6 breaker exceeded

[Mike D. Hazelwood]

If sub-panels have more than 6 breakers should it have a service disconnect or does that only apply to the main panel?

Thanks ahead of time

[relliott]

Mike check out the thread under yours.
I just had that answered.

[Speedy Petey]

Detached structure it does. Within the same structure NO main is required.

[Mike D. Hazelwood]

Originally Posted by Speedy Petey

Detached structure it does. Within the same structure NO main is required.

sub-panel is in a detached garage???

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by mhazelwood

sub-panel is in a detached garage???

I'm confused. You made a statement, but put question marks on the end. Is that panel in question in a detached garage or not?

[Speedy Petey]

Yeah, I'm confused too.
Maybe I was not clear.

[Greg Fretwell]

I often wondered if anyone tried to invoke 225.32 exception 1 in the residence of a qualified person

Exception No. 1: For installations under single management, where documented safe switching procedures are established and maintained for disconnection, and where the installation is monitored by qualified individuals, the disconnecting means shall be permitted to be located elsewhere on the premises.

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

I often wondered if anyone tried to invoke 225.32 exception 1 in the residence of a qualified person

Yeah, nice try.

That exception is mainly for industrial establishments with a central powerhouse.

[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by mhazelwood

If sub-panels have more than 6 breakers should it have a service disconnect or does that only apply to the main panel?

Thanks ahead of time

It applies to the main panel.

[Speedy Petey]

Originally Posted by bkelly2

It applies to the main panel.

....AND to a panel in a detached structure.

Even though you guys don't do codes this seems to be a hard sell. So here:

II. More Than One Building or Other Structure
225.31 Disconnecting Means
Means shall be provided for disconnecting all ungrounded conductors that supply or pass through the building or structure.

[Greg Fretwell]

That exception is mainly for industrial establishments with a central powerhouse.

Marc, it doesn't say that. I know I would have a hard time approving the installation but if the owner had placards on the subpanel and demonstrated he was "qualified" (licensed) I am not sure how I would justify the rejection if he fought it.

The fact that any installation was compliant at the time of inspection does not guarantee that those procedures will remain in place or that it will continue to be supervised by qualified people. As far as I am concerned the exception guts the intent of the rule.

[Karl E. Gerhauser]

Speedy, Not disagreeing, trying to understand. This code is not clear to me.

II. More Than One Building or Other Structure
225.31 Disconnecting Means
Means shall be provided for disconnecting all ungrounded conductors that supply or pass through the building or structure.

If the main panel is feeding the subpanel and there is a main disconnect (or 6 throw) in the main panel that doesn't cover the subpanel? Doesn't that count as means of disconnecting?

[Rick Maday]

Originally Posted by kgerhauser

Speedy, Not disagreeing, trying to understand. This code is not clear to me.


If the main panel is feeding the subpanel and there is a main disconnect (or 6 throw) in the main panel that doesn't cover the subpanel? Doesn't that count as means of disconnecting?

I am curious, if the logic (of having a sub panel main disconnect) is to ensure the sub panel (in a detached structure) doesn't get energized by someone at the service panel, why wouldn't that apply to a remote (not in line of sight) location?

Or perhaps a better question is what is the difference between a detached structure and (for example) a different level/room of the same structure?

If that is not the logic, please disregard.
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[Jeffrey R. Pope]

Here is the section where location is addressed.

225.32 Location. The disconnecting means shall be installed either inside or outside of the building or structure served or where the conductors pass through the building or structure. The disconnecting means shall be at a readily accessible location nearest the point of entrance of the conductors. For the purposes of this section, the requirements in 230.6

[relliott]

So in English, he is trying to say the kill needs to be near the entrance of the conductors, for the structure.
Not really an answer but a statement of CODE.
Seems to me it should be required since so many are mis labeled.(refering to the subs)