For discussion... Mold (Mould for the Canuks)

[mnahrgang]

If you can see mold (or a mold like substance), why should you test for it? Why not just clean it up, and fix the moisture source.

If you can't see mold, what would cause you to test for it, and why?

[James E. Braun, CMI]

The reason why you test is to know how to handle the mold. Considered toxic mold needs more steps taken in remediation than nontoxic mold. It is more cost effective to determine toxicity and the spore spread then to clean the whole home. Also most reputable mold remediators will not remove mold if the mold growth area is larger than 10 square feet without a remediation protocol written because of liability or insurability reasons.
The reason why you test without any visible signs of mold is if the occupants of the home are being effective by chronic symptoms or a buyer is hypersensitive to mold. I have clients that carry kits similar to bee sting kits just in case they walk into a building that contains a certain type of mold. Also if the occupant leaves the building for a couple days and feels better, then he reoccupies the building and his symptoms come back, is the only time I would suspect mold toxification without any visible signs of mold present.

[dplummer]

James is on the money. If it's a small amount (under 10 sf) the home owner can clean it up. If it's a larger area of mould a remedation co requires, or atleast they should, 3rd party independant testing for pre & post (clearance )testing. How else would we know if our clean up was sucessfull? And Mark your right , the moisture intrusion needs to be fixed before remedation

Doug

[Philip J. Cavalcante]

sorry guys for stepping on this thread but I was wandering if u could point me in the right direction on mold remediation. Web site or some more info on how some of the guys in the area are doing this type of work. See I new allot of the guys in my area before they got in the mold business and im just wandering how they did it and what makes them qualified
Philip Cavalcante

[ldapkus]

Originally Posted by pcavalcante

sorry guys for stepping on this thread but I was wandering if u could point me in the right direction on mold remediation. Web site or some more info on how some of the guys in the area are doing this type of work. See I new allot of the guys in my area before they got in the mold business and im just wandering how they did it and what makes them qualified
Philip Cavalcante

Try this

[James E. Braun, CMI]

Originally Posted by pcavalcante

sorry guys for stepping on this thread but I was wandering if u could point me in the right direction on mold remediation. Web site or some more info on how some of the guys in the area are doing this type of work. See I new allot of the guys in my area before they got in the mold business and im just wandering how they did it and what makes them qualified
Philip Cavalcante

I hope through education, through some of the organizations that certify mold inspectors. In my area it is obvious that the education is very minimal.

[dplummer]

Phillip, If your looking at remediation check the IICRC website for courses.

Doug

[jcundiff]

I'm gonna step on this thread too. I just have to say, testing certainly has it's place, and that is with mold professionals. There are just way too many HI's whipping out their swabs and sampling "suspect" surfaces- of course they're sent down to nachi south... ahh hemm... I mean Prolab.. Of course, because mold will be present on the swab, prolab will report "elevated mold". This scenario is costing buyers and sellers time and money while delivering zip in benefit. A swab sample from the counter top in Mr. Clean's kitchen will turn up mold spores. IMO, HI's need to stop meaningless swab tests. If HI's encounter mold, mold like substance, black, green or otherwise... just state it in your report, suggest further evaluation, and move on. Damnnn it frosts me when fellow HI's flip out because a suspected fungal growth is black... color means nothing!

In response to the original thread, we treat all mold in the same way. Our protocol for stachy is the same for clad, or any other. Containment is containment, clean is clean, fungicide is fungicide. We have done many jobs without testing. Just as in lead paint regs, we can presume the existence of fungal growth and treat it as such. Often, the cost of remediation rivals the cost of proper testing.

[Doug Wall]

I'm gonna step on this thread too. I just have to say, testing certainly has it's place, and that is with mold professionals. There are just way too many HI's whipping out their swabs and sampling "suspect" surfaces- of course they're sent down to nachi south... ahh hemm... I mean Prolab.. Of course, because mold will be present on the swab, prolab will report "elevated mold". This scenario is costing buyers and sellers time and money while delivering zip in benefit. A swab sample from the counter top in Mr. Clean's kitchen will turn up mold spores. IMO, HI's need to stop meaningless swab tests. If HI's encounter mold, mold like substance, black, green or otherwise... just state it in your report, suggest further evaluation, and move on. Damnnn it frosts me when fellow HI's flip out because a suspected fungal growth is black... color means nothing!

In response to the original thread, we treat all mold in the same way. Our protocol for stachy is the same for clad, or any other. Containment is containment, clean is clean, fungicide is fungicide. We have done many jobs without testing. Just as in lead paint regs, we can presume the existence of fungal growth and treat it as such. Often, the cost of remediation rivals the cost of proper testing.

Amen

[James E. Braun, CMI]

Originally Posted by jcundiff

In response to the original thread, we treat all mold in the same way. Our protocol for stachy is the same for clad, or any other. Containment is containment, clean is clean, fungicide is fungicide. We have done many jobs without testing. Just as in lead paint regs, we can presume the existence of fungal growth and treat it as such. Often, the cost of remediation rivals the cost of proper testing.

What do you mean by our protocol?
How do you know how much needs to be cleaned up? If the mold is in one corner of the basement do you clean just that corner, room, that room and rooms connecting, whole basement, whole house? Do you clean up things that are stored in closets or cabinets? Do you cleanup things stored in boxes? Do you clean the carpet or replace with new?
Do you have any clearance testing done after remediation from a third party? If you do, how are the samples based and where are the samples pulled?

[jcundiff]

"our protocol" is proprietary. My issue is with meaningless swab sampling.

[Dennis R. Goudreau]

Originally Posted by jcundiff

I'm gonna step on this thread too. I just have to say, testing certainly has it's place, and that is with mold professionals. There are just way too many HI's whipping out their swabs and sampling "suspect" surfaces- of course they're sent down to nachi south... ahh hemm... I mean Prolab.. Of course, because mold will be present on the swab, prolab will report "elevated mold". This scenario is costing buyers and sellers time and money while delivering zip in benefit. A swab sample from the counter top in Mr. Clean's kitchen will turn up mold spores. IMO, HI's need to stop meaningless swab tests. If HI's encounter mold, mold like substance, black, green or otherwise... just state it in your report, suggest further evaluation, and move on. Damnnn it frosts me when fellow HI's flip out because a suspected fungal growth is black... color means nothing!

In response to the original thread, we treat all mold in the same way. Our protocol for stachy is the same for clad, or any other. Containment is containment, clean is clean, fungicide is fungicide. We have done many jobs without testing. Just as in lead paint regs, we can presume the existence of fungal growth and treat it as such. Often, the cost of remediation rivals the cost of proper testing.

John
but you also have to keep in mind that mold is the by product of a moisture problem and the moisture must be found, as to the majority of your post i agree unnecessary testing should be avoided and mold spores can be found everywhere

[jcundiff]

gee, thanks. I had know idea the two were related.

[Dennis R. Goudreau]

no offense meant John

[James E. Braun, CMI]

Originally Posted by jcundiff

"our protocol" is proprietary. My issue is with meaningless swab sampling.

I agree, with the swabbing part. It is the part about you assuming that concerns me.
Mold can be cleaned up without a protocol but it still needs to have a third party clearance. You assuming liability and endangering the occupants lives is not necessary.
The part about cost effectiveness does not add up to me. Either you are not charging enough for remediation or I am not charging enough for testing. Usually a proper remediation runs a good ten times the cost of testing in my area.