roof

[Patrick Bolliger]

Here you go guys, My place built around Circa 1890. No Venting in my attic until the "new" roof was installed Notice something...

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

I would not report the roof as deficient due to this condition ... prior to the 1960's there was no solid sheathing at all and all roofs were laid over boards.

I disagree with ya on this one mate. I may not report the condition as a defect that needs repair unless there were signs of problems, but I would at least report it as a concern. Spaced wood decking/sheathing with asphalt shingles was not common even for a 1960's home. Also, materials have changed over the years, and applying a newer roofing system over an old deck that doesn't meet current manufacturer's and industry standards is not a good idea.

In addition, present day manufacturers of asphalt shingles require a solid wood deck for attachment, and application on older spaced wood decking could void the warranty (see this link for one example ... http://www.gaf.com/Content/Documents/20222.pdf). That is exactly why the spaced wood decking on one house rehab project I was involved with got stripped off and replaced with plywood ... just too much effort to fill in the gaps to meet the mfr requirements, and ya ended up with partially questionable existing deck areas after all that work.

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

... we can't start imposing modern IRC codes on home built prior to the code and before the advent of modern sheathing materials.

Hmmm ... I was pretty surprised by that comment from you since you are such a big fan of HI's using the CodeCheck series as a field reference, and since an HI has little to reference besides an SOP and current industry standards (such as the IRC and NEC) which you often quote/reference yourself.

I would then assume you also wouldn't report on the lack of GFCI receptacles in an old bathroom, or older framing with limited beam bearing or no hurricane/earthquake tie downs in risky areas (like FL) ... all of which were acceptable at some time for older homes but wouldn't meet current construction standards (and for good reason).

Sorry mate, couldn't resist ...

[gbeaumont]

Rob,

I always advocte calling out any and all safety issues, this isn't one, at best it is a performance issue.

Regards

Gerry

[Robert J. OConnor]

Inadequate anchors/strapping in an older home would likewise not be a safety issue, as it's a building performance issue due to the excessive damage that could occur over time due to storms, but should be called out as a concern every time.

Incorrectly/inadequately nailed shingles (as a result of locating the attachment at planks) also wouldn't fair to well in a storm. That's a common problem/defect here along the northeast coast. Shingle that are not correctly/adequately nailed go flying in the first good storm.

Just a little surprised by your take on the spaced plank decking with asphalt shingles, as a client should be aware that the roofing may not perform well over time due to storms, may have a voided material warranty, and the client may have to spend a good amount of money to correctly replace the shingles in the future if they want it done right with a full warranty from the manufacturer. Maybe you just need some more time living in the hurricaine capital of the US down there in FL (duck ... lol).

JMO & 2-nickels ...

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by roconnor

Spaced wood decking/sheathing with asphalt shingles was not common even for a 1960's home.

Very common in South Texas in the 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, and 1970s.

I find it out here quite often on homes built in the 1950s, 1960s, and 1970s, as well. Perhaps it has something to do with the hot, dry climate?

[Russel Ray]

I also consider it a maintenance/performance issue, but also touch on safety since I have personal experience in stepping in the wrong spot (back when I walked roofs, you understand, not as a home inspector) and having a foot go through the roof. So here's what I put in my report:

Roof had been skip-sheathed. This is common for construction from this time period but could create a hazardous condition for any personnel working on exterior roof without this knowledge. Condition also makes damage to the roof easier than when full sheathing is used, and could increase the cost of installing a new roof when next required. Chaning type of roof covering, such as from composition to concrete or clay tiles, will also result in an increased cost. Recommend notifying any personnel of skip-sheathing if exterior roof work is needed. Recommend regular homeowner monitoring and maintenance.

[gbeaumont]

Originally Posted by jmaisano

Yesterday I inspected a house, that had a bat and board style roof instead of plywood sheeting. This house was built 50+ years ago. It has a composition shingle roof with several leaks. Can you put this type of roof on a bat and board roof? I don't beleive you can, I wrote it up repair or replace with plywood or OSB sheeting. Any views on this?

Rob, lets go back to the begining here, we are not talking about spaced sheathing as would be used under shakes, we are talking about the rough-*** old timber planking that you will find as sheathing on most 50 year old roofs.

But you knew that

Regards

Gerry

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Russel,

Now I knew you were an old fella...lol.....but do you remeber the good ole' 30's..thehehehhe

Very common in South Texas in the 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, and 1970s.

[Russel Ray]

Originally Posted by pabernathy

Russel,

Now I knew you were an old fella...lol.....but do you remeber the good ole' 30's..thehehehhe

Yes.
I'm a history fanatic.

My grandparents built their home in Kingsville, Texas, in 1933. Skip-sheathed, as were all the neighborhood houses built there in the 1930s, 1940s, and 1950s. I used to love playing in those ol' attics (and under the houses, as well; cool foundations).

[Paul W. Abernathy]

Oh...ok.....For a second their I thought YOU helped him do it back in the 30's...thehehehhee......

[Robert J. OConnor]

Originally Posted by rray

I find it out here quite often on homes built in the 1950s, 1960s, and 1970s, as well.

Now ya got me curious. Were those houses originally constructed with asphalt shingles over spaced wood plank decking? Or were they originally wood shingles that were later re-roofed with asphalt shingles? Also note that spaced wood plank decking does not hold up well in an earthquake.

Originally Posted by roconnor

Spaced wood decking/sheathing with asphalt shingles was not common even for a 1960's home.

I should have noted ... "for the original construction ... around my neck of the woods" ...

Originally Posted by gbeaumont

If the singles are not correctly nailed due to gaps between the boards then that is all I would report.

I think there is more to it than that.

P.S. Gerry, I'm also not following the comments on codes then, as the IRC and manufacturers allow wood plank decking for asphalt shingles (with small gaps similar to plywood), but not spaced plank sheathing (which is only acceptable for wood shingles in most areas).

JMO & 2-nickels ...

[Jay Moge]

Originally Posted by pbolliger

Here you go guys, My place built around Circa 1890. No Venting in my attic until the "new" roof was installed Notice something...

yeah, sheathing added over the batton boards, adding to the total weight of the roof system, but kinda needed due to rafter spaceing.

[Russel Ray]

Concur with Joe.

[Marcel R. Cyr]

Robert;

You need to take it easy on Gerry, fore he might get overstressed and we will all miss out on his inputs to this board.
After, all he is right in his deduction, I have seen this type of Construction, and there was nothing wrong with it then and is still surviving strong.
Doesn't that make you wonder of todays standards?

I would believe, that the yester year building is as adequate as of today.
Buildings today, as far as Commercial is concerned, is based on a 20 year turnaround.

I call this disposable buildings.

Residential buildings that were built in circa-1800's are some of the most interesting Handy-crafted specimens around compared to todays standards.
How can one compare these outstanding performances to today's standards?
Inspected a house just this past few days that dated back to 1892, and had to admire the condition it was in.

You might need to brush up on how things used to be built. I believe that is what Gerry is trying to point out.

Gerry has been there and so have I. Not trying to outguess you Gerry, but if I am, just let me know.

Marcel
</IMG></IMG></IMG></IMG></IMG>

[rwand1]

All old Victorian farmhouses used spaced decking. They were never vented because lets face it they were pretty drafty and the spaced decking prolonged the life of the roof. Even today, I have seen many a farm houses from late 1800 that are not vented, and are plank decking and are no worse for no ventilation, not to mention the lack of solid decking.

I don't know about others but I do not attempt to make an old house new again or to todays standards.