InterNACHI


Go Back   InterNACHI Message Board > Specific Inspection Topics > Electrical

Notices

Electrical Contains discussions about electrical systems. This includes outlets, panels, wiring, et cetera.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 1/12/06, 10:57 AM
jtedesco1 jtedesco1 is offline
Account Suspended Due to Excessive Complaints
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,908
Please Note: jtedesco1 is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Answer to a common question about GFCI's

Hello:

Here's some information that will help answer the question asked of me last night while returning to my hotel in Albany, NY. I attended the local NACHI meeting and Joe Baranowski gave me a lift. This is for you Joe and anyone else who may have had the same question.


Question: Why can a GFCI receptacle be used in old two wire ungrounded circuits?


Replacement of receptacles shall comply with 406.3(D)(1), (D)(2), and (D)(3) as applicable.


(1) Grounding-Type Receptacles
Where a grounding means exists in the receptacle enclosure or a grounding conductor is installed in accordance with 250.130(C), grounding-type receptacles shall be used and shall be connected to the grounding conductor in accordance with 406.3(C) or 250.130(C).




(2) Ground-Fault Circuit Interrupters
Ground-fault circuit-interrupter protected receptacles
shall be provided where replacements are made at receptacle outlets that are required to be so protected elsewhere in this Code.




(3) Non–grounding-Type Receptacles
Where grounding means does not exist in the receptacle enclosure, the installation shall comply with (D)(3)(a), (D)(3)(b), or (D)(3)(c).


(a) A non–grounding-type receptacle(s) shall be permitted to be replaced with another
non–grounding-type receptacle(s).


(b) A non–grounding-type receptacle(s) shall be permitted to be replaced with a ground-fault circuit interrupter-type of receptacle(s). These receptacles shall be marked ``No
Equipment Ground.'' An equipment grounding conductor shall not be connected from the
ground-fault circuit-interrupter-type receptacle to any outlet supplied from the
ground-fault circuit-interrupter receptacle.


(c) A non–grounding-type receptacle(s) shall be permitted to be replaced with a
grounding-type receptacle(s) where supplied through a ground-fault circuit interrupter.
Grounding-type receptacles supplied through the ground-fault circuit interrupter shall be
marked ``GFCI Protected'' and ``No Equipment Ground.'' An equipment grounding

conductor shall not be connected between the grounding-type receptacles.

I am working on a short video clip and will try to make it available here if we can upload audio files or mpg files. If you are attending the convention I will have a table set up showing videos and items related to residential electrical inspections and existing installations and safety. I have images of the entire discussion available if anyone wants them.


I have a full schedule with the classes offered and will attend them so that I can learn more about the HI industry.


I will teach what I know if you will teach me what you know about the other areas beyond my expertise. I will be available anytime if you by me a beer!

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 1/12/06, 12:35 PM
Timothy J. Gardner Timothy J. Gardner is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Moneta, VA
Posts: 270
Default Re: Answer to a common question about GFCI's

Joe,

Isn't the REASONING why because the GFCI still detects any current differential between the hot and neutral conductors, and trips if it is greater than 5 milliamps? (indicating current flow to ground other than through the neutral.)

tg
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 1/12/06, 12:48 PM
jtedesco1 jtedesco1 is offline
Account Suspended Due to Excessive Complaints
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,908
Please Note: jtedesco1 is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Answer to a common question about GFCI's

Timothy:

Courtesy: www..nfpa.org


Ground-Fault Circuit Interrupter (GFCI).
A device intended for the protection of personnel
that functions to de-energize a circuit or portion thereof within an established period of time
when a current to ground exceeds the values established for a Class A device.



FPN: Class A ground-fault circuit interrupters trip when the current to ground has a value in the range of 4
mA to 6 mA. For further information, see UL 943,
Standard for Ground-Fault Circuit Interrupters.


The commentary following 210.8 contains a list of applicable cross-references for
ground-fault circuit interrupters (GFCIs). Exhibit 210.7 through Exhibit 210.15 contain
specific information regarding the requirements for GFCIs.
The FPN following the definition describes in detail how personal protection is achieved.

Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 1/12/06, 6:01 PM
Paul W. Abernathy's Avatar
Paul W. Abernathy Paul W. Abernathy is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Harrisonburg, VA
Posts: 7,539
Send a message via AIM to pabernathy Send a message via MSN to pabernathy
Default Re: Answer to a common question about GFCI's

That outlet is called a ground-fault circuit interrupter (GFCI). It's there to protect people from electrical shock, so it is completely different from a fuse in general.

A GFCI is much more subtle. When you look at a normal 120-volt outlet in the United States, there are two vertical slots and then a round hole centered below them. The left slot is slightly larger than the right. The left slot is called "neutral," the right slot is called "hot" and the hole below them is called "ground." If an appliance is working properly, all electricity that the appliance uses will flow from hot to neutral. A GFCI monitors the amount of current flowing from hot to neutral. If there is any imbalance, it trips the circuit. It is able to sense a mismatch as small as 4 or 5 milliamps, and it can react as quickly as one-thirtieth of a second.
So let's say you are outside with your power drill and it is raining. You are standing on the ground, and since the drill is wet there is a path from the hot wire inside the drill through you to ground. If electricity flows from hot to ground through you, it could be fatal. The GFCI can sense the current flowing through you because not all of the current is flowing from hot to neutral as it expects -- some of it is flowing through you to ground. As soon as the GFCI senses that, it trips the circuit and cuts off the electricity.



Paul W. Abernathy,CMI,CEI,CEPE
NEC® Consultant/Columnist
www.twitter.com/ElectricalGuru

- ICC & IAEI Certified Electrical Inspector
- ICC & IAEI Certified Electrical Plans Examiner
- Look for my article in the Nov/Dec 2009 IAEI Magazine
- 2007 "Top Gun" Winner - Mike Holt Enterprises
" visit www.TheElectricalGuru.com Today !"

Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 1/12/06, 10:29 PM
Bob Badger Bob Badger is offline
New User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 77
Please Note: Bob Badger is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Cool Re: Answer to a common question about GFCI's

Take a look at 250.114 for a list of items that can not be plugged into these GFCI protected non-grounded receptacles.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
National Electrical Code Information and Discussion jtedesco1 Electrical 44 4/18/08 12:43 AM
Inspection Pointers Here jtedesco1 Electrical 3 3/15/08 10:19 AM
WA Structural Pest Inspector Law hmiller Legislation, Licensing & Legal Issues 18 4/1/07 3:10 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 3:35 PM.


Copyright © International Association of Certified Home Inspectors, Inc. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147

Popular Sections

:

All Sections

Popular

Membership

Inspection Standards

Education

Chapters & Members

Articles & Links

Other Organizations

 

 

 

NACHI.ORG Statistics

 

 

no new posts