Help with a Polybutylene "Disclaimer"

[Philippe G. Heller]

You have to be somewhat careful with this. On one hand, PB plumbing was never actually recalled. There were class action lawsuits which called for the company paying for re-pipes. If you say it was recalled, and kill a sale, you can be sued by the seller!!!!!

On the other hand, if you don't tell your client, you will be paying for a re-pipe, or sued if there is a leak.

You need to inform buyers that PB plumbing was the subject of class action lawsuits, is known to be problematic and has a higher than normal failure rate. They should research the product, and talk to a local licensed plumber who's opinion they trust. We recommend replacement.

[mrice]

I understand the problems with PB and the need for a disclaimer, but, shouldn't we still be calling out the PEX installation also with a disclaimer? Or is that product just that much more superior? I haven't had to deal with these types of piping yet and need a heads up.

[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by mrice

I understand the problems with PB and the need for a disclaimer, but, shouldn't we still be calling out the PEX installation also with a disclaimer? Or is that product just that much more superior? I haven't had to deal with these types of piping yet and need a heads up.

PEX is fine.

[Joseph W. Keresztury]

Originally Posted by bkelly2

PEX is fine.

Brian, There are class action law suits against Kitec. Isn't Kitec the same as PEX, or PEX is the plastic / polyethelene in the Kitec? Alot of the southwest is affected by the Kitec problem, especially Arizona, Texas and New Mexico. Also I believe California and Nevada and maybe Canada. I think the Nevada claim already has been settled.
I believe this (Kitec) is actually a recall not like (PB) in this post Phillipe said the polybutylene problem wasn't actually a recall.
A local attorney (San Antonio) called me weeks ago to ask if I was aware of any homes with Kitec issues, that he was looking for witnesses for a national class action law suit that he was assisting in as the local go to guy. I'm sure he was also doing some ambulance chasing for additional clients. I told him that I had been around Kitec thru most of the past decade and was unaware of any issues. This was the first I had heard of problems with it.
So everyone here should also add a Kitec / Pex disclaimer not just a PB daisclaimer.
I'm waiting on a call back from the local attorney and will add any updates here.

[Marcel R. Cyr]

http://www.plumbingdefect.com/lawsuit.html

[Joseph W. Keresztury]

Thanx Marcel, and here's a map of affected areas (Kitec)
Marcel, your link shows the Nevada Kitec class action suit being settled in Dec 09.
Have you been around any issues with Kitec problems in Maine?

[Marcel R. Cyr]

Joe, never seen it up here nor can I find any information that would relate it to Maine.
Glad this topic came up, now I can keep an eye out for it.
No alternative repairs for this pipe. Total replacement required.
Found the link where you got that map. Stored it for future use.
Thanks

[Joseph W. Keresztury]

Here is that website for good info- http://kiteclawsuit.com/

[Marcel R. Cyr]

I had found it Joe as I mentioned above. Thanks

[Brian E. Kelly]

Originally Posted by jkeresztury

Brian, There are class action law suits against Kitec. Isn't Kitec the same as PEX, or PEX is the plastic / polyethelene in the Kitec? Alot of the southwest is affected by the Kitec problem, especially Arizona, Texas and New Mexico. Also I believe California and Nevada and maybe Canada. I think the Nevada claim already has been settled.
I believe this (Kitec) is actually a recall not like (PB) in this post Phillipe said the polybutylene problem wasn't actually a recall.
A local attorney (San Antonio) called me weeks ago to ask if I was aware of any homes with Kitec issues, that he was looking for witnesses for a national class action law suit that he was assisting in as the local go to guy. I'm sure he was also doing some ambulance chasing for additional clients. I told him that I had been around Kitec thru most of the past decade and was unaware of any issues. This was the first I had heard of problems with it.
So everyone here should also add a Kitec / Pex disclaimer not just a PB daisclaimer.
I'm waiting on a call back from the local attorney and will add any updates here.

Kitec is not PEX piping....

http://www.deltamechanical.com/multi.../kitec-repipe/

According to the manufacturer Kitec® is “an engineered composite pipe made from flexible aluminum tubing -permanently bonded between layers of durable polyethylene

[Jeffrey R. Pope]

Originally Posted by bkelly2

Kitec is not PEX piping....

Correct. Two completely different animals.

[Joseph W. Keresztury]

Brian, my qoute / question from above- Isn't Kitec the same as PEX, or PEX is the plastic / polyethelene in the Kitec?
I always thought it was different but looking at different sites has confused me with the notion that the layers of polyethylene is called PEX.
Besides why would a qoute frome the fixer upper company website you are quoting be a ligit representation???
Qoutes from website I mentioned above-
Kitec PEX pipe is color-coded blue for cold water lines, and orange for hot water.
The Kitec plumbing system consists of both pipe and fittings. Kitec water pipe was manufactured as a composite cross-linked polyethylene (“PEX”) and aluminum (“AL”) pipe, whereby a thin, flexible aluminum layer was “sandwiched” between inner and outer layers of PEX plastic. Thus, Kitec water pipe was commonly referred to as “PEX-AL-PEX” pipe
Brian, I'm not trying to debate with you, just want to clear this up. Either way we need to know the issues of Kitec wether it is the same as PEX or not. I hope you see the reason for my confusion. Besides the fact that I'm often confused.

[Joseph W. Keresztury]

Originally Posted by jpope

Correct. Two completely different animals.

Hey Jeff, if it's two completely different animals there must have been some cross breeding.
www.lawyersandsettlements.com › lawyersandsettlements.co
Kitec PEX Pipe: The Fuse May Already Be Lit...

[Marcel R. Cyr]

It quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, called a duck, but it is not a real duck.


KITEC PEX-AL-PEX pipe is coextruded, cross-linked,
polyethylene, composite pressure pipe with a welded
aluminum tube reinforcement between the inner and outer
layers. The products are pressure-rated for 100 psi (689 kPa)
at 180

/F (82/C). Ends of the piping loops are connected to
the water source through manifolds that allow the flow in
individual loops to be regulated. Radiant floor heating
systems consist of separate loops of piping conveying hot

water under floors for heating purposes.

The pipe is marked at minimum intervals of 5 feet (1524 mm)
with the IPEX name, product designation (KITEC), material
designation (PEX-AL-PEX), nominal tube size, potable water
designation, temperature and pressure ratings, ASTM F 1281
designation, name of the inspection agency (NSF

International) and the evaluation report number (ESR-1049).

Kitec is a brand of brass plumbing fitting that was recalled in 2005 by its manufacturer, IPEX, due to its tendency to quickly corrode. Inspectors should be aware that the fitting, which was widely installed throughout the western United States since the early 1990s, might be the cause of some plumbing ailments encountered during inspections.

What is Kitec?
Kitec is a type of pipe that is made of cross-linked polyethylene (PEX), a type of plastic. The pipes use a metric standard of sizing making it hard to find to find fittings outside of it's own manufacturer.
The problem is that the Kitec fittings were inferior, made with a high zinc content which caused dezincifying. The zinc oxide builds up and restricts water pressure causing very low pressure, or, the fittings failed completely and caused flooding and water damage to homes and property.


How to I tell if I have Kitec Piping?
Look for piping with different colors. Most Kitec Pex pipe was color-coded. Blue for cold water, orange for hot water. Look for the presence of a neon sticker on, or inside the electrical box indicating the presence of Kitec Pex pipe, which has been used extensively over the last ten to 15 years.

[Joseph W. Keresztury]

So I guess I'm the only one seeing the ducks?? Actually I don't think I ever saw the ducks, they were doves.!!!!!
PEX floating away. But you should put your disclaimers with Kitec not just PB as I originally claimed or intended.
If you're not going to pay attention don't listen. Happy Mday