This metal garage door was alive!

[jtedesco1]

This metal garage door was alive!

http://www.youtube.com/v/yiZFjRA_Gs4&rel=1

Are they checked by the inspector during a home inspection?

PS: What do I have to do to get the actual picture of the start up video posted?

[msylvester]

How sad...

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Joe,
I cant see the video because i am in a airport heading to a seminar ( Motorola Q)..but i will say home inspectors are probably not check garage doors for voltage because testing would generally require them to use a voltage meter....and it is usually not in there arsenal.....some may but the majority wont.....sad thing is the resistance to learning about suretests is only matched by the resistance to use of a good volt meter. ;(

[msylvester]

I check aluminum siding but have never checked the garage door.

I will now!

[mthomas2]

Would a non-contact (Tic-Tracker) detector likely have found this?

[msylvester]

It should.

[Michael W. Gault]

Originally Posted by mthomas2

Would a non-contact (Tic-Tracker) detector likely have found this?

It should...

Tragic story all around.

[Greg Fretwell]

There had to be several violations for this to happen. The ungrounded switch loop was only one of them. How was the garage door opener wired? (where did that power come from) Why didn't that EGC clear the fault?

I agree the bottom line is they should have had permits and inspections but I am not convinced a lot of muni inspectors actually inspect anything. The EC is ultimately responsible and I imagine he will simply be bankrupted in a wrongful death suit. The wireman who actually killed this kid will probably get away scot free.

[William J. Decker]

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

This metal garage door was alive!

http://www.youtube.com/v/yiZFjRA_Gs4&rel=1

Are they checked by the inspector during a home inspection?

PS: What do I have to do to get the actual picture of the start up video posted?

Please note these facts in the video:

1) The electrician believed he, and the others in that area, new better than the law. A permit was "technically" required (as in, "Legally required") but not obtained. Yeah, the law says we have to, but we have decided that we don't and we are electricians and we know better than the law".)

2) Because of the above, the code guys didn't find the problem. This is clearly a case where the contractor messes up, but everyone wants to blame the codies.

3) Note that the electrician chose to not use the correct and required wire. Question? If the installation have been in EMT instead of romex, whould the outcome have been different (because, properly installed, the EMT is always grounded?)

4) This is why most of the good electricians that I know install GFCI receptacles for garage door openers. If the current came from a ground fault in the garage door opener, a GFCI would have stopped it.

5) In short, the negligence of the "professionals" killed this kid. Sure, it's beyind the SOP, but I always check every exterior metal piece with a ticker.

Hope this helps;

[Speedy Petey]

William,


1) This is NOT always the fault of the electrician. Most times when a GC does not open a building permit the electrician does not get electrical permits so as not to expose the GC's unpermitted job.
No, I do not "know better than the law". This is just simple facts of real life in our world.

2) Not blamin the "codies", but WHY if a building permit WAS issued, were electrical inspections not required??? In most places a building permit will not be closed without proper inspections all around.

3) EMT? For a residential garage wire??? Maybe in Chicago, not in the real world.
"properly installed, the EMT is always grounded"...Oh yeah. You've not seen some of the installs I have. What if the feed end is not made up or the fitting is loose or does not exist? What then? You know what...NO ground.
What if the conduit rusts away? No ground.
What if the conduit gets hit and the fitting breaks? No ground.
EMT without a separate grounding conductor pulled is far worse IMO than any cable wiring method.

4) Most "good electricans"? I am a very good electrican and I have never installed a GFI for an opener. I never even considered it. I see no reason for it. Rather I make sure my installations are up to code and safe. A properly grounded garage door/opener would have prevented this and any other tradgedies.

5) Here I do NOT disagree. The one guy who wired a 3-way switch using "2-wire" instead of "3-wire", in turn using a bare ground to carry current, killed this kid. NO ONE else.

[Ian Gills]

A tragic illustration of Abernathy's powerpoint that shows ground will not trip the breaker. I think it's time to switch to three wire on the range.

I'll do that.

[cbuell]

3) EMT? For a residential garage wire??? Maybe in Chicago, not in the real world.
"properly installed, the EMT is always grounded"...Oh yeah. You've not seen some of the installs I have. What if the feed end is not made up or the fitting is loose or does not exist? What then? You know what...NO ground.
What if the conduit rusts away? No ground.
What if the conduit gets hit and the fitting breaks? No ground.
EMT without a separate grounding conductor pulled is far worse IMO than any cable wiring method.

This picture re-inforces the problems that can arise when the conduit is used to provide a ground path to a remote distribution panel.

[jtedesco1]

... and when the rust sets in this is the result!

[Frank P. Newman]

All the examples above point out vividly the importance of installing a grounding conductor for all circuits. The additional cost is negligable when compared to the potential consequences.

Maybe I missed it, but in all the information presented, did anyone say exactly why and how the door itself became energized?

[Richard L. Bennett]

Poor reporting of a cause of death

I do not understand how the wrong wire caused the door to be hot

The building code in my area would have never picked up on the 14-2 14-3 problem

Some one draw me a pix of how a mis wired 3 way light made the door hot

This is a case where money will not solve the problem

rlb