Panel Labeling

[Perfect Gent]

I was extremely bored at work the other day as I finished installing a new service.... So as my mind started wandering as I placed the stickers on the panel (numbers, disconnect, main, etc..) when I saw a bag of spanish labels and wondered what would happen if I used them instead of the english ones... I skimmed the codebook but didn't see anything about what language and or if both stickers had to be used....

** I obviously stuck the english directions on the panel but I just thought it was something to ponder, anyone have any info. about this?

[William J. Decker]

Originally Posted by Perfect Gent

I was extremely bored at work the other day as I finished installing a new service.... So as my mind started wandering as I placed the stickers on the panel (numbers, disconnect, main, etc..) when I saw a bag of spanish labels and wondered what would happen if I used them instead of the english ones... I skimmed the codebook but didn't see anything about what language and or if both stickers had to be used....

** I obviously stuck the english directions on the panel but I just thought it was something to ponder, anyone have any info. about this?

Simple, and a no brainer.

An unlabled panel is a (National) code violation.

Why didn't you label it as you were installing it?

At least, label it (as it was being installed) in a language you understand.

In that way, if the client (who you are supposedly working for) will understanding it.

You where installing a new service? Are you a licensed an insured electrical contractor? If not, why where you installing the service?

If you were working as a sub, didn't you care enough about your employer (the GC) and the boss's client (the home owner) to NOT BE FREAKIN' BORED and just do you job to the best quaility you could?

This is not brain surgury, guy.

Why are you confused as to your required level of professional service and responsibility?

"Skimmed the codebook"?

Do you only do your work to the minimum, lowest standards. Don't you take any pride in your work? Why didn't you do the best job you could?

Professionaism means pride and making each job better than the next one.

If you were just having a bad day, I can understand. I've been there. But pull youself together.

You are getting paid for your work. Earn the pay.

Hope this helps;

[ldapkus]

Perfect Gent
New User

Not the "Perfect Gent" he portrayed himself to be.

[jtedesco1]

408.4 Circuit Directory or Circuit Identification.

Every circuit and circuit modification shall be legibly identified as to its clear, evident, and specific purpose or use. The identification
shall include sufficient detail to allow each circuit to be distinguished from all others. Spare positions that contain unused overcurrent devices or switches shall be described accordingly. The identification shall be included in a circuit directory that is located on the face or inside of the panel door in the case of a panelboard, and located at each switch on a switchboard. No circuit shall be described in a manner that depends on transient conditions of occupancy.

2008 nec

[Speedy Petey]

"You where installing a new service? Are you a licensed an insured electrical contractor? If not, why where you installing the service?"

"If you were working as a sub, didn't you care enough about your employer (the GC) and the boss's client (the home owner) to NOT BE FREAKIN' BORED and just do you job to the best quaility you could?"

"Why are you confused as to your required level of professional service and responsibility?"

"Do you only do your work to the minimum, lowest standards. Don't you take any pride in your work? Why didn't you do the best job you could?"

"You are getting paid for your work. Earn the pay."



WOW Bill! You read WAY more into that post than I did.

I will say though, I DO smell a troll.

[Bob Electric]

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

408.4 Circuit Directory or Circuit Identification.

Every circuit and circuit modification shall be legibly identified as to its clear, evident, and specific purpose or use. The identification
shall include sufficient detail to allow each circuit to be distinguished from all others. Spare positions that contain unused overcurrent devices or switches shall be described accordingly. The identification shall be included in a circuit directory that is located on the face or inside of the panel door in the case of a panelboard, and located at each switch on a switchboard. No circuit shall be described in a manner that depends on transient conditions of occupancy.

2008 nec

Joe Knows Code.

[Speedy Petey]

408.4 is the watermark of circuit labeling.
This is what tells us we cannot label a circuit "Billy's Room".

[William J. Decker]

Originally Posted by Speedy Petey

"You where installing a new service? Are you a licensed an insured electrical contractor? If not, why where you installing the service?"

"If you were working as a sub, didn't you care enough about your employer (the GC) and the boss's client (the home owner) to NOT BE FREAKIN' BORED and just do you job to the best quaility you could?"

"Why are you confused as to your required level of professional service and responsibility?"

"Do you only do your work to the minimum, lowest standards. Don't you take any pride in your work? Why didn't you do the best job you could?"

"You are getting paid for your work. Earn the pay."



WOW Bill! You read WAY more into that post than I did.

I will say though, I DO smell a troll.

Sorry if this came off harsh. I was not so much reacting to Mr. Gent., but to my experience.

I have met and talked to some licensed and union electricians in this area who REALLY try VERY hard to do the bare minimum they can possibly get away with and take great offence when I call them on it.

Then they get all high and mighty, claiming that I don't know what I am talking about because they are electricians and I am not.

An additional factor, in this area, is that Chicago has its own codes and these bear little resemblence to the NEC.

No ROMEX and all wire in EMT or pipe (even low voltage wire, in commercial buildings, like computer cable and the like)

No "mini breakers"

stuff like this.

They seem to believe that the Chicago code came down, right behind Moses, off of Mt. Sinai.

Maybe this is because the clocal Chicago electrical code was written by the unions. And you know how difficult unions can be.

[Bob Elliott]

Perfect Gent.
To answer your question.
What I get out of this , is that since English has never been named the official language of this country, you could do it .
How is that for a staight answer.

[Richard W. Washington]

Actually a very good question that he is posing. I think it would be ok to put it in Spanish

In some parts of Houston the street signs are both vietnamese and english. when you have the voting ballots in about 4 or 5 languages,what's next?

yes I believe if this country doesn't start getting away from all the political correctness garbage that we will have panelboxes in different languages.

[Perfect Gent]

Holy smokes William, I was really just kind of halfway kidding in my post... I just wanted to pick a couple of inspectors brains when it comes to panel labeling.
I will try to explain myself a little better but first let me give you a little background as to what I do and what I was working on...
I am a licensed electrician. I am working on an old factory building that has been around since the early 1900's... The building is 3 storys and hasn't been used for production since the late 70's ... The previous owner of the building sold it to a friend of his who is using most of the building as storage space for any and all types of customers.
The new owner was trying to have some simple electrical work done when it was discovered that 1 phase was missing from the whole building (They had their own incoming power coming from a fenced area in the back of the building)
The building was shut down and we installed a main service downstairs with 2 panels on each floor...

Now enough about me and my daily grind... I was not trying to be a smartass when making my original post. I was just trying to pick some minds of some very smart and expierienced electrical minds around here that I respect the opinions of.
I obviously labeled the main service in english ( I do take what I do serious) but If I'm not mistaken (which I could be, hence the post) I could have put the spanish directions on it and it would have been green tagged.
Again, I was only trying to start a discussion and/or get a clear answer about different languages on a panel.
So, the panels came with both english and spanish labels.. Should I put both on?

[Perfect Gent]

Note to self- Do not rub Mr. Decker the wrong way.. Sheeesh man

[Speedy Petey]

Originally Posted by Perfect Gent

Note to self- Do not rub Mr. Decker the wrong way.. Sheeesh man

Nah, you can rub him. He just rubs back.

[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by Perfect Gent

I was extremely bored at work the other day as I finished installing a new service.... So as my mind started wandering as I placed the stickers on the panel (numbers, disconnect, main, etc..) when I saw a bag of spanish labels and wondered what would happen if I used them instead of the english ones... I skimmed the codebook but didn't see anything about what language and or if both stickers had to be used....

** I obviously stuck the english directions on the panel but I just thought it was something to ponder, anyone have any info. about this?

Did you skim a Spanish code book?

[mnahrgang]

Originally Posted by relliott

Perfect Gent.
To answer your question.
What I get out of this , is that since English has never been named the official language of this country, you could do it .
How is that for a staight answer.

Not true... I'd have to do some research to find the exact Bill, and year passed, but English is the official language of the United States. If memory serves correctly,it won by one vote. The second language in question at the time was German.

Now to the point of your original post, since code doesn't say it has to be in English, you might be technically correct in that it COULD be labeled in any language you would want (but I don't know for sure).

But if you are that boored, then find another career. Because, If I were the homeowner or contractor, and you labeled the panel in anything other than English you wouldn't get paid (unless you labeled it in English first, then a second language too).

Like you said earlier, the Code doesn't allow labeling for a transient nature (Like Billy's room). That would imply that it also should be labled for the masses. Granted a Serbian may be living in the home and Serbian labels would be handy for him, but not the next owner, nor the Electrican.