Is this an approved installation?

[William Warner]

Main lugs jumpered and receptacle installed on side of panel (non-GFCI in unfinished basement...)

[Jay Schwartz]

William:

Based on the color of the receptacle cover, it appears this may have been done back in the 70's. It was a common practice that is no longer allowed. Recommend a repair be made by a licensed qualified electrical contractor.

[brian winkle]

Looks like a 3 phase panel being used on a single phase system.

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by jschwartz1

Based on the color of the receptacle cover, it appears this may have been done back in the 70's. It was a common practice that is no longer allowed.

What do you base that statement on? It's less commonly done nowadays, but you'd be hard-pressed to find a prohibition against it.

With regard to the pictures in total, it is a 3-phase panel, with a couple phases jumpered to make it a single phase panel. Non conventional, but okay. The mechanical lug reducing adaptors used on the jumper are properly employed. The installer did have his head in the game on that one. The double tap appears to be old type TW insulated wire (really fat insulation), so the wire gauge may be okay for double tapping a square d breaker. You'd have to double check that. The backfed main doesn't appear to have a hold-down clip, but this may have been installed when that was not a requirement.

[William Warner]

Is that jumper large enough?

These are items I don't normally see (back fed main) and just appeared odd to me...

Thanks for your reply Marc

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by wwarner

Is that jumper large enough?

I don't know. You havn't given any information about the jumper yet, or the service size. The service entrance conductors appear to be aluminium with XHHW or RHH insulation, and the jumper appears to be coppery with THHN or THW insulation, so that would account for some disparity in size. Got any more information for a more educated guess about the jumper?

It's probably not a shame for you to call this all out, since it is a weird install that you're likely to never see again. Probably okay, but weird just the same.

[William Warner]

It would be proper to recommend GFCI protection for that recepatcle when the panel is located hanging from a joist in an unfinished basement. Correct?

[William Warner]

Originally Posted by Marc D. Shunk

I don't know. You havn't given any information about the jumper yet, or the service size. The service entrance conductors appear to be aluminium with XHHW or RHH insulation, and the jumper appears to be coppery with THHN or THW insulation, so that would account for some disparity in size. Got any more information for a more educated guess about the jumper?

It's probably not a shame for you to call this all out, since it is a weird install that you're likely to never see again. Probably okay, but weird just the same.

200A meter box, 100 amp SEC (from meter), 100A main breaker, ... jumper appeared to be 6 gauge copper

[Michael Larson]

Marc,

This does look to be a 3-phase panel "converted" for 120/240 use.
It looks like the left hand phase A lug has been removed and the 3 polebreaker is feeding bus A and C with bus B fed by the white jumper.

Is this a permitted application?

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by mlarson

Is this a permitted application?

It's not prohibited, and that's all you can say. The jumper size may be an issue, now that we know it's probably 6 gauge copper.

[Speedy Petey]

Originally Posted by wwarner

200A meter box, 100 amp SEC (from meter), 100A main breaker, ... jumper appeared to be 6 gauge copper

Is it definitely a 200A meter pan, or just a 200CL meter?





I must say, I have seen this done (3-phase jumped to single phase) a few times but I do not like it. Someone went through some work to convert an old 3-phase panel when they could have gone out and gotten the correct single phase main breaker panel and done a MUCH neater job.
This is what happens when your brother in-law gives you old surplus material he got from the plant.

As marc said though, there is nothing specifically prohibiting it.

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by Speedy Petey

This is what happens when your brother in-law gives you old surplus material he got from the plant.
.

Yes, I think it would be fair to say that this is probably along the lines of what happened here.

[William Warner]

Originally Posted by Speedy Petey

Is it definitely a 200A meter pan, or just a 200CL meter?





I must say, I have seen this done (3-phase jumped to single phase) a few times but I do not like it. Someone went through some work to convert an old 3-phase panel when they could have gone out and gotten the correct single phase main breaker panel and done a MUCH neater job.
This is what happens when your brother in-law gives you old surplus material he got from the plant.

As marc said though, there is nothing specifically prohibiting it.

Yes it was definately a 200A meter pan (older)

I figured it was a friend of a friend or relative install since there were no approval tags and the house is 107 years old. That's what threw me since it was an odd install (and I didn't much like it either) but nothing really glaring about being wrong except the bonded sub in the garage and the possible size of that jumper.

Thanks for all your input.

[William Warner]

Originally Posted by jschwartz1

William:

Based on the color of the receptacle cover, it appears this may have been done back in the 70's. It was a common practice that is no longer allowed. Recommend a repair be made by a licensed qualified electrical contractor.

I can still find some of those brown bakolite (sp?) covers around here at hardware stores. So although yes it may indicate an older install, I wouldn't put my money on it based on the receptacle cover.

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by wwarner

I figured it was a friend of a friend or relative install since there were no approval tags and the house is 107 years old. That's what threw me since it was an odd install (and I didn't much like it either) but nothing really glaring about being wrong except the bonded sub in the garage and the possible size of that jumper.

It sounds like your gut feelings were correct. Good job.

I'm an electrician who often gets charged with fixing items that home inspectors find that need correction. I wouldn't hold it against any home inspector who flagged a really weird installation for evaluation by an electrician. In fact, I'd encourage you to do so in really odd cases, such as this one is. I just tire of the HI's who constantly flag things that are absolutely proper in anyone's book, such as double taps on Square D 15, 20 and 30 amp QO breakers. There's one inspector in my area that suggests an electrician evaluate every 2-prong receptacle he comes across. That's costing a lot of people a lot of money.