Phase coupler

[jtedesco1]

Originally Posted by Marc D. Shunk

Do you always ask questions you already know the answer to, or just on special occasions?

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I have to deal with more licensing authorities, more inspection agencies (governmental and otherwise), and more places to pull permits from than a man really ought to have to deal with. Sort of along the lines of what the orange guy from the windy city describes.

Marc:

Honest question, I am not being a wise guy!

When did PA start licensing electricians, do they have Master, Contractor, or Journeyman licenses, and what edition of the code is used?

I always though that they had no license rules.

Do you deal with 3rd party agencies?

Are they competitive and willing to look the other way on occasion?

Are you a member of IAEI or any other association? I have been a member of IAEI since 1969.

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

When did PA start licensing electricians, do they have Master, Contractor, or Journeyman licenses, and what edition of the code is used?

I always though that they had no license rules.

This doesn't happen at the state level. They let all this happen at the local level, which is a bigger pain in the backside then I could ever explain.

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

Do you deal with 3rd party agencies?

Mostly. The AHJ can also be insurance people, architects, engineers, Army Corps of Engineers, etc., as well as local jurisdictional inspectors. It can be a pain.

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

Are they competitive and willing to look the other way on occasion?

People are people. Happens everywhere you go, without regard to who they answer to.

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

Are you a member of IAEI or any other association? I have been a member of IAEI since 1969.

Congratulations! Did they give you a lapel pin or a watch or something for being a member so long? I'm a member of the NRA. I was a Lion's Club member for a spell. I got a letter in the mail that said I may already be a winner of the Publisher's Clearinghouse Sweepstakes, but I digress.

[brian winkle]

Marc, now I know you're lying. I am the one who got the letter from Publishers Clearing House.

[jtedesco1]

Originally Posted by abolt

Is it appropriate to install phase couplers in electrical panels?

AGAIN NO!

I received a reply from UL and Schneider Electric today asking if this was allowed and here's their reply:

QUESTION: Here's the reference that makes the installation a violation!
312.8 Enclosures for Switches or Overcurrent Devices. Do you agree?

ANSWER: Joe: Yes, plus 110.3(B) since the panelboards are not designed for extra equipment that have not been listed as an accessry for inclusion in the panel.

For more information about UL, its Marks, and its services for
EMC, quality registrations and product certifications for global
markets, please access our web sites at http://www.ul.com and
http://www.ulc.ca or contact your local sales representative. --

---------------------------------------------------------

QUESTION: Do you allow this type of product in your cabinets with panelboards? I believe NEC Section 312.8 and 110.3(B) are being violated.

ANSWER: Joe after looking at the picture, the answer is no we do not.

Thanks for contacting us here at Schneider Electric. Your business is important to us.

Regards,
Schneider Electric
888-778-2733

[Marc D. Shunk]

Simple fact is, if they don't permit it, they need to include that with the listing and labeling of the panelboard cabinet for it to be enforcable by any means. As of yet, they do not. I'm reasonably sure I can find someone on the other end of a telephone or email at any company to say about anything I want them to.

[Greg Fretwell]

I am not surprised schneider says something they don't sell can't be installed in their panel. Those are the guys (SqD) who are driving the classified breaker debacle.

[Ian Gills]

Gosh, is this argument still going on? I am going to give it five stars.

[jtedesco1]

Originally Posted by abolt

Is it appropriate to install phase couplers in electrical panels?

Again NO!

This is an example of the real reason for 312.8

312.8 Enclosures for Switches or Overcurrent Devices.

Enclosures for switches or overcurrent devices shall not be used as junction boxes, auxiliary gutters, or raceways for conductors feeding through or tapping off to other switches or overcurrent devices, unless adequate space for this purpose is provided. The conductors shall not fill the wiring space at any cross section to more than 40 percent of the cross-sectional area of the space, and the conductors, splices, and taps shall not fill the wiring space at any cross section to more than 75 percent of the cross-sectional area of that space.

[Mike Whitt]

I am not sure that I understand what you are saying here Joe.

Are you saying that 312.8 were written solely for GE panel enclosures?


Why you got all that space below your name again for?

[jtedesco1]

No, this is applicable to any panelboard in a cabinet.
This is an example of the real reason for 312.8

[Mike Whitt]

Does that mean that this can't be done?

[jtedesco1]

NO, that means that this cannot be done!

"Joe, I agree with you that it's not permitted, but everybody has a right to express their opinion on the forum even if we don't agree with them.

God Bless, Mike Holt"