International Association of Certified Home Inspectors
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| Electrical Inspections Contains discussions about electrical systems. This includes receptacles, panels, wiring, etc. |
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#16
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Sure.....remember now we are talking about two different things here. The 6' requirement is from the edge of the sink. That is a utility sink, wet bar sink and Laundry sink....not a kitchen sink !!!
GFCI is required when serving the countertop receptacles in a kitchen BUT the 6' requirement only comes into play on in regards to the location of the receptacles as it relates to Wet Bars, Laundry Sinks and Utility Sinks so it is easy to confuse the two requirements. Just remember that also once your state is enforcing the 2008 NEC, any sink in non-dwelling buildings will have the 6' requirement as well...just figured I would remind all those commercial inspectors out there. Paul W. Abernathy,CMI,CPI,CME National Electrical Code Expert Electrical & Fire Protection Systems Code Supervisor- Alexandria,VA Weekly Live Radio Show :http://en.1000mikes.com/show/the_electrical_guru Weekly Chat on Wednesdays -7:30 PM E.S.T * Get my 13 hour commentary audio CD for the book "How to Perform Electrical Inspections" 2007 InterNACHI Member of the Year |
| Find an InterNACHI certified Tennessee Home Inspector (and anywhere else in North America) |
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#17
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Please Note:
relliott is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Quote:
I know not required (nor do I call it out but if the other side of the island wall has GFCI than why not that? |
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#18
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Because it is unlikely to be used as a convenience outlet or for small appliances
Chuck Evans (TREC #7657) Level III Infraspection Institute Certified Infrared Thermographer (#8402) HomeCert Houston Home Inspections & Thermal Inspections Find us on Facebook Houston Thermal Inspections & Infrared Imaging Find us on Facebook Houston Home Inspector Houston, TX |
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#19
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Quote:
It's all in the codes my friend...all in the codes.... Paul W. Abernathy,CMI,CPI,CME National Electrical Code Expert Electrical & Fire Protection Systems Code Supervisor- Alexandria,VA Weekly Live Radio Show :http://en.1000mikes.com/show/the_electrical_guru Weekly Chat on Wednesdays -7:30 PM E.S.T * Get my 13 hour commentary audio CD for the book "How to Perform Electrical Inspections" 2007 InterNACHI Member of the Year |
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#20
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Paul,
I recently ran into an upscale home that had custom kitchen cabinetry with built in spring loaded shelving that brought a large food mixer up to counter level. It was pre-wired inside the cabinet so the unit was always plugged in. The shelving brought the unit up to even with counter level about 4 feet away from the kitchen sink. It was not GFCI protected but I recommended it due to final positioning of the cabinet / appliance when in use. What say you? Stephen Stanczyk Washington State Licensed Home Inspector # 221 President, Washington Association of Property Inspectors (WAPI) (253) 241-0602 calls answered until 10pm Pierce County -Thurston County - King County - Snohomish County |
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#21
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Please Note:
relliott is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Quote:
Guess the HVAC guy has more value placed on his life (insert joke here) Please tell me what a extra outlet not used for a large appliance might else be used for. 1 2 3 4 |
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#22
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Please Note:
rmaday is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
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#23
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I recommend a GFCI for this area for two reasons.....One, like the unfinished part of a basement where GFCIs are required, this area is subject to discovering a puddle or two from a leaking drain or service pipe/valve.
The second reason is by demonstration. Usually, as I bend over and reach under the sink to plug/unplug something into the receptacle, my other hand is on or in the sink for balance. When I explain the advantages of GFCIs to clients, the word "code" never comes up. It is a safety device on the market that can save a life. Why not install them under the sink? James H. Bushart Professional Building Analyst, BPI Missouri, Kansas and Arkansas 314-803-2167 Inspecting in Aurora, Branson, Carthage, Granby, Joplin, Kimberling City, Monett, Mount Vernon, Neosho, Nixa, Purdy, Reed Spring, Republic, Springfield and surrounding areas. |
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#24
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Quote:
Chuck Evans (TREC #7657) Level III Infraspection Institute Certified Infrared Thermographer (#8402) HomeCert Houston Home Inspections & Thermal Inspections Find us on Facebook Houston Thermal Inspections & Infrared Imaging Find us on Facebook Houston Home Inspector Houston, TX |
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#25
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Please Note:
jack Davenport is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Keep in mind that sometimes the receptacle under the sink may have 2 circuits on it.
1 for the dishwasher and 1 for the disposal. GFCI receptacle would not work in this situation. Another problem with replacing the receptacle with a GFCI is if it has the disposal and the dishwasher plugged in to it is the disposal is switch controlled and the dishwasher is not. GFCI receptacles will not operate properly like this. |
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#26
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The problem is they dont serve the counter top in the example. The NEC is clear on what has to happen to be considered serving the countertop. Now, with that said it is perfectly FINE to suggest GFCI's anywhere you feel it is needed. Never feel uptight about recommending GFCI protection. The problem is when an HI does not recommend it but says that code would require it and in this case it would not.
Paul W. Abernathy,CMI,CPI,CME National Electrical Code Expert Electrical & Fire Protection Systems Code Supervisor- Alexandria,VA Weekly Live Radio Show :http://en.1000mikes.com/show/the_electrical_guru Weekly Chat on Wednesdays -7:30 PM E.S.T * Get my 13 hour commentary audio CD for the book "How to Perform Electrical Inspections" 2007 InterNACHI Member of the Year |
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#27
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"Code requirements" are subjective and can only be "required" by the AHJ who enforces it. Pity the poor inspector...and his soon-to-be starving, homeless family....who quotes a "code requirement" that kills a deal and the homeowner who loses the sale brings THE authority having jurisdiction to look at the so-called defect, and who does not agree with the home inspector. When you read the code book....particularly the administrative sections....you quickly find where the authority having jurisdiction is THE last word. What you call out as a defect is ONLY a code violation if HE says it is. What you call a code violation in a report or in a conversation with a client....is nothing more than an exercise in ESP. Now, it is correct to say that "In some instances, some AHJs have considered this to be a code violation", but the very fact that you are looking at it and seeing it exist is a good possibility that some other AHJ did not. GFCIs save lives. If there were no code references to them at all, we as home inspectors should recommend them in every area where they could prevent electrocution. This is how we must see our jobs. Any other vision of what we do (as home inspectors) is a fantasy. James H. Bushart Professional Building Analyst, BPI Missouri, Kansas and Arkansas 314-803-2167 Inspecting in Aurora, Branson, Carthage, Granby, Joplin, Kimberling City, Monett, Mount Vernon, Neosho, Nixa, Purdy, Reed Spring, Republic, Springfield and surrounding areas. |
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#28
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Please Note:
relliott is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Quote:
I make exceptions only for State code on smoke and carbon monoxide detectors which requires them with in 15 feet of bedrooms in my area though I use that only to declare that I recommend them in bedrooms. AHJ's do not like competition they say. |
| Find an InterNACHI certified Tennessee Home Inspector (and anywhere else in North America) |
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#29
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Where do you draw the line? Do you also recommend upgrading 2-wire electrical systems for safety reasons? He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors - Thomas Jefferson - Founding Father |
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#30
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Please Note:
relliott is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Quote:
It is all opinion ,and that is his. |
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