older homes with Mario Kyriacou,

[Bill Mullen]

Originally Posted by Raymond E. Wand

Never ever have seen black sheathed Alu. wiring. Only green or silver sheathing.

As to arsenic in horse hair insulation, never heard of that either, and cannot find any reference to confirm. Where is that info about horse hair and arsenic from?

Cheers,

I agree on the aluminum wiring, Ray.

As for the horse hair, I have been told that the solution of chemical used to remove the hair from the horse hide contained arsenic and that the residue in turn would have some.

Bill Mullen

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

Originally Posted by Raymond E. Wand

Never ever have seen black sheathed Alu. wiring. Only green or silver sheathing.

As to arsenic in horse hair insulation, never heard of that either, and cannot find any reference to confirm. Where is that info about horse hair and arsenic from?

Cheers,

Just a little mix up with K&T and Aluminum wiring on Heather's part, no big deal. Next time your on an inspection take a sample of old plaster and have it analyzed.

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by Raymond E. Wand

Never ever have seen black sheathed Alu. wiring. Only green or silver sheathing.

As to arsenic in horse hair insulation, never heard of that either, and cannot find any reference to confirm. Where is that info about horse hair and arsenic from?

Cheers,

Well Raymond we finally found something you did not Know.
Just Google this and you will get many places to confirm this .
I tell all my clients to never use a saws all or jig saw to cut Lath and plaster is this breaks the keys holding the Plaster on the lath always use a rotary saw as it does not shake the plaster loose from the lath.

Yes the hair has Arsenic
...Cookie


The ducts in this house are not wrapped in asbestos as were those in my house in Denver, however the old horse hair plaster in this house may contain arsenic and asbestos, and there is that lead paint on the cupboards that will wind up in a landfill. The local utility reports on levels of lead and other contaminants in the municipal water supply. The levels are below EPA regulatory levels, but Federal regulatory levels don't console me. Another report crosses my
desk stating that the land at the origins of the Androscoggin and the Kennebec have high levels of lead. (My father tells me that when his grandfather lived in Livermore Falls, the Androscoggin ran yellow from the waste of the paper mills. That river and those people have had it bad.)

[Raymond E. Wand]

Arsenic was used in tanneries perhaps that is how the arsenic found its way into the horse hair.

thanks Bill.

[Raymond E. Wand]

http://www.rsc.org/delivery/_Article...JournalCode=AN

GASEOUS ARSENIC FROM WALL-PLASTER

To quote Spock: Fascinating Captain!

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by Raymond E. Wand

Arsenic was used in tanneries perhaps that is how the arsenic found its way into the horse hair.

thanks Bill.

No some of the Googles I read said it was put in the mix. after they had soaked the hair and beat the lumps out of the hair.
I was told this same thing many years ago.
...Cookie

[jbettencourt]

Good article Mario, you guys just helped me learn about the horse hair and arsenic. thanks .

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

Originally Posted by jbettencourt

Good article Mario, you guys just helped me learn about the horse hair and arsenic. thanks .

Thanks and you are welcome Jerry!!

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

I just purchased the actual newspaper, this article is half the page!!

[Roy D. Cooke, Sr]

Originally Posted by jbettencourt

Good article Mario, you guys just helped me learn about the horse hair and arsenic. thanks .

Remember rotary saw only so you do not destroy the old plaster.
NACHI where we all help each other No place like it.
...Cookie

[Raymond E. Wand]

Soak it down!

[Marcel R. Cyr]

Interesting topic seeing I personally demo this stuff every other project.

I thought I would supply this to see if it helps.

The only sure way to find out is have it tested.

Horsehair in Old Plaster May be Arsenic-Laden, Investigator Warns


A Delaware engineer investigating old tannery sites is warning remodelers of a possible risk of arsenic exposure from old plaster that contains animal hair.

Tasked with evaluating former tannery sites in Delaware, Kevin Hansen of the environmental firm Tetra Tech looked into the history of tanning in the area, which dates back to at least the early 1800s and continued up to the 1950s. Historical documents and interviews with surviving workers revealed that the leather-making industry routinely used arsenic to strip hair off animal hides. On the side, says Hansen, the tanneries sold horsehair to the plaster industry.

Horsehair used in old plaster may have been soaked with arsenic, making plaster demolition particularly harmful to remodelers. "The hides were soaked in a slurry of lime and arsenic," he explains, "which was enough to soften the hair and cause it to begin to fall out. The workers would scrape the remaining hair off, so they were soaking themselves in the arsenic." Tannery workers often developed a malady called "blackfoot disease" from the arsenic exposure.

"The waste product was a cake containing horsehair, lime, and arsenic," says Hansen. "The arsenic amounted to a few percent by weight of the total mass of lime." Plasterers mixed the whole mess into their product, he says, but the proportions were held as a trade secret.

It's clear that the tannery's lime cakes were toxic, says Hansen: "Their other big customer was the folks selling rat poison." But he can't say for sure whether today's remodelers risk any harmful exposure: He's not a health expert, and he hasn't tested any old plaster. "That would be the next step," he says.

"This is the first indication I've seen in the literature that this is a potential risk," says Hansen. "It obviously raises a whole lot of questions that I can't answer. I can't say that the presence of hair means that there is arsenic, because I can't support that. But one has to wonder, where did the hair come from? And in this case the obvious answer is the tanneries. My hope is that people will be spurred to caution, and that people will investigate."

Any good industrial lab can measure arsenic levels in plaster for about $50, says Hansen. And given the known risks of silicates and allergens, he points out, dust protection is common sense anyway for workers doing demolition. "My intention is just to get the word out," he says. "Ninety percent of the benefit is simply warning people."


I thought this article fit the debate.

Marcel

[Raymond E. Wand]

Marcel, very good info! As usual! Thank you.

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

I thought this article fit the debate.

Marcel --
Thanks Marcel!!

[Raymond E. Wand]

Mario

Aren't you glad I asked?