Fixture in Attic, am I missing something?

[rkeith]

The picture shows a label that reads DO NOT HAVE INSULATION WITHIN 3 INCHES UNLESS FOR i.c application. Insulation all over it. What is I.C?
Thanks
Rusty

[Marc D. Shunk]

There's more information inside that can. Note that the label says "Remove this label if installed in an I.C. (insulated ceiling) application".

To use that can in an insulated ceiling application and still have the insulation around it, certain lamp sizes and certain trim models must be observed. That information will be on the label inside the can. If the lamp type and size, along with the trim model, jive with the "IC" chart inside the can, it's okay to insulate around that can.

[rkeith]

Thanks, but if all that info is INSIDE the can what am I to do? I can't take the can apart in a non-intrusive inspection. This is a new condo and I imagine all is well but HOW DO I KNOW FOR SURE?
Rusty

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by rkeith

This is a new condo and I imagine all is well...

Don't be so sure.

Originally Posted by rkeith

...but HOW DO I KNOW FOR SURE?

If you can't take the trim down, I have no idea. If you're permitted to take the panel cover off, surely you can lower a recessed light trim to read a label, I would think, because it doesn't even require any tools. Hard to say. Probably have to wait for a home inspector to advise you on that.

[Speedy Petey]

Lightolier Lytening is the same way. The same can is used for both IC and non-IC applications. The trim and lamp determine the rating.

There is NO WAY to tell without removing the trim.

Originally Posted by rkeith

What is I.C?

The term IC means "Insulated ceiling" as Marc stated, or "In contact" as in "in contact with insulation".
Isn't the term "I.C." covered in H-I seminars or classes?

[Doug Edwards]

Speedy,
Unfortunately much is not covered in the average HI course today. Typically lasts a couple of weeks at best and a couple of days at worst. Plus a lot of bogus information and myths are perpetuated in HI schools/courses. Rule of thumb myths that continue to be passed down class after class. They take the students money and lead them to believe they are going out to make a killing and not the reality of setting up a business and running it. That is one reason why so many fail. Many of the old time courses taught everything including how to set up your business, run it and market it, keep the records, write the reports, etc. Most of them got out of the business because of the two weeks school houses that popped up all over the place. Less time and less money to be up and "running", so to speak. The one I took in 1993 was part of McGraw-Hill Education and it took over a year to complete. But it was well done and covered everything and then some. I don't blame the inspectors though. I still decided to go to the various trade schools too to get the hands on needed while I was building my business. I still run up on things I've never seen before and have to go digging to find the answers.
Another thing we had was after market help from the school as well. If you had a problem or question a year later you could call your old instructor and talk directly to him.

[Speedy Petey]

Doug, that is truly a shame. I guess those sorts of things go on in every aspect of life.

[Scott Schultz]

There's nothing worse than ambiguity. It says plain as day on the label "Do not install within 3 inches of insulation" But, if you take apart the unit and read the INSIDE label, it might be ok to do so. I wish things were just clear cut....either you can or you can't. PERIOD.

[rkeith]

Thanks Gentelmen,
But here is the problem, I am viewing this fixture from the attic space. The light is high above a staircase and hard to get to from that side. I thought the I.C designation was supposed to be clearly shown on top of the can (I have seen this).
Rusty

[Blaine Wiley]

When I'm in that position I write up the light. It says on them to remove the label, and the label is still on it. Make the installer prove the condition is safe.

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

This is my standard disclaimer because I'm not taking light fixtures apart and examining bulb wattages:

"We were unable to confirm that the recessed lights are designed to be installed in ceilings surrounded by insulation (IC rated). Recessed light fixtures that are installed in insulated ceilings can represent a fire hazard if they are not suitably rated for this application. Unfortunately, it is difficult to verify that the installation has been made correctly during a home inspection as the manufacturer's label is often inside the light fixture assembly. It is recommended that a licensed electrician be engaged to verify the safety of the system."

[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by rkeith

The picture shows a label that reads DO NOT HAVE INSULATION WITHIN 3 INCHES UNLESS FOR i.c application. Insulation all over it. What is I.C?
Thanks
Rusty

Write it up Rusty.
In an IC installation the labels are supposed to be removed.
Who ever comes behind you to correct any defects called out in your report will verify that the installation is IC compliant and remove ALL the labels, or they will find it is not IC compliant and remove ALL of the insulation within 3" of the can, or they won't do anything at all.

You do not have time, nor are you getting paid enough to check every light in the ceiling.
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[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by Speedy Petey

Lightolier Lytening is the same way. The same can is used for both IC and non-IC applications. The trim and lamp determine the rating.

There is NO WAY to tell without removing the trim.



The term IC means "Insulated ceiling" as Marc stated, or "In contact" as in "in contact with insulation".
Isn't the term "I.C." covered in H-I seminars or classes?

Might have slept throught that part of the class myself, like the installer.

[Blaine Wiley]

Originally Posted by bkelly2

Might have slept throught that part of the class myself, like the installer.

Now that is funny, I don't care who you are, that there is funny!