InterNACHI


Go Back   InterNACHI Inspection Forum > Specific Inspection Topics > Structural Inspections

Notices

Structural Inspections Contains discussions about the structural portion of a home inspection. This includes foundations, framing, etc.

 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 6/2/09, 7:55 PM
Joe Funderburk, CMI's Avatar
Joe Funderburk, CMI Joe Funderburk, CMI is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hickory Grove, SC
Posts: 8,342
Send a message via Yahoo to jfunderburk
Question Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Saw this on an inspection today. Didn't see any twisting. Thoughts? Should the straps be utilized? (What's the correct terminology to refer to these straps?)

P.S. The floor above is wood, if that makes any difference.


floor-joist-blocking-straps-should-they-used-060209-103.jpg



“The things that will destroy America are peace at any price,
prosperity at any cost, safety first instead of duty first,
the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.”
Theodore Roosevelt


Joe Funderburk, CMI
Alpha & Omega Home Inspections, LLC
Inspecting Upstate SC & Charlotte Metro, NC
NACHI ID: NACHI05120170
www.aohomeinspection.com


Reply With Quote
Find an InterNACHI certified Georgia Home Inspector (and anywhere else in North America)
  #2  
Old 6/2/09, 7:59 PM
Larry D. Kage Larry D. Kage is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lake Ann (Traverse City), MI
Posts: 8,847
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Yes, the bridging is 1/2 installed.



InterNachi Awards Portal: http://co.nachi.org/inachiawards/

____________________________________________
"An Education, not just an Inspection"

Larry Kage, CMI
Lake Ann (Traverse City), Michigan 49650
231 929 3525


Professional Inspector serving the Traverse City, Michigan area and beyond.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 6/2/09, 8:02 PM
Joe Funderburk, CMI's Avatar
Joe Funderburk, CMI Joe Funderburk, CMI is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hickory Grove, SC
Posts: 8,342
Send a message via Yahoo to jfunderburk
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Why is it required, Larry? Is blocking or bridging always required? If the straps hadn't been there at all, would that be a defect? (I probably wouldn't say anything if they were absent.)



“The things that will destroy America are peace at any price,
prosperity at any cost, safety first instead of duty first,
the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.”
Theodore Roosevelt


Joe Funderburk, CMI
Alpha & Omega Home Inspections, LLC
Inspecting Upstate SC & Charlotte Metro, NC
NACHI ID: NACHI05120170
www.aohomeinspection.com


Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 6/2/09, 8:06 PM
Larry D. Kage Larry D. Kage is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lake Ann (Traverse City), MI
Posts: 8,847
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

They're used to make the floor more rigid. Was there a tile floor above?

I would just recommend completing the installation since it was started.



InterNachi Awards Portal: http://co.nachi.org/inachiawards/

____________________________________________
"An Education, not just an Inspection"

Larry Kage, CMI
Lake Ann (Traverse City), Michigan 49650
231 929 3525


Professional Inspector serving the Traverse City, Michigan area and beyond.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 6/2/09, 8:13 PM
Joe Funderburk, CMI's Avatar
Joe Funderburk, CMI Joe Funderburk, CMI is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hickory Grove, SC
Posts: 8,342
Send a message via Yahoo to jfunderburk
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

There was tile and T&G wood. Correct.

I just feel bad for saying it should be completed, when if it had been absent I wouldn't have said anything. Looking for a reason that it is necessary.



“The things that will destroy America are peace at any price,
prosperity at any cost, safety first instead of duty first,
the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.”
Theodore Roosevelt


Joe Funderburk, CMI
Alpha & Omega Home Inspections, LLC
Inspecting Upstate SC & Charlotte Metro, NC
NACHI ID: NACHI05120170
www.aohomeinspection.com


Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 6/2/09, 8:37 PM
Larry D. Kage Larry D. Kage is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lake Ann (Traverse City), MI
Posts: 8,847
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfunderburk View Post
There was tile and T&G wood. Correct.

I just feel bad for saying it should be completed, when if it had been absent I wouldn't have said anything. Looking for a reason that it is necessary.
It may save the tile floor from cracking and keep the china from rattling.

Plus, like I said before, it is there and only 1/2 installed.

A recommendation to finish the job would be of no consequence.



InterNachi Awards Portal: http://co.nachi.org/inachiawards/

____________________________________________
"An Education, not just an Inspection"

Larry Kage, CMI
Lake Ann (Traverse City), Michigan 49650
231 929 3525


Professional Inspector serving the Traverse City, Michigan area and beyond.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 6/2/09, 8:39 PM
Joshua L. Frederick Joshua L. Frederick is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Defiance, OH
Posts: 832
Send a message via AIM to jfrederick
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Joe,

I ran into this same deal a handfull of times. Why there not always fastened at the bottoms, I don't know. But anyway, here's what I've come up with:

Crawlspace: floor joist bridging
The metal floor joist “X” floor joist ties or bridging brackets were not fastened at the bottom and/or not properly attached in one or more areas. Floor joist bridging is critical to the structural strength of a floor. Proper bridging distributes the load on the floor to other joists and over time prevents floors from sagging and squeaking do to floor joists twisting and warping. Recommend repair and/or reattaching.

Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 6/2/09, 8:46 PM
Wayne B. Wilson's Avatar
Wayne B. Wilson Wayne B. Wilson is online now
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Powell, Tn
Posts: 8,229
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Because they forgot to finish it after the insulation was installed . I write it up . If it isn't present i mention it there is several ways of installing it and it does stop the twisting and squeaks. I lot of builders will say it is not necessary but of course where are they when the problem occurs .
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 6/2/09, 10:46 PM
William M. Corbett's Avatar
William M. Corbett William M. Corbett is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Remlap, AL
Posts: 231
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Some municipalities in my local do not require bridging. Alot of the builders do not complete the installation because they have had bad response from the home owner. The home owners have been complaining of squeaking from the bridging rubbing against itself. I have not experienced that problem personally. That is the info I've gotten from other builders.



Bill Corbett C.H.I.
Magic City Inspections LLC
InspectingtheUnexpected.com
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 6/2/09, 11:04 PM
Jeffery L. Haynes Jeffery L. Haynes is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 3,489
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Most framers will bridge when spans exceed 12 ft,.......usually common with 14 - 16 ft spans and that being at the midspan point...............HOWEVER it is not required unless joist exceed 2x12 and then you can either bridge by cross bridging (also called diagonal bridging), solid bridging (shouldn't be offset) or a continuous 1x3 strip nailed along the bottom of the joist perpendicularly.

Bridging does indeed help distribute loads as well as reduce squeeks.

When one sees it incomplete than it is often because the framer inserted same from the top just before installing the floor sheathing but failed to jump down into the crawlspace to finish the job.

In this particular case it appears that the builder / framer simply picked up the wrong metal cross bridging.......those appear to be for joist 24 inches on center....not 16 inches.

regards

Jeff
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 6/2/09, 11:15 PM
William M. Corbett's Avatar
William M. Corbett William M. Corbett is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Remlap, AL
Posts: 231
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhaynes View Post
Most framers will bridge when spans exceed 12 ft,.......usually common with 14 - 16 ft spans and that being at the midspan point...............HOWEVER it is not required unless joist exceed 2x12 and then you can either bridge by cross bridging (also called diagonal bridging), solid bridging (shouldn't be offset) or a continuous 1x3 strip nailed along the bottom of the joist perpendicularly.

Bridging does indeed help distribute loads as well as reduce squeeks.

When one sees it incomplete than it is often because the framer inserted same from the top just before installing the floor sheathing but failed to jump down into the crawlspace to finish the job.

In this particular case it appears that the builder / framer simply picked up the wrong metal cross bridging.......those appear to be for joist 24 inches on center....not 16 inches.

regards

Jeff
Good eye. I agree. wrong bridging



Bill Corbett C.H.I.
Magic City Inspections LLC
InspectingtheUnexpected.com
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 6/2/09, 11:55 PM
Joe Funderburk, CMI's Avatar
Joe Funderburk, CMI Joe Funderburk, CMI is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hickory Grove, SC
Posts: 8,342
Send a message via Yahoo to jfunderburk
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Whoops! Report has already gone out!

Good eye Jeff.



“The things that will destroy America are peace at any price,
prosperity at any cost, safety first instead of duty first,
the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.”
Theodore Roosevelt


Joe Funderburk, CMI
Alpha & Omega Home Inspections, LLC
Inspecting Upstate SC & Charlotte Metro, NC
NACHI ID: NACHI05120170
www.aohomeinspection.com


Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 6/3/09, 3:46 AM
Jeffery L. Haynes Jeffery L. Haynes is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Concord, NC
Posts: 3,489
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

Joe,

While bridging is good to have.....and those spans appear rather long, probably 2x10x14 joists, based upon building code you are fine........its not something that is going to adversely effect the habitability of the home. (which is your escape if its ever brought up).

Worse case is to simply go back and install a 1x4 (1x3 are obviously uncommon) along the bottom and be done with it.

regards

Jeff
Reply With Quote
Find an InterNACHI certified Georgia Home Inspector (and anywhere else in North America)
  #14  
Old 6/5/09, 11:11 AM
Kenton H. Shepard, CMI's Avatar
Kenton H. Shepard, CMI Kenton H. Shepard, CMI is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 3,417
Send a message via ICQ to kshepard
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

What Jeff said. Bridging is an anti-rotation device, but mainly it encourages squeaking, which is even worse when they require midspan blocks. Wood cross bracing can squeak too.




Kenton Shepard, InterNACHI member # 04082383
Certified Master Inspector (CMI)
InterNACHI Director of International Development
Director of Green Building

EXPERT WITNESS SERVICE
Conventional and Log homes

(303) 717-8940
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 3/26/10, 11:32 PM
thorn2 thorn2 is offline
InterNACHI Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Pleasantville, Ohio
Posts: 30
Default Re: Floor joist blocking straps...should they be used?

If bridging was part of original design it should be installed. It is a lateral bracing of the joist bottom chord. The joist has more load capacity if it is laterally braced on the bottom edge. Just because it is not twisting today does not guarantee it won't later. And remember the floor joists were design based on a 40 PSF floor live load (if it is a first floor). What if a pool table or something large was placed on the floor. You never know. Bottom line if it was there and intended to be installed why not just state for them to finish it? And yes, if it was absent to start with how would you know it belonged there? You don't, since you did not design it. There are a lot of redundancies in structural design so will it be a problem? Maybe never...I would have written it up. Seems like a waiving red flag.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Plates at rim joists with attached straps rharrington Structural Inspections 5 4/25/08 1:44 PM
Under roof straps gheller Structural Inspections 4 11/23/07 8:36 PM
copper pipes supported with steel straps bking Plumbing Inspections 3 9/11/06 3:01 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:46 AM.


Popular Sections

:

All Sections

Inspection News

InterNACHI Membership

Inspection Standards

Inspection Education

InterNACHI Inspectors

Inspection Links

 

 

 

NACHI.ORG Statistics

 

 

no new posts