A new way to assure that the ground rod is set deep enough

[Greg Fretwell]

There was about 25v between "earth" and the EGC/Neutral in my panel.
Grounding the service made them close to zero.

[tdietrich1]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

There was about 25v between "earth" and the EGC/Neutral in my panel.

WOW, I'd run that through and inverter, then a transformer, and wallah! Free electricity!

tom

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

There was about 25v between "earth" and the EGC/Neutral in my panel.
Grounding the service made them close to zero.

I guess it never dawned on you to fix the source of that current?

[Mike Whitt]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

There was about 25v between "earth" and the EGC/Neutral in my panel.
Grounding the service made them close to zero.

I would forget about the earthing and fix that loose neutral if it were me

[Greg Fretwell]

This is just what they call "stray voltage", not hard to do when you live in a sand box. I have measured as high as 35v between GECs of buildings 100' or so apart. Back in the olden days when every house was bonded together with copper pipe these gradients were minimized. Now with all the plastic every GEC is a world of it's own. You sure can't count on the neutrals between transformers to be a lot of help. I walked around with my new clamp on shortly after I got it, looking at the #8 on power poles to the ground rod. They all had several amps on them.

[Greg Fretwell]

My phase to phase seems OK so if there is a loose neutral problem it is on the FPL side of XO

[Speedy Petey]

Originally Posted by Marc D. Shunk

I guess it never dawned on you to fix the source of that current?

Originally Posted by Mike Whitt

I would forget about the earthing and fix that loose neutral if it were me

As I scroll down I was thinking the same thing. The ground rod just masked the real problem.

[Greg Fretwell]

As I said, if it was a loose neutral it was on the line side of the XO terminal. My line to neutral was the same on both sides. I did look around a bit before I went to the clamp. This was not my first rodeo

[Richard L. Bennett]

Mike

"Not if the grounded Neutral is installed correctly"

Just float the ground with a bad conection as stated and voltage difference between floor and stove case

Thus corrected by conecting the ground wire to the ground rod

So was is your statement saying??

Back to the question -- where would someone get upset with a current reading???

rlb

[Greg Fretwell]

Mike was right, the "grounded neutral" was not installed right, it wasn't "grounded". On the other hand a terazzo floor is very well grounded (pretty much a Ufer)

[Richard L. Bennett]

Do not see the original problem

Just see the answer to the problem

A little normal dirt (carbon and grease) can bridge a conection in a stove to its case and make it a little hot --- this is normal -- This is why the case is grounded (not hooked to a neutral)

This is why the problem went away when the "Floor ground" and the stove ground were hooked together

----

Another ground question --- What current flow would one expect from building ground 1 and building ground 2??? Normal - over current under current at what range - above an amp to below an amp at 60hz

rlb

[Greg Fretwell]

OK here was the sequence, you decide
Shock to floor
1. plug a meter lead into countertop 5-15 EGC, clip to cook top (240v load only)
no joy (still shock)

2. Plug ECOS tester in 5-15 (sure test kinda thing) test OK


3. With ground test adapter, check EGC in cooktop OK.

4. In panel looks regular (lugs tight etc), phase to phase 123 on both sides, 246 L/L. Neutral on the bare SE conductors to all EGC busses zero.

5.Go outside, clamp is nasty looking, get a fresh one from my bag of tricks and replace it. While apart I get buzzed. That is where I got 25v, rod to GEC.

FPL may be trying to kill me but I don't have anything in particular I could make them fix. They are giving me a "nominal balanced 120/240". From my experience in the "surge" business, that is all they will guarantee.
If you live in a place where the whole city is a grid of metal pipe, "ground" might actually mean something but out in the sticks ... which will be suburban McMansions plumbed with plastic at the street, "ground" is just a mythical potential that will change across the street. I saw lots of "ground shift" once IBM started connecting buildings together with wire. My "25v" was not even surprising.

[Greg Fretwell]

We were bonding the severs between buildings together with #4cu and you always had close to an amp (probably peak, not RMS with the meters we had in those days), mosty nasty noise if you looked at it on a scope.
If I was building a complex today that didn't have a fiber backbone I would put a ground plane under the whole place with fat copper ... that was traditionally water pipe. Your computers will thank you.

[Richard L. Bennett]

Greg

Some do not seem to understand why we should test for some of these things

Using the eye does not always work

Perhaps some HI type of test or equipment (simple) is needed

rlb

[William J. Decker]

I agree, Greg. I used to work with computers, many years ago, and had a client with about 200 terminals (before PCs got popular). When wiring them up, I found that the system would crap out regularly. Through much trial and error, I found that, when whring the RS connection, if I did not connect the ground at the terminal end, everything went well.

Turned out that the building had a large ground leak. Construction, next door, had destroyed the ground.

BTW: On this house (the original post), I spoke to the electrician this morning. Recommended that he do UFER grounds. He had no idea what that was. Education time.