Need to know????

[rwand1]

Michael

Its not your small time frame that needs to be compared but the geological evidence in old growth forest, soils, and frozen layers of ice. Thats the true record of what is occuring and what has happened. It mother natures way of keeping records.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

Michael

Its not your small time frame that needs to be compared but the geological evidence in old growth forest, soils, and frozen layers of ice. Thats the true record of what is occuring and what has happened. It mother natures way of keeping records.

Raymond,

Jason told me to look around. Since I have no time machine I deduced he was referring to personal experience.

Just for you Raymond.
Have there been other periods of Global Climate change according to the "true" records you referenced?

If in the record, what was the cause of those changes?

[rwand1]

Michael

There are many reasons why the climate may have changed. Asteroid impacts, change in orbit of the earth, magnetic changes, volcanic action, plate techtonics. Which one would you like to discuss?

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

Michael

There are many reasons why the climate may have changed. Asteroid impacts, change in orbit of the earth, magnetic changes, volcanic action, plate techtonics. Which one would you like to discuss?

There are more including the sun's intensity.

So when these naturally occurring events happen. what shall be done about it?

[rwand1]

As to what is to be done about it, Jason has provided some quality answers.

Thanks Jason.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by rwand1

As to what is to be done about it, Jason has provided some quality answers.

Thanks Jason.

If you accept that then please answer my followup questions above so that we may advance the discussion.

I'm trying to get beyond the hype and emotion and discuss the facts and determine logical conclusions.

I'm sure you understood my question to you. But here it is again.

What shall be done when these events occur?
(Asteroid impacts, change in orbit of the earth, magnetic changes, volcanic action, plate techtonics and I added sun's intensity)

[Jason1]

Quid pro quo, Micheal.

But since you seem to be on the fence about the subject, there is not much to debate about, is there?

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by Jason1

Quid pro quo, Micheal.

But since you seem to be on the fence about the subject, there is not much to debate about, is there?

Huh?

I have a well formed opinion on what I think is going on. I am not on any "fence". I have informed myself on how both sides of this issue defend their views. I was only trying to promote healthy debate and exchange of information in support of one's opinion.

Let me make it clear for you Jason since it looks like you don't want to engage.
I do not think we as a global society have considered the costs of mitigating what is referred to as global warming. The press has done us a great disservice in usually only presenting one side of the issue. There are other views out there. There is other research out there. There are cost benefit studies that have been done.

The typical scenario presented to us by the press and environmental activists is:

That Man has caused this evil and must be reigned in.
That we must do something now.
That we have no options.
That we are doomed if we do nothing.
That global warming only does harm.
That the Kyoto protocols and the IPCC will be our savior.
That the vaunted scientists have all agreed and that there is no longer any real debate.

That's a short list but it's enough for now. If you have a different opinion I encourage you state it and provide support for it.

[Jason1]

Originally Posted by mlarson

If you have a different opinion I encourage you state it and provide support for it.

I have a feeling that would be an excerise in futility. We are of two different opinions by the sound of it, and that's fine. I don't have the energy to try and change your opinion, nor do I want to debate the subject.

We are a threat to our environment, period.

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by Jason1

I have a feeling that would be an excerise in futility. We are of two different opinions by the sound of it, and that's fine. I don't have the energy to try and change your opinion, nor do I want to debate the subject.

We are a threat to our environment, period.

Now that's definitive. Any proof?

So what your saying is that you are unwilling to defend your point on view because you are sure you won't be able to change mine.

Jason, don't let pesky things like facts and opposing opinions challenge your thinking. Just follow along like a sheep and be content in being told what to believe and think. That thinking is far too common from my perspective. How sad.

Anyone else? Jason has apparently opted out.

[rwand1]

Hey looks like Global warming is over. Its cold here today with a windchill. About an inch of snow. The ponds frozen over, and the riverbank is getting ice. But the suns out.

False alarm.

[Jason1]

Originally Posted by mlarson

Jason, don't let pesky things like facts and opposing opinions challenge your thinking. Just follow along like a sheep and be content in being told what to believe and think. That thinking is far too common from my perspective. How sad.

I have done a ton of research on the subject.

My thoughts are my own.

Your lack of respect for others opinions is noted, why would I subject myself to your belittling?

[Michael Larson]

Originally Posted by Jason1

I have done a ton of research on the subject.

My thoughts are my own.

Your lack of respect for others opinions is noted, why would I subject myself to your belittling?

Jason you were "belittled" by me because you would not engage the subject. From my perspective you have presented nothing but unsupported statements and have chosen not to engage the questions I have asked(which were originally directed at Claude). That's your choice. If you want to respond to my questions or offer one of your own, please do. I will respond just to advance the disussion. Or you can feign futility and refuse again.

[George A. H. Luck]

Here's what I don't understand;

1- It is generally accepted that the planet is emerging from the "MiniIce Age" that lasted roughly from 1400 to 1800+. Based on an historical record that includes these dates the "gore-ites" proclaim that the detected warming , that includes the natural warming period, is proof positive that we have man induced global warming.

2- The geological record clearly indicates that the planet goes through semi-regular warming and cooling periods. The "gore-its" claim the latest warming as proof positive that we have man induced global warming.

3- The suns output over the last 50 years seems to be up by 1 - 3 % which represents a very large increase in the amount of energy reaching the surface of the earth. The resultant warming is seized upon by the "gore-ites" as proof positive that we have man induced global warming.

4- There are indications that the gulf stream is changing directions and exposing norther Europe to less heat and the arctic to more. This increase in sea temperatures in the arctic is claimed by "gore-ites" to be the result of man induced global warming. The resultant decrease in ice depths is also seized upon as proof positive.

5- When the vikings landed in Greenland they named it Greenland because it was ( and I know this is a stretch) GREEN. Their record speaks of large areas of cultivated fields, and their villages, now covered with at least snow, contain examples of grains and vines that would grow in only more temperate climates. "Gore-ites" claim the return to conditions found over 1000 years ago to be the result of man induced global warming.

6- When the Vikings inhabited the northern most point of Newfoundland they named it "Vineland" because they were able to grow vines and other more temperate crops. Today - not so much. The "gore-ites" refuse to address this recorded anomaly.

There are others but I have used up enough space for now.
Thoughts?

[Larry D. Kage]

Yes, I feel for all those suffering the latest ice storms...hang in there.