Some problems here to identify, what are they?

[jtedesco1]

If you know what's wrong cite "them thar" problems here! ...

[rcooke]

Recommend immediate repair or replacement by qualified person.

Roy Cooke

[jtedesco1]

(submitted by Joe Tedesco)

quote: (picture 1) shows a 208/120V panelboard, typical of panelboards throughout the building. In addition to other violations, notice that the panel is not grounded, that neutrals and grounding conductors are freely mixed on the neutral bus, multiple-colored insulations on neutral bus, white used as a phase conductor in feeder, etc.

quote: (picture 2) shows a Fernco plumbing coupling used on the service conductor raceways between a pad-mounted transformer and the service entrance switchgear. This is a 1200A 480V service.

Enjoy

Robert E. Brown

[jtedesco1]

OK, let's make believe we are training a new home inspector, you are the experienced inspector and can see the many problems, so, why should they be referred to a professional?

Surely, we have many here who can do this.

[Greg Fretwell]

Besides the obvious overheated lug and double taps I also see missing connectors in the upper right, uncovered KO and EIGHT disconnects. Those small breakers probably do not have sufficient interrupt ratings/service rated

[lfranklin]

If they are are all twin breakers or piggy back breakers.
Does this make the panel have more circuits than it was intended for. Now making the panel undersized

[Robert Francis]

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

OK, let's make believe we are training a new home inspector, you are the experienced inspector and can see the many problems, so, why should they be referred to a professional?

Surely, we have many here who can do this.

Burnt/meted wirining, Alunimum wiring, double taps, main double tapped, can;t make it out but looks like wrong breakers to wire size (might be wrong on that as cn't make it out) GET A LICENSED ELECTRIAN IN HERE ASAP and thats just to start;

SO what did I win besides being almost electricfied removing tha cover????

[jtedesco1]

What will be the prize? Your observing the need for the correction, and telling me what you want for the prize, and I will ask Nick for something, on the other hand if you look over on the Electric West show site www.ecmweb.com for the February convention in Long Beach, they have a contest on: "What's Wrong here?" and the winner can win some big bucks, just a way of celebrating the issues discovered by that same subject in their publications for over 10 years, look for the picture and commentary already used in the past:



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[jtedesco1]

Originally Posted by lfranklin

If they are are all twin breakers or piggy back breakers.
Does this make the panel have more circuits than it was intended for. Now making the panel undersized

See the UL Directory under PANELBOARDS QEUY for specific information related to use of the "twins" which will advise that the label on the cabinet will provide the listing and use of them.

[William E. Siegel]

Joe,

Back to your picture. Is that box the service panel. If not, its improperly bonded, a wrongly identified wire into one of the breakers, improper bundling of wires, the obvious burned wires and double taps, Zinsco or Sylvania box, looks like there are some non compatable breakers in that box, possible damged insulation on the upper wires.

[jtedesco1]

If you look real close on the right side there is no neutral installed because the lug is empty.

This is a 1200A 480V service, meaning this it was the 3-wire supply to this panelboard from the main disconnect elsewhere.

The use of colors is sometimes confusng to some, and while it is true that phases A and C have colors other than white, gray, or 3 stripes along the entire wire, the B phase is white here, and that is not the proper way to identify that "ungrounded conductor",

I must get ready for the road now and hope that someone else who sees other items here can comment. The original images were sent to me and I think there may be some comments in the archives.

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Hey Joe,

Always nice pictures fella and I will comment on the FIRST one as it is easier to do it that way versus a bunch of pictures...gets confusing but here we go.

Obvious Issues :
1.) No OCPD on the main SE Conductors
2.) No OCPD on the illegal double tap on the main lug connection points
3.) Wrongful Double Tap on the Main Termination Point
4.) No grounded conductor re-identification ( Field Done- White Wrap )
5.) Missing KO's not plugged
6.) Wrongful termination of a WHITE wire onto a breaker without re-identify
7.) Bundling and or overcrowding of conductors into the enclosure, Unless it is only sleeved for protection....can't really tell on that one...I cant see above it.
8.) Can't tell where that stranded aluminum conductor terminates on the buss bar....my eyes just SUCK today.
9.) Conductors comeing through the open KO's without connectors
10.) Another "Grounded" conductor on the wires above not identified as it should.
11.) Obvious Melting due to overloaded circuit on the double tap.

Ok....thats enough...I do question the grounding of this panel with the solid coming throught he same connector...and where it possibly goes.if into the meter can on the other side...parrallel paths and a problem...and I dont see a supplimental which could be suggested and added.

Also with the rust on that connector in the upper right and signs of it on the lower right of the panel, I would also say moisture is getting in through those KO's and connector at the upper right...needs to be looked at besides being a Zinsco and probably not sized properly for their NEW addition of the overheated double tap......HI's recomment evaluation is proper.

I would certainly recommend it be evaluated, some items not seen in a picture could possibly be identified as well....just cant see it that clear....actually early for me I got rather TIPSEY last night...(head spins )

Nice picture Joe........

[Marc D. Shunk]

Originally Posted by jtedesco1

(submitted by Joe Tedesco)quote: (picture 1) shows a 208/120V panelboard, typical of panelboards throughout the building. In addition to other violations, notice that the panel is not grounded, that neutrals and grounding conductors are freely mixed on the neutral bus, multiple-colored insulations on neutral bus, white used as a phase conductor in feeder, etc.

Here's my shot at that pic:


-The panel appears to be affixed to the plywood with #8 bugle head type wood screws (probably drywall screws). This does not meet the 110.13(A) requirements in the eyes of many.
-General appearance of installation does not meet 110.12, as clarified by the NECA standards.
-Panelboard enclosure may not be rated to contain the RR7 style lighting relay in the upper right corner. 110.3(B)
-The #4 grounded conductor terminating on the neutral bar has a green outer covering, in violation of 200.6(B)
-The grounded conductor feeding this panel is sorely undersized. 250
-The equipment grounding conductor appears to be by way of the EMT that feeds this panel. There is no equipment ground bar installed in this panel, and the MC cables appear to have their equipment grounding conductors landed on the neutral bar.
-B phase conductor has a white outer covering, in violation of 310.12(C)
-There is a red wire on the neutral bar, in violation of 200.6(A)
-Several branch circuit breakers are double tapped, but this is okay with a QO breaker under many circumstances.
-One grounded conductor of the one MC cable appears to share a hole with an equipment grounding conductor, in violation of 408.41
-There appears to be a single red #12 conductor in the feeder pipe, without the rest of that circuit's conductors, in violation of 300.5(I)
-The yellow conductor on the left, above the zip tie, appears to have arcing type damage, in violation of 110.7
-The grounded conductor of the lighting transformer is not remarked white, in violation of 200.6(A)
-Piece of cardboard in panel, and some of the MC or AC cables appear to still have the interleaving paper on them, in violation of 240.24(D)

[Paul W. Abernathy]

ahhh...thats the problem...which panel are we supposed to be observing and citing.....the first one shown on the one MARC is commenting on.

Keep it one panel at a time fella...lol

[jtedesco1]

Bump