Congrats to Claude Lawrenson, MICB's newest CMI.

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

[quote=bmullen1

Lighten up a little and you'll be surprised what can be achieved.

Bill Mullen
Sarnia[/quote]
Bill mullen keeping his word would be a great place to start.

.... Cookie

[rwand1]

Bill

Whose attacking? I have asked questions as have others. If you consider it attacking thats your take. The fact remains that these documents are not being released for a reason. We have been told repeatedly by CMHC and you and Claude that its an open process but we continually seem to be going in circles.

Respect, I think I have been very respectful of you and Claude, I have not resorted to name calling.

[Claude Lawrenson]

Yes, I agree Ray has been very respectful. - So - thank YOU!

Sorry - but perhaps this may help. In general the info about the requirements are very public on the NCA-ANC website. In addition, the application form provides some additional information.

Most of the governance documents - now becoming NCA Policies are taken right from the CHIBO-2 final report, authored by the Management Consultants. Over the past year, the chairs - Graham Clarke, Ari Marantz, and myself and along with Bill's Project Manager report - have all worked and contributed to co-authoring the NCA Policy Manual. With monthly and intially sometimes twice a month meetings the discussions and review by the NCA-NCC & NAC has helped create the foundations of taking the National Certification Program beyond the Pilot Project phase. The document will be presented for final approval at the CAHPI National Conference at our next NCA meeting. This has been an ongoing project for over the past year. Even looking ahead policy created today tends to become living documents that leads to change and reconsideration over time.

This will include a number of policies such as accredited training, logo use, renewal, fees, complaints, discipline and governance of the NCA. Being an ELECTED body the policy manual provides for uniformity and continuation of the management and organization of responsibilities and duties of National Certificate Holders.

The key points have already become public information. Additionally, the NCA has also appointed an "ombudsman" and also works with a legal advisor in formalizing agreements.

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by clawrenson

The key points have already become public information. Additionally, the NCA has also appointed an "ombudsman" and also works with a legal advisor in formalizing agreements.

I wonder why you would post just part of the information .If you feel it is important enough to post that the NCA has appointed an "ombudsman" why ypu would not give their name . I remember when OAHI/CAHPI ( after my asking why they do not have one ) appointed one and refused to give his name for a long time .
Then they handcufed his powers buy insisting he report to the OAHI directors.
I would ask if this is going to be the same here but as per usual I expect no one is allowed to give out this information as per all the rest of the questions asked .
...... Cookie

[Bill Mullen]

Originally Posted by clawrenson

Yes, I agree Ray has been very respectful. - So - thank YOU!

Raymond has indeed been more respectful than I gave him credit for. Thanks and sorry if I sounded harsher than needed.

Claude and I have truly been trying, and not just over here.

I hear that the NCA that will be elected next month just might have a NACHI member aboard besides those of us with multiple memberships. I look forward to that.

Bill Mullen

[Bill Mullen]

Originally Posted by rcooke

I wonder why you would post just part of the information .If you feel it is important enough to post that the NCA has appointed an "ombudsman" why ypu would not give their name . I remember when OAHI/CAHPI ( after my asking why they do not have one ) appointed one and refused to give his name for a long time .
Then they handcufed his powers buy insisting he report to the OAHI directors.
I would ask if this is going to be the same here but as per usual I expect no one is allowed to give out this information as per all the rest of the questions asked .
...... Cookie

Roy:

CAHPI and the NCA are not operated like NACHI. They have Boards and committees that all have to review, argue and pass many motions begore anything is part of the 'official documentation.' I wish we were like NACHI and I could be like Nick and just decide matters myself with or without consulting anyone. It sure gets things done fast, and I have no problem with it because that's the way NACHI is set up. Nick does not have to answer to anyone so he can do that, and more power to him.............I'm envious. Fortunately for you, Nick cares about his members. It could have turned out disastrous like NAHI if he didn't do everything he thought would benefit his members.

CAHPI's leaders have to consult the CAHPI members on everything important. It slows down the decision process, but that's the way it is set up. The same goes for the NCA. Decisions are always made by committees and not just one person.

The Ombudsman position has been appointed but I'm not sure they have officially accepted. When that happens, the name or names will be made public.

Bill Mullen

[rwand1]

Bill and Claude,

Yes there is additional info on the National site, but still trying to find out about bylaws and discipline procedures, policy, who one is beholden to. Maybe within a short time that to will be available.

Thanks for the info. No hard feelings, like you I am passionate about the profession. I think that shows eh?

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Bill the only information we get is your openion and claudes I am not allowed to give out that info.
You keep telling us how great the NCA is but still we look and plead for information. This has gone on since January of 2006 .
... Cookie.... sick and tired of the same old no information.

[rwand1]

Bill stated...

CAHPI's leaders have to consult the CAHPI members on everything important. It slows down the decision process, but that's the way it is set up. The same goes for the NCA. Decisions are always made by committees and not just one person.

Now you tell us! You should have told us earlier about the decision making process.

[Bill Mullen]

Originally Posted by rcooke

Bill the only information we get is your openion and claudes I am not allowed to give out that info.
You keep telling us how great the NCA is but still we look and plead for information. This has gone on since January of 2006 .
... Cookie.... sick and tired of the same old no information.

Roy:

There is no more accurate opinion in Canada than Claude's because he is the Chair of the NCA. Every bit of information crosses his desk except personal information about applicants. If he gives an answer, it's the latest information available. I am likely not as current with information as Claude but in my advisory role, little is kept from me as well.

Who else would you prefer to receive information from if not the two people in Canada who know more about the NCP than anyone? We are also the only two who have volunteered volumes of information over the many months. You might not agree with the information all the time, and I confess we might have been less than friendly at times fora few reasons, but I assure you it is as correct as we can understand it to be.

As Claude mentioned, the NCP is and always will be a 'living project' so some things that are in effect now could be changed a bit in a couple months if need be. This is no different that the various amendments to the CMI requirements that in the end made it much more stringent.

I hate to argue, Roy, but we have not and will not be 'pleading'. The NCP is voluntary. We now have between 400 and 500 inspectors either certified or close to it and that's enough to provide service for the many government and other services that will shortly be announced. It would be nice if people applied, and I highly recommend it, but a figure of 500 makes me happy that we can meet the needs that are coming for only National Certificate Holders.

What we should be doing now is forgetting the battles over CMI, NCP, etc. and concentrate on making the industry more professional and respectable. I know Raymond won't like this, but I recently met with some government people who said that in Ontario alone there are more than 3,000 people who call themselves Home Inspectors. That means that 1/2 to 2/3 of these are not members of any association. We should be combining our resources and convincing these people to take courses and training and get some kind of valid certification. (I didn't say where)

Bill Mullen

Bill Mullen

[Bill Mullen]

Originally Posted by rwand1

Bill stated...

Now you tell us! You should have told us earlier about the decision making process.

I'm all for having a benign dictatorship where I make all the decisions but I could never get away with it.

Bill Mullen

[rwand1]

What we should be doing now is forgetting the battles over CMI, NCP, etc. and concentrate on making the industry more professional and respectable. I know Raymond won't like this, but I recently met with some government people who said that in Ontario alone there are more than 3,000 people who call themselves Home Inspectors. That means that 1/2 to 2/3 of these are not members of any association. We should be combining our resources and convincing these people to take courses and training and get some kind of valid certification. (I didn't say where)

Bill, I like it!

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by bmullen1

Roy:

There is no more accurate opinion in Canada than Claude's because he is the Chair of the NCA. Every bit of information crosses his desk except personal information about applicants. If he gives an answer,... Soon I hope ... Soon I hope he does give some answers it's the latest information available. I am likely not as current with information as Claude but in my advisory role, little is kept from me as well.

Who else would you prefer to receive information from if not the two people in Canada who know more about the NCP than anyone? We are also the only two who have volunteered volumes of information over the many months. You might not agree with the information all the time, and I confess we might have been less than friendly at times fora few reasons, but I assure you it is as correct as we can understand it to be.

As Claude mentioned, the NCP is and always will be a 'living project' so some things that are in effect now could be changed a bit in a couple months if need be. This is no different that the various amendments to the CMI requirements that in the end made it much more stringent.

I hate to argue, Roy, but we have not and will not be 'pleading'. The NCP is voluntary. We now have between 400 and 500 inspectors either certified or close to it and that's enough.Yep still no information why not say and give an exact figure . .. to provide service for the many government and other services that will shortly be announced. It would be nice if people applied, and I highly recommend it, but a figure of 500 makes me happy that we can meet the needs that are coming for only National Certificate Holders.

What we should be doing now is forgetting the battles over CMI, NCP, etc. and concentrate on making the industry more professional and respectable. I know Raymond won't like this, but I recently met with some government people who said that in Ontario alone there are more than 3,000 people who call themselves Home Inspectors. That means that 1/2 to 2/3 of these are not members of any association. We should be combining our resources and convincing these people to take courses and training and get some kind of valid certification. (I didn't say where)

Bill Mullen

Bill Mullen

Bill from the get go you have not given a figure . You tell us you get the information then why not say we have @#$V that have now been verified .
I expect you will hedge again because you are too embarrassed to give true figures .
Not once have I seen any accurate figures .
Like OAHI says they Have about 800 when we all know come January when the true figures come out their will be less then 250 RHIs.
Bill you want to succeed then quit fudging and tell it like it is .
Most of our disagreements have been lack of information .
If there is only 167 then be truth full I and I expect others can live with the facts .
But goblidty gook is not the way to go and succeed.
All the best .... Cookie

[Bill Mullen]

Originally Posted by rcooke

Bill from the get go you have not given a figure . You tell us you get the information then why not say we have @#$V that have now been verified .
I expect you will hedge again because you are too embarrassed to give true figures .
Not once have I seen any accurate figures .
Like OAHI says they Have about 800 when we all know come January when the true figures come out their will be less then 250 RHIs.
Bill you want to succeed then quit fudging and tell it like it is .
Most of our disagreements have been lack of information .
If there is only 167 then be truth full I and I expect others can live with the facts .
But goblidty gook is not the way to go and succeed.
All the best .... Cookie

No embarrassment at all. The last figure I heard was that there are about 120 who now have the designation, about 110 more who are about to be tested in their TIPR's and should be certified within a month or two, plus about 200+ more who have applied and are having their Applications for Background reviewed or are somewhere in the process.

As for OAHI, I am the last to defend them, but the truth is there are likely closer to 400 who are authorized to do home inspections and have taken enough courses and tests to qualify for that. It's much the same in NACHI where you have 500 to 600 members in Canada, but I know many who are not even in the inspection business....and I don't care.

My biggest concern is all those out there who are doing Home Inspections with no training, no testing, no experience and no association Code of Ethics or Standards to abide by. These people are dangerous and we should be combining our resources to get them either trained and tested or out of the industry.

Bill Mullen

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by bmullen1

No embarrassment at all. The last figure I heard was that there are about 120 who now have the designation, about 110 more who are about to be tested in their TIPR's and should be certified within a month or two, plus about 200+ more who have applied and are having their Applications for Background reviewed or are somewhere in the process.

As for OAHI, I am the last to defend them, but the truth is there are likely closer to 400 who are authorized to do home inspections and have taken enough courses and tests to qualify for that. It's much the same in NACHI where you have 500 to 600 members in Canada, but I know many who are not even in the inspection business....and I don't care.

My biggest concern is all those out there who are doing Home Inspections with no training, no testing, no experience and no association Code of Ethics or Standards to abide by. These people are dangerous and we should be combining our resources to get them either trained and tested or out of the industry.

Bill Mullen

Thanks Bill .
This is the first that I have seen of any figures from any NCA director.
Please keep the information comming.
Yes we both agree on the need of Training .
I am mentoring two at this time and these I expect will make good inspectors and should not be part of the aprox 90% who are gone in about three years.

... Cookie