states, it seems to be centered on the inspection fee. "Where can I find the cheapest licensed inspector?"

Nice analogy James,

I was just going for a Balogna sandwich, I just went right off the idea

Regards

Gerry