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[cradan]

Home subpanel, 60 amp fed from one of two 200 amp services. What's wrong, if anything?

[rcooke]

Originally Posted by cradan

Home subpanel, 60 amp fed from one of two 200 amp services. What's wrong, if anything?

Looks like feeders are under size .Is it a 60 amp main breaker?
No grounds so expect it is fed with steel conduit .
Very few neutrals so most circuits are 240 volt .
Neutral bonded to cabinet not allowed in Canada to have pony panel neutral bonded to cabinet.
Could not see a bushing on conduit Not needed on plastic but does need a ground wire if plastic.
I hate picture inspections and do not usually do them .

Roy Cooke sr
.

[cradan]

Disconnect is marked 60-amp, feeders were 6AWG, all copper including branch conductors.

Bushings all looked o.k. (crappy photo). What bothered me was the shortage of neutral branch conductors and the obvious panel bond.

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Chris,

Firstly, if it is a sub panel they did not know they had to run (4) conductors to this panel...and isolate the grounded conductors on it's own termial bar. See my BTW statement below...lol

Second, if this is # 6 AWG to the " grounded" conductor it is a violation of Art 200.6 Means of Identidying Grounded Conductors. Because of it's size the grounded conductor should be continuous white or gray outer finish or by three continuous white striples on other than green insulation along its ENTIRE length.

Third, Obvioulsy the additional picture shows it is bonded to the CASE...to the neutral terminal bar......THIS is a sub-panel or Remote Distributrion Panel so that is wrong.


Hope this helps

Oh..BTW......I figured some "conduit" lover would come in and say the 4th wire is the conduit.....it serves as the grounding conductor...well......if someone brings that into play...they better remove that bonding jumper......

[William J. Decker]

"Oh..BTW......I figured some "conduit" lover would come in and say the 4th wire is the conduit.....it serves as the grounding conductor...well......if someone brings that into play...they better remove that bonding jumper......"

Paul;

You are such a spoil sport.

[smcarthur]

If those are 240v circuits then the breakers should be double poles and they appear to be all singles. Also, there is no breaker lockdown device on the double pole 60 that is being used as the main. That's in addition to all the other problems noted above.

[jlybolt]

2nd picture, right side of panel, 2nd wire up -

my eyes are bad, it looks like the insulation on the wire was not trimmed below connection screw?

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Originally Posted by wdecker

"Oh..BTW......I figured some "conduit" lover would come in and say the 4th wire is the conduit.....it serves as the grounding conductor...well......if someone brings that into play...they better remove that bonding jumper......"

Paul;

You are such a spoil sport.

LOLOLO......You are so cool Will....I knew you would reply to that BAIT..thehehe

[cradan]

Originally Posted by smcarthur

If those are 240v circuits then the breakers should be double poles and they appear to be all singles. Also, there is no breaker lockdown device on the double pole 60 that is being used as the main. That's in addition to all the other problems noted above.

None of the installed circuits are configured as 240v; only the feeder disconnect is a two-pole breaker. I'm not sure where you got the idea... Also, why is a breaker lockdown device required at the main disconnect for this sub-panel?

[Patrick Bolliger]

Originally Posted by cradan

None of the installed circuits are configured as 240v; only the feeder disconnect is a two-pole breaker. I'm not sure where you got the idea... Also, why is a breaker lockdown device required at the main disconnect for this sub-panel?

From the ratio of "hot" to "neutral" wires.. Hardly any neutrals..

I don't see handle ties on the OCPD's either so there's something else going on..

Perhaps the conduit is being used as a neutral....
The panel case is bonded so ...maybe... Three wire... and no isolation between neutral and grounding...

[smcarthur]

If the circuits are not 240v, then they could be sharing neutrals. It's hard to tell from the photo, but there should be a total of 8 neutrals. Only 2 hots (in this case,three if it were three phase), one from each phase, may share a neutral. The GFCI needs a dedicated neutral.
I assume they are using the conduit as a ground, since I see none in the panel and since it's a sub panel the neutral bar should not be bonded to the can.

Also, if you are backfeeding a panel, such as they are here, then the breaker being used as the main must have a lock down device to prevent it from being removed from the panel. Go to www.squareD.com and do a search for PK4MB2LA to see what I'm refering to and why they are used.

How about it Paul, see anything else?