More than 6 hand moves on distribution panels

[Greg Fretwell]

Article 100 tries to help you sort this out.

Accessible, Readily (Readily Accessible). Capable of being reached quickly for operation, renewal, or inspections without requiring those to whom ready access is requisite to climb over or remove obstacles or to resort to portable ladders, and so forth.
Handbook commentary
The definition of readily accessible does not preclude the use of a locked door for service equipment or rooms containing service equipment, provided those for whom ready access is necessary have a key (or lock combination) available. For example, 230.70(A)(1) and 230.205(A) require service-disconnecting means to be readily accessible. Section 225.32 requires that feeder disconnecting means for separate buildings be readily accessible. A commonly used, permitted practice is to locate the disconnecting means in the electrical equipment room of an office building or large apartment building and to keep the door to that room locked to prevent access by unauthorized persons. Section 240.24(A) requires that overcurrent devices be so located as to be readily accessible.

[Jeffrey R. Pope]

Originally Posted by rray

There apparently were so many home inspectors calling out such stupidity in one of our high rises here that the builder came back in and put service disconnects in all the "main panels" in each unit.

I rest my case.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by jpope

I rest my case.

Not sure what you're resting, but you probably need the rest.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

Article 100 tries to help you sort this out.

I'm quite familiar with Article 100, but as we all know, sometimes even the codes are stupid, which, I believe, is one of the reasons why they change every three years or so.

[Jeffrey R. Pope]

Individual units don't have "main" panels. They have "load side equipment" which may be referred to as remote panels or even lighting panels.

You cannot disconnect the "service" from the remote panel located within a unit.

From the NEC

Service. The conductors and equipment for delivering electric energy from the serving utility to the wiring system of the premises served.

[Greg Fretwell]

Codes change every 3 years to sell books.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by jpope

Individual units don't have "main" panels. They have "load side equipment" which may be referred to as remote panels or even lighting panels.

When it is the only panel that the Client has access to, it is their "main panel."

Originally Posted by jpope

You cannot disconnect the "service" from the remote panel located within a unit.

That ol' main service disconnect in the "main panel" sure does a good job of disconnecting electrical service to everything in the condo. Clients seem to understand that if they need to disconnect electricity to everything in their condo. that ol' main service disconnect right ther, the one labeled "service disconnect," is the one to use. Quick and easy, not to mention understandable to them.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

Codes change every 3 years to sell books.

Hmmmmmmmm.
Seems like they could take a lesson from the software companies then, and release new versions each year, updates, etc. Imagine:

NEC 2006 version 1.1.3.9.1a

That would be funny.

[Jeffrey R. Pope]

Originally Posted by rray

That ol' main service disconnect in the "main panel" sure does a good job of disconnecting electrical service to everything in the condo. Clients seem to understand that if they need to disconnect electricity to everything in their condo. that ol' main service disconnect right ther, the one labeled "service disconnect," is the one to use. Quick and easy, not to mention understandable to them.

It just puzzles me as to why someone who claims to "educate" their clients, insists on educating them in ebonics

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by jpope

It just puzzles me as to why someone who claims to "educate" their clients, insists on educating them in ebonics

I know it puzzles you, and I can't do anything about that because I seem to talk in a language that you don't understand. However, I do specialize in talking with my Clients in a language that they understand. I'm not trying to educate any of my Clients to become home inspectors, electricians, plumbers, etc. I'm educating them about safety and maintenance in their homes. And for that, the easiest way to educate someone is to speak in a language that they understand. And judging from business and referrals, they seem to like that just dandy! I have no egotistical need to use technical jargon or post code section after code section after code section that is dull, boring, and uninteresting to the average person, just to prove that I know technical jargon or can cite and post codes. Just the facts, man, just the facts, and in plain English, please!

I also see nothing wrong with Ebonics if it helps people learn the safety and maintenance concerns about their properties. I wish I knew Ebonics, Spanish, and a few other languages. I could have 50% market share here. Of course, I might have to hire some resident aliens to help me.

[Russel Ray]

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[Paul W. Abernathy]

lol....ok....I was going to jump in here but hell I don't know where the thread is leading...lol....so I wont...

Comment on what GREG said...yes to sell books is the main thing I agree 100% with this theory...

My other idea is to correct issues made in effor in a pervious version...lol...many times they use a newer revision to clarrify verbage that was not clear in a previous version.....so they are ever changing and actually is a good thing.....over the years I have seen some items go back and forth.....they have good intentions......just wish it would move to every 5 years....lol

[Greg Fretwell]

I would like to see a 10 year moritorium on code changes. The "churn" is worse than any added safety you would get from most changes. Electricity hasn't changed that much from when Edison sold it and we act like the principle of how wire and switches work changes every day. The code was originally just a guideline for minimum levels of safety. Now it has become a marketing tool.

[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

I would like to see a 10 year moritorium on code changes. The "churn" is worse than any added safety you would get from most changes. Electricity hasn't changed that much from when Edison sold it and we act like the principle of how wire and switches work changes every day. The code was originally just a guideline for minimum levels of safety. Now it has become a marketing tool.

Greg, code book publishers, code teachers, and Navajo Code talkers have to eat too.

[Bruce M. Graham]

So, thats a no on needing 6 throws on a sub panel (load side equipment). I think that was the original question.