Shower pan testing protocol

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

I decided to begin testing shower pans. Bought a pan tester from Professional Equipment. It is essentially a 2" tall stopper with a hole in the center of it. Once the water level gets over the stopper, the water just rolls over the plug and into the drain.

However, I'm very uncomfortable leaving the water running for any period of time, especially in an upstairs bathroom.

How do you guys do it? Do you start the test as soon as you enter the house? How long do you run the water? Do you leave the room with the water running? Ever had a catastrophe?

[Scott Gilligan, CMI]

So let me try to grasp the concept here...

You are testing the shower pan by filling it up and seeing if there is a failure or a leak? What happens when you find one that is leaking? I am assuming that it is going to create some sort of damage below which would make it an invasive testing procedure.

I don't think I would would be too comfortable taking that kind of liability on my shoulders. I would seriously think about doing any sort of invasive testing procedures and consult with your insurance company to see if they would cover you for something like that.

[Barry Adair]

Cut out top of red plunger

1. I have 3 that I picked up at garage sales or thrift store for a quarter or some such nonsense, even new at hardware supply cheaper than PE widget
2. Once I've started the DW and kitchen stuff on to the pan(s)
3. Full force while I'm inspecting that bathroom then lower pressure upon leaving. I let run/trickle for the entire inspection, crawls maybe not as long...check back periodically because I always flush each toilet at least 3 times unless leaks are present
4. YEP but there were other water issues before I arrived...

[dbucknavich]

With all due respect Scott, I don't agree that it is an invasive inspection. It's technically the same thing as testing a tub in my opinion. A tub just comes with a stopper. If there is a leak, so be it. The fact that there is a leak does not make it invasive. Using specialized equipment makes it invasive.

Check out this pic of a house I inspected last week. No tester would work on here.

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

Originally Posted by sgilligan1

So let me try to grasp the concept here...

You are testing the shower pan by filling it up and seeing if there is a failure or a leak? What happens when you find one that is leaking?

Then the homeowner has a mess to clean up. What happens if you flush a toilet and the toilet drain doesn't function? Is that invasive? We look for leaks at all other plumbing fixtures. Why should a shower be different?

I guess there is some liability with testing showers. There is liability in a lot of the things we do during a home inspection. However, there is also liability if our client buys the home, takes a nice, pleasurable shower and the pan leaks through the ceiling onto the baby grand piano on the 1st floor. And I'm working for the client.

[Bob Elliott]

Forget the shower pan.
Around here my problem is all these new glass shower doors built in stalls with body sprays and fancy shower heads , that are not caulked at wall penetration and spray right through the darn doors which just push open.

They are promised to need a couple of full sized towels to catch all the spill.

They need to make better ways off sealing them, when in use.

[James F. McKee]

maybe I'll play the odd man out here but i have never run across a leaking shower pan that has been leaking for any amount of time without some evidence on the ceiling down below...I've never found it necessary to run a shower for hours to test it....jmho....jim

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

Originally Posted by relliott

Around here my problem is all these new glass shower doors built in stalls with body sprays and fancy shower heads , that are not caulked at wall penetration and spray right through the darn doors which just push open.

They are promised to need a couple of full sized towels to catch all the spill.

They need to make better ways off sealing them, when in use.

Like an installer told me once, "Hey, it's not meant to hold water. It's a shower not an aquarium."

[Bob Elliott]

Originally Posted by jfunderburk

Like an installer told me once, "Hey, it's not meant to hold water. It's a shower not an aquarium."

Yeah but if they do not seal the pipe wall penetration ,those tiles are gonna be loose as the walls are not aquariums either.

[Emmanuel J. Scanlan]

Originally Posted by jmckee

maybe I'll play the odd man out here but i have never run across a leaking shower pan that has been leaking for any amount of time without some evidence on the ceiling down below...I've never found it necessary to run a shower for hours to test it....jmho....jim

I have to agree with James, or be another one of the "Odd Man Out" club. On a first floor shower, slab foundation, I look for signs of water damage in areas adjacent to the shower, i.e. damaged carpet, baseboards, sheetrock, linoleum, grout, etc.

A shower pan test can take a lot longer than even a long inspection unless the breach in the pan is significant. A short test won't check for leaks around nail penetrations, or other such minute breaches. If a breach is significant the evidence is more than likely already there.

As Robert said many leaks are the shower door itself. Occasionally you will run into a sliding door track with an open in the track. Faucets and piping can also develop leaks. If you are running the shower itself for the test then you could potentially call out a shower pan as a leak when it could be a faucet leak behind the wall.

Shower pans are one item that I do have in my contract as not inspected due to the amount of time needed for a proper test. If I see signs of leaks I'll certainly advise the client to have a plumber check it out.

[pking]

Its not all that scary, once the water get 2" high it reaches the top of the stopper, flows over and down the drain. I do this with both site built showers and shower receptors. When I first enter the bedroom the bathroom is connected to I head to the shower. I visually inspect the shower for damages, place the plug, turn the shower on, inspect the bathroom looking back at the shower from time to time, if its not full when I'm done with the bathroom I inspect the bedroom, when the shower is finally full I take a photo of the filled shower with the stopper. I let the water run with the shower full for several minutes, pull the plug, turn off the shower, if it's upstairs I go down and check the ceiling/walls nearby, and I go back into the bathroom a few mintutes later to see if there is a delayed leak onto the floor.
I find about a dozen leaking per year, a site built shower pan can easly run between 3k to 6k (I had one leak Monday in a 3 year old 800k house), and I'm in the middle of fixing a leaky shower receptor right now for a construction client and that bill has hit 4k+.
As far as the ceiling below goes there was not a single stain on the ceiling of the leaky shower I'm repairing, the owner saw it on the wall beside the shower, but my thermal camer and moisture meter nailed the water on the ceiling below. The ceiling on the one that leaked during Monday's inspection was painted a color, the only ceiling in the home that was not ceiling white ( I wonder why).
I carry a few rolls of paper towels with me every day and extra coveralls, I clean any water up right away.
I'm not going to risk eating several K for a new shower.

[pking]

Read up on your code books, site built shower and receptors should hold at least 2" of water or to the threshold.

[Jack L. Gilleland]

I really don't see the point, unless it is open below the pan. If there is a leak it would show itself in other ways. I pay attention to the areas where I would see evidence (crawls, basements, ceilings below the bath, etc.). I can't knock holes in the ceiling of the hall downstairs (well I could).

[Joe Funderburk, CMI]

Originally Posted by jgilleland

I really don't see the point, unless it is open below the pan. If there is a leak it would show itself in other ways. ...

Apparently you didn't read Paul King's post about how many leaking showers he finds per year during an inspection. Say a tile shower leaks 1/2" above the bottom of the shower. You won't find that during normal testing. But the issue may arise about a year after you did the inspection in the form of a letter from an attorney wanting you to pay for re-building the shower. The tiles alone will cost > $500. Personally, I don't want a leak to "show itself" after my client buys the home.

[ldapkus]

Buy it here