International Association of Certified Home Inspectors
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| HVAC Topics include heating, venting, and air conditioning. |
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#1
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I will be inspecting a house with a geothermal heating-cooling system "water furnace" I would like to have some pointer on that system, I've heard about them, somewhat studied them but never seen one. Any info on what to inspect will be greatly appreciated
Thank Jeannot |
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#2
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Please Note:
rcooke is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
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http://www.reddawn.com/featart11-98.html http://www.dougrye.com/geothermal.html http://www.geothermalheatpump.com/ Roy Cooke |
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#3
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____________________________________________ "An Education, not just an Inspection" Larry Kage Lake Ann (Traverse City), Michigan 49650 231 929 3525 Professional Inspector and Infrared Thermographer serving the Traverse City, Michigan area and beyond. ITC/FLIR CERTIFIED BUILDING SCIENCES THERMOGRAPHER ITC/FLIR CERTIFIED LEVEL 1 THERMOGRAPHER
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#4
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http://nachi.org/forum/showthread.ph...t=waterfurnace
The type of water loop / supply is important. http://www.waterfurnace.com/content....tial&page=loop Service is recommended annually. Joseph P. Hagarty joseph.hagarty@comcast.net Main Line Inspections, Inc. Phone: 610-399-3675 Email: MainLineHI@comcast.net http://pa.nachi.org/mainlinepa/about.html http://www.householdinspector.com National President / NACHI (2003-2004) NACHI Education Committee Member |
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#5
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http://www.waterfurnace.com/Envision/pdf/IM1585.pdf
http://www.waterfurnace.com/pdfs/products/IM1554.pdf Joseph P. Hagarty joseph.hagarty@comcast.net Main Line Inspections, Inc. Phone: 610-399-3675 Email: MainLineHI@comcast.net http://pa.nachi.org/mainlinepa/about.html http://www.householdinspector.com National President / NACHI (2003-2004) NACHI Education Committee Member |
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#6
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Thank you everyone,so nice to have this message board so many replies within the hour
Thank you Jeannot |
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#7
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I think I posted this once before but here goes again. The MFG's sales hype that some of the others linked to leads a person to believe that these units are the best thing since sliced bread as to the cost of operation. Keep in mind that on a geo unit you still are paying the cost of operating a compressor and a fluid pump at the same time and this cost is incurred when ever the unit is operated heat and or cool year round. Thus the life expectancy is less on the compressor than a conventional A/C unit. Amps X Volts= Watts and watts is what you pay for???? With the price of propane being what it is today a rural property that has a well insulated home could very likely be ahead money wise to install a geo unit but the cost of operation of these units still does not compare to natural gas. As Robert O states that my 2 cents. Freedom Express Inspections LLC CMOR Thermography Certified Level 11 #2097 freedomexpressinspections.com freedomexpress495@att.net NACHI Member Okla. State DEQ Environmental Phase One Certified Master HVAC Mechanic (Retired) Certified Universal Freon by 40CFR 82 Sub-part F Professional Home Inspector State License # 130 Reporting system by Home Inspector Pro Serving the State of Okla. |
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#8
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Maybe I'm not getting your drift but cooling/heating a condenser with 56° water beats 32°/ 95° DX coils!? Lower head pressure equals lower power consumption and stress on the compressor. Geothermal doesn't require a defrost cycle where the air-conditioner comes on with the heat strips. The compressor doesn't have to slam between air conditioning and heating during a defrost cycle. It seems that there is some savings and lack of abuse with geothermal equipment?!? Am I missing something? |
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#9
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If a compressor is designed to operate say for example 17 amps it will draw that, just because you run 55 degree degree water thru the condenser does not mean that the amps start decreasing, the compressor will draw what its designed minimally to draw the amps of course increase with the head pressure increasing. David I am not trying to give you lesson here just stating my thoughts so others might follow along. I am not putting down Geo units I think they are a great option to burning propane. I would have to think otherwise in favor of natural gas. Freedom Express Inspections LLC CMOR Thermography Certified Level 11 #2097 freedomexpressinspections.com freedomexpress495@att.net NACHI Member Okla. State DEQ Environmental Phase One Certified Master HVAC Mechanic (Retired) Certified Universal Freon by 40CFR 82 Sub-part F Professional Home Inspector State License # 130 Reporting system by Home Inspector Pro Serving the State of Okla. |
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#10
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Okay, I see now that you are comparing gas with a heat pump!
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Most geothermal units operate below the rate amperage drawn consistently. I believe our misunderstanding here is that we are comparing different units designed completely different from one another. When we discuss compressor load and lifespan only, a DX heat pump runs under much less power consumption and load in the winter than a geothermal unit in the heating mode. Therefore, a geothermal unit is under greater strain in the wintertime and will wear out quicker. However, if we are looking at power savings, the geothermal does not use auxiliary heat or a defrost cycle like the DX heat pump. So the DX heat pump consumes more power. Now when we look at the really big picture (total money spent), we have to look at increased equipment costs, increased maintenance costs versus overall life expectancy of the equipment when we look at the bottom line. As you are pointing out, there may not be much of a difference in total lifespan (depending on the equipment compared). We're just not viewing this issue from the same side of the fence! |
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#11
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I was just trying to make a point of total operating time on the compressor per year on a geo unit as compated to natural gas heat. I don't have any real stats on the life expectancy of the geo unit but my thinking is just based on the overall run time per year. I don't recall what the actual amp draw or FLA on a geo unit is but common sense dictates that it would be less due to the colder condenser temps. If a geo unit is designed 10, 12, or 15 amps or whatever, thats what it will draw when ever that compressor is running. Just trying to compare that cost to the cost of natural gas. Perhaps my thoughts are not clear You Know I failed my English/grammer in school </IMG></IMG></IMG> Freedom Express Inspections LLC CMOR Thermography Certified Level 11 #2097 freedomexpressinspections.com freedomexpress495@att.net NACHI Member Okla. State DEQ Environmental Phase One Certified Master HVAC Mechanic (Retired) Certified Universal Freon by 40CFR 82 Sub-part F Professional Home Inspector State License # 130 Reporting system by Home Inspector Pro Serving the State of Okla. |
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#12
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#13
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Many geo units in Central Indiana use a pond for its water source. Their obvious issue is getting plugged up with debris. Some others use a well and discharge back into another well. That practice I believe is now illegal due to possible groundwater contamination. Closed loop is the best way to go. $$$$ saved versus natural gas in IN is now significant.
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#14
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</IMG> Freedom Express Inspections LLC CMOR Thermography Certified Level 11 #2097 freedomexpressinspections.com freedomexpress495@att.net NACHI Member Okla. State DEQ Environmental Phase One Certified Master HVAC Mechanic (Retired) Certified Universal Freon by 40CFR 82 Sub-part F Professional Home Inspector State License # 130 Reporting system by Home Inspector Pro Serving the State of Okla. |
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#15
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