Trap help

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

Thats great info, but I fail to see how its a safety issue.

Should it be replaced? I guess that depends on testing and the complete set up of the waste system, venting, et. cetera. Will home purchaser tear it out, or will it nix a deal considerate of the age of the system?

Raymond,
how is sewer gas in the home NOT a safety issue?

These are more common in older homes but are not allowed by current codes.
Report fiindings, explain problem and recommend upgrade for added safety.

[rwand1]

So without knowing the age of the home, the assumption is it is not permissable. If it predates existing code, it is not a requirement to upgrade.

It may not even be a safety concern if it is vented and functioning.

How do you know there is sewer gas as methane is odourless?

The traps functionality depends on proper venting. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

[Michael Larson]

I don't require anything. That is the buyer's decision!

How would you know if it's functioning?

Hardly the only gas present.

Report findings.

[rwand1]

Why would I report something that may not be a concern, if at time of inspection its functioning and the trap remains wet.

I don't have specialized test equipment which is well beyond the SOP to test for gases.


II. The inspector is not required to:

J. Evaluate the compliance with local or state conservation or energy standards, or the proper design or sizing of any water, waste or venting components, fixtures or piping.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

Why would I report something that may not be a concern, if at time of inspection its functioning and the trap remains wet.

Because during your visual inspection you noted an S-trap. You're only guessing that it is functional.

Originally Posted by rwand1

I don't have specialized test equipment which is well beyond the SOP to test for gases.

Is your nose special equipment? Nose aside, you're still guessing.

Originally Posted by rwand1

II. The inspector is not required to:

If you know it's not allowed in current plumbing installations, why would you ignore it?
Do you also ignore missing downspout extensions?
Do you also ignore other code violations that you are aware of?

[rwand1]

I am not guessing at anything. If my nose fails to smell anything untoward it is not likely spilling gasses.

If this is in a new house I would report it. If it is in a century home or 50 year old home it was standard at the time.

Downspout extension could hardly be described as life safety, but yes I would report it as basement leaks could be a result and evidence suggests basements are one of the most common complaints or law suits.

Its not a code violation if its existing and predates the current code. It is not a requirement of the code to upgrade unless renovations are planned. There are many existing older structures with S traps that function fine. To suggest they are all code issues or issues that must be remedied is a misnomer, each case maybe different and that is what should be factored in.

Besides the SOP indicate its going beyond the SOP the way I interpret it.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

I am not guessing at anything. If my nose fails to smell anything untoward it is not likely spilling gasses.

Just because it does'nt smell when you're there doesn't mean that is without problems.

Originally Posted by rwand1

If this is in a new house I would report it. If it is in a century home or 50 year old home it was standard at the time.

They changed the code for a reason.

Originally Posted by rwand1

Downspout extension could hardly be described as life safety, but yes I would report it as basement leaks could be a result and evidence suggests basements are one of the most common complaints or law suits.

But if you saw no other evidence,Why?

Originally Posted by rwand1

Its not a code violation if its existing and predates the current code. It is not a requirement of the code to upgrade unless renovations are planned. There are many existing older structures with S traps that function fine. To suggest they are all code issues or issues that must be remedied is a misnomer, each case maybe different and that is what should be factored in.

Trouble is, you don't know which ones. You're not livingthere.
So overlarge spindle gaps or short railings wouldn't be reported by you either?

Besides the SOP indicate its going beyond the SOP the way I interpret it.[/quote]???????

[rwand1]

Michael

Substantiate your theory that existing systems must be updated to code please.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

Michael

Substantiate your theory that existing systems must be updated to code please.

I never indicated that in any way.
Informing my clients of potential issues is my responsibility.
You of course may do as you wish and incur the liability that goes with it.
I do not site code BTW.

[rwand1]

I inform my clients of potential concerns, but I don't make an issue of something that met code at time of construction.
One thing I noticed about people posting questions on this board is they fail to mention age which is a concern in some instances with what is or was permitted and is still permissable. As with this case the postee has not mentioned the age of the structure which will affect the replies.

[mdiplock]

When renovations are done, all upgrades must be code compliant. If the pipe is ABS plastic, the code was in effect at the time of installation.

[sparksnmore]

True, the code was in effect many years before ABS pipe was ever heard of.
Would you call that an "S" trap, it goes into the back wall, not through the floor?

[jcundiff]

Originally Posted by sparksnmore

True, the code was in effect many years before ABS pipe was ever heard of.
Would you call that an "S" trap, it goes into the back wall, not through the floor?

Its an S trap because the trap arm dose not enter a sanitary ell- it enters a second sweeping ell.

[Jeffrey R. Pope]

Originally Posted by sparksnmore

Would you call that an "S" trap, it goes into the back wall, not through the floor?

You can call it an "S" trap or just an improper trap.

The horizontal runs and pipe sizes do not qualify it to be a "vertical leg" waste drain.

[Bruce M. Graham, III]

Raymond,
Have a nice day in court.