Flat Roof Inspection Question - White Color

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

Originally Posted by prussell

Here's the link I posted www.blackbearladder.com click on the fall protection link.
I agree Mario, they are a pain but save lives, not to mention if OSHA happens to be driving by and sees you without it you'll get fined. It happened to me and the fine was $1500.00 but I negotiated it down to $750.00.

I'm not sure if there is a clause in the Reg's. I seem to remember roof inspection being excluded but I think that's more geared to set up for construction.

Agreed Peter!

[Jason Kaylor]

Originally Posted by mkyriacou

That's a very good point Jason!
BTW Have you ever worked with a harness? It's cumbersome to say the least.

Fall protection, and just safety in general is one of our main lines. Get a comfortable one. Most distributors do not carry the higher end ones, so often guys get stuck buying cheap harnesses. Yes they are still cumbersome just because it is an extra layer that you are not use to.

The top two in this list are about as comfortable as it gets for harnesses:

http://www.aikencolon.com/Fall-Prote...ses_c_595.html

Those start around $175, in contrast the normal OSHA compliance harness and lanyard we sell for $72.50, which is what you will see at most places. Its like anything else you get what ya pay for.

Jason Kaylor – JJ
VP of Sales
877/207-1244
AC Tool Supply
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[Jim Seffrin]

Originally Posted by rrunnels

Thanks to all who responded. Jim I did purchase your specs for roof inspection. Very informative and will use sections of it in future specifications/quotes.

It did not however shed light on this particular question so I guess a bit of trial and error is in order.

Now a quick last question:

This roof is LARGE and I think I would like to use some flood lights at night to help in getting around. I don't think this light will make any impact on the thermal images but might help me from falling on things. The light itself should have no impact on the thermal load. So the question is:

Can I use large floodlights at night when taking thermal images on a roof?

Thanks again.

Dear Rob:

Thank you for your purchase of the Infraspection Institute Standard for Infrared Inspection of Insulated Roofs. We are glad you found it useful.

Using flood lights on a roof is possible as long as they do not cause heating of the membrane in the areas to be inspected. In the 25 years that I have been conducting infrared inspections of large roofs, I have never used any type of floodlight. Instead, I have always relied on my thermal imager, available ambient light, and a good flashlight(s) when necessary.

You will note that the Infraspection Standard calls for a minimum of two people to be present on a roof as a safety precaution. Both should familiarize themselves with the roof prior to sunset and always be certain of their footing.

Unfortunately, IR inspections of flat roofs is topic that cannot be fully explored either in print or via a message board. As such, our best recommendation to anyone wishing to add thermal imaging to their services is to seek appropriate training.

Infrared inspection of flat roofs is a topic that is covered in depth in our Level I Certified Infrared Thermographer® training course. The topic is also equally covered in our applications course, IR Inspections for Home & Building Inspectors which is available to NACHI members for $500. Both courses are available as open enrollment classes or via our Distance Learning Program.

I would welcome the opportunity to work with you during an upcoming course where I am certain we can provide you with information to help ensure your success.

I hope this helps and wish you the best with your inspection.

[Jim Seffrin]

Originally Posted by mkyriacou

Jim,

I believe Rob is referring to a Thermoplastic roof membrane. Are you of the opinion that a thermal scan can be performed on this roof membrane? I have never attempted a scan on a roof membrane such as this although I have visually inspected a few roofs with this system. I’m of the opinion that it would be difficult at best if not impossible to do a scan on this roof system.

Dear Mario:

IR inspections can be performed for flat or low slope roofs consisting of either a built up or single-ply membrane installed over, and in continuous contact with, a layer of insulation or an insulating deck. Roof may be either smooth, granule or gravel surfaced. If gravel surfaced, stones should be pea sized or smaller.

Spray applied foam roofs may also be similarly inspected.

For single ply roofs, membrane material may consist of of EPDM, modified bitumen or thermoplastic materials. While thermoplastics have a glossy surface, their emittance is still quite high.

As stated before, membrane color will not affect the inspection; however, any smooth-surfaced membrane, including black asphalt, roof can be quite reflective. This phenomena is especially noticeable during inspections conducted from rooftop level with a handheld imager. It will be even more noticeable if the roof has an aluminum coating and/or one is inspecting on a clear, cold night. Under such conditions, it is possible to miss significant quantities of moisture regardless of how careful the thermographer is.

To help offset the reflectivity of smooth membranes, I use a short wave imager whenever inspecting any smooth-surfaced roof. During the past 25 years, I have inspected millions of square feet of flat roofs and have never had a problem getting good results on TPO, PVC, EPDM, or BUR.

Unfortunately, portable SW imagers are no longer being produced on a large scale. Flir Systems does offer refurbished SW imagers with a warranty. Although SW imagers are more expensive that microbolometers, they can mean the difference between being able to perform an inspection or not.

Infrared Inspections of Smooth Surfaced Roofs is a topic I recently authored for IRINFO.ORG. Should you be interested, it can be found at the following URL:

http://www.irinfo.org/tip_of_week_2008.html#t08192008

Hope this helps.

[Jim Seffrin]

Originally Posted by mkyriacou

Rob,

My advice for what it's worth is:

• Map out the roof the day before the scan and note all obstacles and limitations. This will also afford you the opportunity to do a visual.
• Do not use flood lights (it will play havoc with your eyes)
• Inspect the roof with a partner. He/She should be with you at all times. We sometimes get "tunnel vision" when scanning.
• Have a cell phone with you.
• If you are using a ladder to gain access to the roof make sure you tie the ladder. Can you imagine if the ladder is not there when you finish the job!!
• Notify your local police department of your intentions (citizens will contact the police, trust me on this one)
• Be aware of your surroundings at all times
• Know your limitations and also your camera's limitations.

Good luck and be safe!!

Excellent advice Mario!

[David P. Valley]

Originally Posted by mkyriacou

David,

are those walk pads loose or glued to the membrane?

It has been my experience that moisture will be detected below walk pads if not glued to the roof membrane. Not necessarily a moisture issue, in fact if these pads are removed (if not glued) the moisture/water is visible.

Mario,

They are glued down pads, but this particular area (under this pad) was leaking into the college library right below this pad. It may have been ripped under this pad.

This is what I found (below this pad) inside the acoustical ceiling cavity.

[David P. Valley]

Originally Posted by rrunnels

Can I use large floodlights at night when taking thermal images on a roof?

Night inspections......It will not be pitch dark on the roof.

I can't ever recall needing a flood light on a flat roof inspection. The natural light from the sky will be enough to navigate around the penetrations of the roof. All you'll need is a typical flashlight to get you around.

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

Originally Posted by dvalley

Mario,

They are glued down pads, but this particular area (under this pad) was leaking into the college library right below this pad. It may have been ripped under this pad.

This is what I found (below this pad) inside the acoustical ceiling cavity.
Attachment 27098

Excellent find and a good job David!!

[Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI]

Originally Posted by jseffrin

Dear Mario:

IR inspections can be performed for flat or low slope roofs consisting of either a built up or single-ply membrane installed over, and in continuous contact with, a layer of insulation or an insulating deck. Roof may be either smooth, granule or gravel surfaced. If gravel surfaced, stones should be pea sized or smaller.

Spray applied foam roofs may also be similarly inspected.

For single ply roofs, membrane material may consist of of EPDM, modified bitumen or thermoplastic materials. While thermoplastics have a glossy surface, their emittance is still quite high.

As stated before, membrane color will not affect the inspection; however, any smooth-surfaced membrane, including black asphalt, roof can be quite reflective. This phenomena is especially noticeable during inspections conducted from rooftop level with a handheld imager. It will be even more noticeable if the roof has an aluminum coating and/or one is inspecting on a clear, cold night. Under such conditions, it is possible to miss significant quantities of moisture regardless of how careful the thermographer is.

To help offset the reflectivity of smooth membranes, I use a short wave imager whenever inspecting any smooth-surfaced roof. During the past 25 years, I have inspected millions of square feet of flat roofs and have never had a problem getting good results on TPO, PVC, EPDM, or BUR.

Unfortunately, portable SW imagers are no longer being produced on a large scale. Flir Systems does offer refurbished SW imagers with a warranty. Although SW imagers are more expensive that microbolometers, they can mean the difference between being able to perform an inspection or not.

Infrared Inspections of Smooth Surfaced Roofs is a topic I recently authored for IRINFO.ORG. Should you be interested, it can be found at the following URL:

http://www.irinfo.org/tip_of_week_2008.html#t08192008

Hope this helps.

It does help Jim, Thanks!