Main Breaker

[sfalvey]

I am wondering if I missed something here?

The meter is on the outside of the home, no disconnect noted, inside the basement is the panel directly below the outside meter with main coming through the siding right to the panel. No main breaker in the panel.

Does this seem accurate?

[wsiegel]

If all you have is six throws, then you do not need a main breaker. It looks like you have six in that picture.

If I am looking at that correctly, the ground wires are all bunched up under one lug. That is a no-no.

The wires leaving the box are not protected from physical damage.

Looks like yo have plenty to write up.

[Speedy Petey]

There is only one way that would be compliant: If there were six two-pole breakers in that main lug panel.
Obviously that is not the case.

Just one look at the workmanship/mess should cause you to defer to an qualifed electrician.

[Mike Whitt]

Huston we have a problem.

That panel has more than 10% of its overcurrent devices protected at 30 amps or less that also has a grounded (neutral) so no matter if there is no more than six disconnects or not it is required to have no fewer than two mains.

I would write this up as a cluster sex orgy and needs attention.

[rwand1]

Is a cluster sex orgy an electrical term?

[jtedesco1]

Looks like the SE cable is missing a sill plate and may be of questionable condition. If this cable in in a driveway it would require protection from physical damage.I cannot see the pictures clearly here on my palm and I am in the airport waiting for a flight home.

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

Looks like the SE cable is missing a sill plate...

A bigger screen shows that the sill plate does exist in that installation.

I am aware that sill plates for SE cable are manufactured, but I am unaware of any specific NEC, UL, or manufacturer requirement that they are to be used. They sure make for a more "finished" appearance often times, and may provide some mechanical benefit. That said, in areas where load side SE cable accepted, I'm not sure what would compel me to use a sill plate, save for the fact that they exist and it "seems" like the thing to do. I am well aware that cable that is exposed to physical damage requires protection, but I'd be hard pressed to say that the last 4" of SE cable before it goes through the wall is any more subject to physical damage than the other 4 feet up to the meter socket.

[jtedesco1]

MarcPlease look at 230.50 for the protection rule. In MA we have an amendment calling for protection because a kid used a hacksaw once to cut the cable for scrap. Got to go now plane ready to depart.

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Ok.....

The SE Cables sheath does not extend into the enclosure, Also it is clear to see that a main breaker is needed....while it is entirely possible for the 6 disconnect rule to apply with this enclosure...it does not in this shown setup and would indeed require the main.
Also it appears the majority of cables are not supported properly......simply defer for evaluation from an electrical contractor.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by pabernathy

Ok.....

The SE Cables sheath does not extend into the enclosure, Also it is clear to see that a main breaker is needed....while it is entirely possible for the 6 disconnect rule to apply with this enclosure...it does not in this shown setup and would indeed require the main.
Also it appears the majority of cables are not supported properly......simply defer for evaluation from an electrical contractor.

Where it is evident that a main is necessary...we would defer for repair or replacement, and additional evaluation by a qualified electrical contractor. A qualified electrical contractor who, in this case, would argue against the need for a main would be in error. Correct? Especially considering the possibility that it was a qualified electrical contractor who installed this service panel to begin with.

[jtedesco1]

Originally Posted by jbushart

Where it is evident that a main is necessary...we would defer for repair or replacement, and additional evaluation by a qualified electrical contractor. A qualified electrical contractor who, in this case, would argue against the need for a main would be in error. Correct? Especially considering the possibility that it was a qualified electrical contractor who installed this service panel to begin with.

YES! I counted 11 overcurrent protective devices in this panelboard. I also see where the existing cables appear to be without an equipment grounding conductor since they are the old 2 wire types, and if they did have the EGC may have been the earlier types with one size smaller. The gas pipe, although there for many years would present a question in an installation today, because the space above that equipment is restricted to electrical materials, etc.

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

Electrical geniuses,

Is the double tap on the right side of the panel of no concern?

[jtedesco1]

Originally Posted by mkyriacou

Electrical geniuses,

Is the double tap on the right side of the panel of no concern?

I ain't no genius, but I would write that it up too!

[Mike Whitt]

Originally Posted by jbushart

Where it is evident that a main is necessary...we would defer for repair or replacement, and additional evaluation by a qualified electrical contractor. A qualified electrical contractor who, in this case, would argue against the need for a main would be in error. Correct? Especially considering the possibility that it was a qualified electrical contractor who installed this service panel to begin with.

Any panel including one that has only six single pole breakers that has more than 10% of its breakers 30 amps or less and also utilizes the grounded (neutral) conductor is required to have a main. This is covered in 408.36 of the NEC and has been in place for many years.

Never jump to the conclusion that just because it is present that a “qualified” electrician made the installation. Not all electricians are qualified and some should be run out of town.

[James H. Bushart]

Originally Posted by Mike Whitt

Never jump to the conclusion that just because it is present that a “qualified” electrician made the installation. Not all electricians are qualified and some should be run out of town.

Mike,

You are the one who is jumping to conclusions.

Re-read my post.