InterNACHI


Go Back   InterNACHI Inspection Forum > Specific Inspection Topics > Electrical Inspections

Notices

Electrical Inspections Contains discussions about electrical systems. This includes receptacles, panels, wiring, etc.

 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 5/30/07, 8:09 PM
jkogel jkogel is offline
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sooke, BC
Posts: 699
Please Note: jkogel is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Funky installation of sub-panel

This is a subpanel in a workshop where the owner ran his antique Forney arc welder amongst other things. He ran triplex wire, 2 insulated and 1 unisulated Al from the back of the house thru the trees to the shop about 80 feet.
Besides the cobwebs and rust in the panel, we see #10 copper supplying 40 amps.
But how about the aluminum grounding conductor, a left-over chunk of the triplex? The second picture shows the other end of that GC, parts of which were buried under needles and leaves for 15 years and only the steel core is left to carry the juice.
[IMG]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/1/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.jpg[/IMG]
This is not from an inspection, it's a reno in progress and we have ripped out the funky wiring to the shop.
My question? If there was a four-strand feed from the house, 3 insulated and one grounding wire, does the sub panel still need to be grounded to a rod? Is Al ever acceptable for grounding?

Last edited by jkogel; 10/23/08 at 10:30 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 5/30/07, 8:23 PM
Jeffrey R. Pope's Avatar
Jeffrey R. Pope Jeffrey R. Pope is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Santa Clarita, CA
Posts: 8,047
Default Re: Funky installation of sub-panel

If it's a detached structure, it requires its own grounding electrode, no matter if it's a 3-wire or 4-wire feed (there is an exception to that rule for a single branch circuit).

AL can be used as the grounding electrode conductor (or any other type of conductor for that matter).



IF YOUR INSPECTOR IS NOT USING THERMAL IMAGING, YOU'RE NOT GETTING THE WHOLE PICTURE ®
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
Santa Clarita CA
(661) 212-0738
Santa Clarita Home Inspection
http://www.MyInspector.net



Last edited by jpope; 5/30/07 at 8:26 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 5/30/07, 8:59 PM
brian winkle brian winkle is offline
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Arizona
Posts: 454
Please Note: brian winkle is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Funky installation of sub-panel

John, just as a point of information, if the #10's on the 40 amp breaker you mentioned were for the welder circuit, keep in mind that overcurrent protection for welders and welder circuits are determined by Article 630, and may be sized at up to 300% of the conductor rating.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 5/30/07, 10:19 PM
rromoser's Avatar
rromoser rromoser is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Fishers, IN
Posts: 187
Default Re: Funky installation of sub-panel

Regarding the GEC... Art. 250.64 (A) Aluminum grounding electrode conductors shall not be terminated within 18 inches of the earth.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 5/30/07, 10:58 PM
jkogel jkogel is offline
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sooke, BC
Posts: 699
Please Note: jkogel is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Funky installation of sub-panel

OK, sorry about the B+W pdf's, BTW.

Is it acceptable to run 240 vac by way of triplex, where the nuetral is uninsulated?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 5/31/07, 8:59 PM
jkogel jkogel is offline
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sooke, BC
Posts: 699
Please Note: jkogel is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Question Re: Funky installation of sub-panel

Brian, the 40 amp breaker is a main shutoff and the circuit dedicated to the welder is a 30 amp. My feeling is that while this worked OK for years, there has been a shock hazard because of the inadequate grounding and maybe a fire hazard from the light supply conductors and the corrosion in the panel.

The other shock hazard I'm asking about, is it OK to have an uninsulated nuetral, using triplex to supply 240 vac? I could look this up, but think the educational factor here is good for all.

Check out the welding cables. Do not hold the stinger in your right and the ground clamp in your left simultaneously, while standing on the bare welding cables in your sneakers!

Last edited by jkogel; 11/10/08 at 10:27 PM..
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
National Electrical Code Information and Discussion jtedesco1 Electrical Inspections 50 6/15/10 7:28 PM
Panel Inspection Safety roconnor Electrical Inspections 10 9/24/06 9:02 PM
Electrical Panel Installation csteele Electrical Inspections 12 9/19/06 9:30 AM
Bad electrical problem Pest Guy Electrical Inspections 4 1/20/06 9:26 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 3:40 AM.


Popular Sections

:

All Sections

Inspection News

InterNACHI Membership

Inspection Standards

Inspection Education

InterNACHI Inspectors

Inspection Links

 

 

 

NACHI.ORG Statistics

 

 

no new posts