Two Prong Outlets

[sboyd2]

Do any of you have a blanket disclaimer for a house, say 50 years old using two prong outlets/receptacles? I do not count it as a defect, the home is 50 years old. But what could I add for a nice disclaimer for that?

How about Knob and Tube wiring? Thank you in advance for your help.

[Greg Fretwell]

I think it would be significant to point out whether a grounded wiring method was used. Some old Romex did have a small grounding conductor long before the 5-15 receptacle came into general use. You could also have a metal wiring method. I suppose you could use an adapter to test the boxes. If that passed swapping out the receptacles is trivial.
Do you get adapter kits with a SureTest? My Ecos has 3 or 4 adapters for checking grounding paths, 240v stuff and such

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by sboyd2

Do any of you have a blanket disclaimer for a house, say 50 years old

From my Interactive Report System:

Older Structure

Any renovation, remodeling, refurbishment, or rehabilitation (hereafter, “renovation”) of an older structure, or any part of an older structure, might expose defects which were not noted or were not visible at the time of the inspection. It is highly likely that an older structure has had problems associated with it in the past, such as roof leaks, plumbing leaks, drainage leaks, and damage by wood-destroying pests and organisms.

While we strive to prepare an accurate report of the condition of the property at the time of the inspection by visual means only, it is virtually impossible to compile an exhaustive, complete, or definitive list of defects and areas of concern
in these circumstances due to the time-limited nature and generalizations inherent with a home inspection, as well as areas of the property not being visible, not being accessible, having been repaired and/or painted, or being considered dangerous and unsafe. The information contained in Section 4 – Areas of Concern should not be construed as an exhaustive, complete, or definitive list of defects and areas of concern for an older structure.

Recommend adjusting renovation budgets for unexpected or unforeseen circumstances.

Recommend creating a list of appropriate personnel (plumber, electrician, etc.) for use in an emergency situation; this should be done before move-in.

Originally Posted by sboyd2

using two prong outlets/receptacles? I do not count it as a defect, the home is 50 years old. But what could I add for a nice disclaimer for that?

Two-prong outlets present. Two-prong outlets are outdated, are not grounded, and are generally considered unsafe. Recommend having 2-prong outlets upgraded to 3-prong outlets. Recommend further evaluation by a licensed electrician for upgrade options.

Originally Posted by sboyd2

How about Knob and Tube wiring?

Active knob & tube wiring present. Knob and tube wiring can be presumed to be the original electrical wiring in the home, and is old and outdated by today’s safety standards. It typically is difficult to work with and maintain properly. It apparently requires adequate clearance around it because it requires good ventilation in order to dissipate the heat that is inherent in electrical wiring. Since it is old, the insulation on the wires probably is brittle and might even be missing in some areas. Additionally, it is not designed to be covered with any material such as attic insulation. HOMETEAM is aware of some insurance companies that decline to provide homeowner’s insurance if active knob & tube wiring is present. Recommend contacting preferred insurance company before close of escrow to ensure that appropriate homeowner’s insurance can be obtained on the structure. Recommend further evaluation by licensed electrician before close of escrow.

[Mike Parks]

"Two-prong outlets present. Two-prong outlets are outdated, are not grounded, and are generally considered unsafe. Recommend having 2-prong outlets upgraded to 3-prong outlets. Recommend further evaluation by a licensed electrician for upgrade options."

2 prong outlets ARE safe.
They are grounded.

Now go to any lamp in your home and tell me how many 'prongs' are on the plug?

They are not outdated and are safe.

[gbeaumont]

Originally Posted by Greg Fretwell

Do you get adapter kits with a SureTest? My Ecos has 3 or 4 adapters for checking grounding paths, 240v stuff and such

Greg, the newer SureTests have 3 fixed blades, the older ones (Ihave an old ST1 as well) have a very usefull telescoping ground blade that can be retracted when testing 2 prong outlets. I wish they had retained that feature on the newer models, having said that most of the time I use the 12inch flex cord anyway on the newer ones. I still regularly dig out the oder model when evaluating 2 wire outlets.

Regards

Gerry

[Greg Fretwell]

A regular 3 prong adapter works fine with the advantage that if it shows OK with the strap tied to the center screw it is an indication that the box is grounded. My Ecos also had an adapter with a long pigtail connected to the Ecos ground and the plug prong floating to test outher ground paths. There was another adapter I didn't use and I am not sure I remember what it did.

[Greg Fretwell]

Another handy adapter is a 2' heavy duty cord that is the 14ga or 12ga zip cord type. You can safely split out the conductors for your clamp on.
That is the one you use to show people why their washer, fridge or pump trips the GFCI. Clamp it on the center conductor while the appliance is plugged into a grounded non-GFCI and measure the ground fault current. You can also clamp either of the phase conductors to see current used.

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

"The house is wired mostly with 2-prong ungrounded receptacles. While common years ago and still acceptable today, the lack of a grounding conductor will limit the use of certain appliances such as refrigerators, washing machines, computers, etc. that require a ground. Dedicated circuits may have to be run to properly and safely use such appliances."

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by Mike Parks

"Two-prong outlets present. Two-prong outlets are outdated, are not grounded, and are generally considered unsafe. Recommend having 2-prong outlets upgraded to 3-prong outlets. Recommend further evaluation by a licensed electrician for upgrade options."

2 prong outlets ARE safe.
They are grounded.

Now go to any lamp in your home and tell me how many 'prongs' are on the plug?

They are not outdated and are safe.

I have to go with what my insurance company and my attorneys, as well as other resources (electricians, plumbers, etc.) in San Diego tell me since I consult with them often.

Mileage in your area might be different, so as I have said many, many times on these boards, consult with your business advisors (attorneys, insurance providers, etc.) to determine your business, inspection, and writing protocols.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by jfunderburk

"The house is wired mostly with 2-prong ungrounded receptacles. While common years ago and still acceptable today, the lack of a grounding conductor will limit the use of certain appliances such as refrigerators, washing machines, computers, etc. that require a ground. Dedicated circuits may have to be run to properly and safety use such appliances."

I personally like what Joe has better than what I have and shall approach my attorneys and insurance company to see if I might substitute Joe's for mine.

Thanks, Joe.

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

You're welcome RR.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by jfunderburk

You're welcome RR.

Hey, Joe.

Done got appropriate approval, and the report for one of today's inspections will be the first with the new verbiage.

See, that's why I continue to stick around here at NACHI. I get benefits from the membership, too.

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

Russel, just noticed a spelling error. Safety should be "safely".

[Russel Ray]

I caught it before I sent it to my attorneys and insurance providers. Thanks.

[Blaine Wiley]

Excellent language, better too than I was using! Kudos!