InterNACHI


Go Back   InterNACHI Inspection Forum > Specific Inspection Topics > Electrical Inspections

Notices

Electrical Inspections Contains discussions about electrical systems. This includes receptacles, panels, wiring, etc.

 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 12/12/09, 8:08 PM
Bruce L. Treacy Bruce L. Treacy is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Flamborough, ON
Posts: 45
Cool Double taps

Can Square D breakers be double tapped. There is a small lug that appears to be able to handle 2 wires, one on each side of the lug.
Reply With Quote
Find an InterNACHI certified South Carolina Home Inspector (and anywhere else in North America)
  #2  
Old 12/12/09, 8:15 PM
Michael Roberson's Avatar
Michael Roberson Michael Roberson is online now
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: West Michigan, Lower Penninsula
Posts: 1,732
Default Re: Double taps

Some of the newer Square D Homeline breakers can be double tapped.

This is how I tell the difference: Single screw, and compression = Single wire
Single screw with compression plate = Double tap (not sure the actual term)

http://www.nachi.org/forum/f19/squar...re-size-26314/

In this thread, the wires are installed poorly, but you can see in the photo the crimped plate below the screw.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12/12/09, 9:02 PM
Larry D. Kage Larry D. Kage is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lake Ann (Traverse City), MI
Posts: 8,848
Default Re: Double taps

This is what to look for:
Attached Thumbnails
double-taps-twowirebreaker-small-.jpg.jpg
Views:	238
Size:	30.3 KB
ID:	33823  



InterNachi Awards Portal: http://co.nachi.org/inachiawards/

____________________________________________
"An Education, not just an Inspection"

Larry Kage, CMI
Lake Ann (Traverse City), Michigan 49650
231 929 3525


Professional Inspector serving the Traverse City, Michigan area and beyond.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12/12/09, 10:13 PM
Jim Port Jim Port is offline
Unmoderated Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 805
Please Note: Jim Port is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double taps

The Square D QO and Homline are good for 2 conductors in the 15 and 20 amp sizes.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12/18/09, 1:07 AM
George P. Wells, CMI's Avatar
George P. Wells, CMI George P. Wells, CMI is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 554
Send a message via Skype™ to gwells
Default Re: Double taps

Quote:
Originally Posted by mroberson View Post
(not sure the actual term)
Around here (Great Lakes/Upper Midwest), we call them saddle clamps. The terminology for electrical system components is not the same everywhere so they may known by other names elsewhere.



BestInspectors.Net
& Real Estate Training Academy

Inspection Report Software for
Windows - iOS - Mac - Android

Continuing Education
Home and Commercial Building Inspection - Skilled Trades – Real Estate – Appraisal – NFPA 921

http://www.bestinspectors.net

est. 1992
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 3/12/10, 9:17 PM
Gerald C. Wilcox's Avatar
Gerald C. Wilcox Gerald C. Wilcox is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Harvey, ND
Posts: 333
Default Re: Double taps

Jim what documentation do you have on this......I have been reading online from the square d site and have not found this info yet.....
Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 3/12/10, 9:31 PM
Jeffrey R. Pope's Avatar
Jeffrey R. Pope Jeffrey R. Pope is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Santa Clarita, CA
Posts: 8,057
Default Re: Double taps

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwilcox View Post
Jim what documentation do you have on this......I have been reading online from the square d site and have not found this info yet.....
Thanks
The listing is usually affixed directly to the breaker. When they are specifically listed for two conductors, it's no longer referred to as a "double-tap," unless both conductors are on the same side of the screw.

The term "double-tap" is generally reserved to describe an "improper connection."



IF YOUR INSPECTOR IS NOT USING THERMAL IMAGING, YOU'RE NOT GETTING THE WHOLE PICTURE ®
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
Santa Clarita CA
(661) 212-0738
Santa Clarita Home Inspection
http://www.MyInspector.net


Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 3/12/10, 10:07 PM
Robert Meier's Avatar
Robert Meier Robert Meier is online now
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,251
Please Note: Robert Meier is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double taps

In this photo, from Mark Shunk in that old thread, you can clearly see the wire sizes and connections for the square D breaker:

Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 3/13/10, 8:10 AM
Bruce M. Graham Bruce M. Graham is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Gainesville, FL
Posts: 2,099
Default Re: Double taps

and both wires have to be the same gauge. Had a electrician try to tell me the doorbell transformer(16 gauge strained) was ok on that 15 amp circuit with the #14 solid. Ask for his determination in writing, still don't have it.



http://www.nachi.org/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=6376&dateline=1330979  258
Professional Inspection Services, LLC dba
1st Inspection Services
Bruce M. Graham III
Gainesville, FL 32608
352 871 8989
Florida Licensed Home Inspector #HI10
Radon Measurment Technician # R2279
NACHI05091592
ICC 5268478
www.1stinspectionsfl.com
www.bungalowstomansions.com
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 3/13/10, 8:16 AM
Robert Meier's Avatar
Robert Meier Robert Meier is online now
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,251
Please Note: Robert Meier is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double taps

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgraham View Post
and both wires have to be the same gauge. Had a electrician try to tell me the doorbell transformer(16 gauge strained) was ok on that 15 amp circuit with the #14 solid. Ask for his determination in writing, still don't have it.

Bruce do you think that's true when you look at the installation graphic on the side of the Square D breaker in the photo? I see #14-#10 as permitted to be both landed on the breaker. Maybe I'm missing something but I don't see any prohibition for different size conductors.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 3/17/10, 9:21 PM
pmassie's Avatar
pmassie pmassie is offline
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Ste Adele, Qc
Posts: 329
Please Note: pmassie is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double taps

Square D single-pole. This breaker is rated for two conductors only, but many are rated for a single conductor only, so this is something to be aware of when inspecting the breaker. Square D and Cutler-Hammer currently manufacture breakers which are UL-listed for this application.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 3/17/10, 10:29 PM
Bill Smith's Avatar
Bill Smith Bill Smith is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: East Northport, NY
Posts: 1,043
Default Re: Double taps

The label on the Square D breaker states that it is listed for one or two wires.
Attached Thumbnails
double-taps-sq-d-breaker-label-copy.jpg  



"A man cannot be truly grateful and remain unhappy"
http://www.SmithHomeInspection.com
SmithHomeInspection@yahoo.com
NY State Lic. # 16000008304
631-434-5200
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 5/15/10, 7:42 AM
Steve W. Goddard Steve W. Goddard is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Marinette, Wi.
Posts: 22
Default Re: Double taps

What about 2 neutral wires under one screw on the ground bar or a neutral and a ground wire together under one screw
Reply With Quote
Need a home inspection in South Carolina? Check out InterNACHI's listing of South Carolina certified home inspectors. Or, find a home inspector anywhere in the world with our inspection search engine.
  #14  
Old 5/15/10, 10:06 AM
Jim Port Jim Port is offline
Unmoderated Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 805
Please Note: Jim Port is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double taps

While commonly done in the past it was contrary to the UL listing. It has been spelled out now in the NEC so that the infomation is more readily available.

The rule is multiple grounding conductors are typically ok, but check the panel label. Neutrals must not share, nor be grouped with another conductor.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 5/16/10, 9:07 AM
Brian A. MacNeish Brian A. MacNeish is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: CANADA
Posts: 4,638
Please Note: Brian A. MacNeish is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double taps

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Meier View Post
Bruce do you think that's true when you look at the installation graphic on the side of the Square D breaker in the photo? I see #14-#10 as permitted to be both landed on the breaker. Maybe I'm missing something but I don't see any prohibition for different size conductors.
If you had a #14 and a #10 installed, how could you ensure adequate pressure and mechanical tightening on the #14? That's why they ask for matched size conductors, so that equal pressure and holding power is on both sides of the saddle.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Double Taps in Cutler Hammer Panel bhartley Electrical Inspections 38 7/1/09 5:42 AM
Neutral/Ground double taps kmalone Electrical Inspections 6 4/24/08 5:26 PM
Double Taps rwand1 Canadian Inspectors 39 3/29/06 7:16 PM
Double Taps psmothers Electrical Inspections 3 3/9/06 10:04 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 8:55 AM.


Popular Sections

:

All Sections

Inspection News

InterNACHI Membership

Inspection Standards

Inspection Education

InterNACHI Inspectors

Inspection Links

 

 

 

NACHI.ORG Statistics

 

 

no new posts