Furnace Question

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

Info needed, we did an inspection on a permanent modular home in Aug. Furnace is a Gama Unitary Pro. Mid efficiency 10 years old, told client to have serviced and to open the area of the furnace to allow more combustion air. Superior Propane came to the house to inspect the gas appliances prior to filling the propane tanks. Their inspection of the furnace lead them to condemn the unit and force the client to purchase a new furnace within 30 days. The inspector from superior informed the client since the furnace was in the original trailer part of the house, the unit must meet trailer codes. The code requires the furnace to be Direct vent style. Should we as home inspectors have noted this as a problem?? Clients, Superior Propane inspector and clients lawyer believe that this problem should have been found during our inspection. What you say??

[rwand1]

I don't see how you would be obligated to know this info based on existing furnace and what would be required with a new furnace.

If the lawyer and the Superior Propane state you should have seen it tell them you would like that finding put on their letterhead. You had alerted the buyer to possible concerns and to carry out further investigation. The onus was with them to carry out your recommendation, they did this but once they did the authority having greater jurisdiction has final say. Not your fault, and perhaps Superior propane is wanting to sell a new furnace. The Superior inspector should not be making statements stating that you should have known. Obviously you knew enough to recommend further investigation.

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

The mls. listing states pemanant modular home. Has a peak roof over a double wide unit, car port and hot tub solarium,200 amp service, fire place, all sided, all under 1 roof. Furnace installed 10 years ago and has been serviced since. Superior took over the fuel delivery June 05.

[rwand1]

A 10 year old furnace likely never had to be direct vented 10 years ago, why would it have to meet current code if its not in need of replacement only more combustion air? I don't get what Superior is implying. Have they put any of this in writing?

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

All I have is a letter from the client and he implies that Superior Propane inspector, client and clients lawyer believe I should have known of this.

[rwand1]

Well I would say let him prove it by providing Superior Propanes written findings on their company letterhead. The client stating Superior says you should have found it would not pass scrutiny of a court. The court would want proof this was stated, and the only manner in which the plaintiff can do that is provide written proof from Superior on letterhead. Without such proof the plaintiff could allege anything, and the onus is on him to support his allegations. You are not in the wrong the way I see it.

[rwand1]

If the furnace was serviced over the 10 year period and Superior took over in June 05, I would also question if they inspected the unit within the last year and four months since they took over. I don't see how they could take over fuel delivery without inspecting the furnace back in June 05.

[Gerry Pallotta]

Hi Charles.
Similiar situation happened on one of my sites. as long as we serviced the original hot water tank we were o.k. but the minute we changed the water tank we had to take the expense of changing the 3" vent to a 4" venting system. We never new this until one day we happenned to be short of contractors and had to call direct energy to change the water tank. They stated this was a recent code change that we had to comply with. They inspected the rest of the units and all the recent work we did had to comply or they would shut them down. Our contractors at the time were not aware of the code change (since they were not published yet) we still had to comply regardless,since they are code guys and have all the authority and power.
They expect everybody to know what they know and if you don't then you shouldn't be in that business.
Arrogant bunch of guys.

Gerry Pallotta

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

Going to call TSSA and Superior Propane in the AM, as you say I think the Superior inspector is calling out new codes, plus they have been suppling fuel to the unit(home).

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

If you live in Ontario Superior Propane says these 10-year inspeciton are required

10-Year InspectionsAs a leader in the propane industry, Superior Propane is dedicated to ensuring high levels of safety and compliance for our customers. As part of this commitment, Superior offers 10-year inspections, providing you with peace-of-mind in knowing your propane system meets safety standards. If you live in Ontario, these inspections are required in order to comply with the CAN/CSA B149.2 Propane Storage and Handling Code and the CAN/CSA B149.1 Natural Gas and Propane Installation Code. The objective of the legislation is to ensure that these systems meet the propane gas code requirements and are in safe operating condition.
Superior Propane Inspection Program
Since Ontario is the only province that currently legislates 10-year inspections, Superior Propane's Inspection Program has been created to cover all the requirements under the Ontario law. Superior's national network with locations from coast to coast means we can perform inspections anywhere in Canada. The major components of the program include:

• Completing an inspection of all propane lines.
• Operating all appliances to ensure that they are operating properly and venting effectively.
• Completing a visual inspection of all regulators, joints and fittings.
• If repairs to the customer-owned equipment are needed to meet the regulatory requirements, our Service Representative will give you a quote on these costs and schedule a time for work to be completed.

Who will conduct your inspection? A certified and knowledgeable Superior Propane Service Representative will conduct your 10-year inspection. After the inspection is completed, the Service Representative will review the results with you, answer any questions you might have and keep your inspection on file.
How Long Does it Take? Depending on the number of appliances and size of the installation, in most cases, the 10-year inspection will take approximately 1.5 hours to complete. Since it includes an inspection of your appliances, someone must be at the premises to let the Service Representative inside.

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

Here is the link- http://www.superiorpropane.com/exter...d=5-399&lang=1

[Charles R. N. Crooker]

Originally Posted by ccrooker

Here is the link- http://www.superiorpropane.com/external/bins/content_page.asp?cid=5-399&lang=1

Well I just got a call from superiorpropane's area manager and after I told him of the home he said as I did service the existing furnace, he also said that he remembers a big meeting on this subject not too long ago and if it is on blocks and not towable it is permanent. A direct vent furnace is not needed. Call the client and told him and gave him the guys phone #. Could not thank me enough, and thanx for all the ideas and concerns here.

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by ccrooker

[/url] Well I just got a call from superiorpropane's area manager and after I told him of the home he said as I did service the existing furnace, he also said that he remembers a big meeting on this subject not too long ago and if it is on blocks and not towable it is permanent. A direct vent furnace is not needed. Call the client and told him and gave him the guys phone #. Could not thank me enough, and thanx for all the ideas and concerns here.

Thank you Chuck it is effort like this and others that Continue to show why NACHI is truly Number one .
Roy Cooke

[rwand1]

I knew it was too good to believe!

Now I hope both the homeowner, the lawyer and the Superior inspector retract their statements. It seems someone was looking for you to possibly pay for a new furnace.

The value of experience is not in seeing much,
but in seeing wisely!

- Sir William Osler 1905