RESNET joins forces with InterNACHI.

[Brian A. MacNeish]

Originally Posted by cmckie

As an energy auditor myself, and have been for nearly 20 years. I have been through the training and testing for the INTERnachi course. I would like to see this go forward. There are a lot of energy auditors out there that are either under qualified are over qualified. By being under qualified I mean that they want and have the desire to perform energy audits but just don't have the background and experience to complete the audit correctly.

To myself, with our federal Canadian program, this is the bulk of auditors that have not worked in the energy retrofit field before becoming auditors. I only know of 2 or 3 auditors(out of 20-25) in our province that have on-site working energy retrofit experience (other than their own homes).

Just before Xmas, in a grocery store, I ran into an auditor now turned insulation contractor also. I have had to inspect some of his company's work. We had a short discussion of one particular house that ran into ongoing moisture problems, even after ventilation improvements recommended by a municipal inspector and a roofer were carried out. At the last part of our hurried conversation (my wife was waiting), he asked if I were willing to do some training for his company.

Such is this field....... due to the fluctuating nature of energy prices.....when they go up, the gov jumps in with incentives, people want work done........... when they go down a bunch of partly trained or trained individuals have to look for new jobs!

The over qualified inspector (energy auditor) gets into the energy usage, o.k. but they take it to the next level. They want to test the home for electrical usage and then recommend LED and or CFL's. There is a lot we can do for the consumer but there is a limit as well. Do you want an energy audit or do you want a complete building energy analysis? The inspection companies I have been with on other forums want to do the complete energy analysis. This way they can charge more and offer more. That's o.k. But most consumers in my opinion want a simple energy audit to get the proper recommendations on how to save on energy costs.

If your going to save energy, might as well go all the way. If you have a chance to to be on site at least the once, make the best attempt to go for the home run, not 2nd or 3rd base. Electricity use for lights and appliances, HVAC fans/compressors, lights.etc all cost $$$$!

Bottom line if INTERnachi wants to get with RESNET. What's the problem Brian? Sounds like we are trying to put you out of business. The more training we can get into the field and the more trained energy auditors we can get certified the better. With 100 million homes in need of energy auditing, there is a need for these inspectors to get certified, and get the experience that comes with it. There are pros and con's for everything. But I think this is a move in the right direction.

I'm not in the energy audit business now. I was in on some of the first meetings with the feds on the program in 1998/9. Their representatives were young, bright eyed, degreed engineers with virtually no experience in the field. The program was not set up well....... they did not want single person auditor firms......they wanted to get into the larger franchise companies and green NGO's with an established presence. So now.................... I get to inspect some of the work being done and bring back the not-so-good news to those funding the program.....and get paid well for that when a contract comes along.

Let's get with RESNET on INACHI TV is definitely not where this field should be heading. I have been on these boards long enough to see that there are some very good, knowledgeable inspectors here (I am seeing some of the better HI's leaving and/or criticizing though!) with the vast majority being newbies or others. Don't take this field down any lower.

[Peter C. Russell]

Originally Posted by Brian A. MacNeish

Let's get with RESNET on INACHI TV is definitely not where this field should be heading. I have been on these boards long enough to see that there are some very good, knowledgeable inspectors here (I am seeing some of the better HI's leaving and/or criticizing though!) with the vast majority being newbies or others. Don't take this field down any lower.

Brian, I agree with you for the most part but I would like to remain optimistic about the RESNET venture, not only with INACHI but they are working with ASHI and Home Depot.

My thought is that with rising oil and gas prices more homeowners will be looking for upgrades and if these organizations can get the word out about audits and options all the better.

Remember this is a Memorandum of Understanding only, it's not a signed agreement and may never be. Time will tell.

[Brian A. MacNeish]

Originally Posted by prussell

Brian, I agree with you for the most part but I would like to remain optimistic about the RESNET venture, not only with INACHI but they are working with ASHI and Home Depot.

My thought is that with rising oil and gas prices more homeowners will be looking for upgrades and if these organizations can get the word out about audits and options all the better.

Remember this is a Memorandum of Understanding only, it's not a signed agreement and may never be. Time will tell.

Same applies.......IMO, got to get more auditors in the field with extensive retrofit experience. As with all computerized programs.....Garbage in = garbage out!

For example, I have seen auditor recommendations to rip out/rebuild the upper sloping walls (aka slopes/cathredral ceiling) of a 1+1/2 storey home so the owner can get extra space for R40 insulation + ventilation channels......all the stuff recommended in books or in the program! The ROI on that may be years and years down the road versus just filling the slopes with properly blown cellulose (R22-2 and forgoing the "required" ventilation.......payback- 3-4-5 years at most!!

Remember The Law of Diminishing Returns......works in insulation levels also!

[John E. Mullarkey]

Well said Brian. Knowing textbook recommendations without the ROI and what is involved is totally useless. Usually, windows are the biggest culprit with energy loss, but as you said with the ceiling the time required for ROI is way too long. Most people move every 7 years or so and will NEVER see a return.

[Brad Brinke]

Windows are not the biggest culprit. Air leaks are far more detrimental in a home.

[Peter C. Russell]

Originally Posted by bbrinke

Windows are not the biggest culprit. Air leaks are far more detrimental in a home.

Agreed, you will get a better ROI with air ceiling.


Brian, I remember one job I did for the state where the auditor called to install a cover for the sump pump. So I covered it with PT plywood, nothing in the standards describes what to use but since they only paid $75.00 to do it I figured the cost was about right.

Well the senior auditor said no good. Has to be covered with Lexan. I said WHAT!!!!!! are you for real? A piece of Lexan is twice what your willing to pay to cover the hole, never mind labor!!! His response was " you can't put PT inside someones house " I said, the basement is NOT!!! living space and if you don't think it's OK then why is the first plate on the foundation PT!!!!!

He said he would let it go this time.

Boy the more I think about it ???????????

[Michael Larson]

Agreed, you will get a better ROI with air ceiling.

What is air ceilng?

[Brian A. MacNeish]

[quote=prussell;729654]Agreed, you will get a better ROI with air ceiling.


Brian, I remember one job I did for the state where the auditor called to install a cover for the sump pump. So I covered it with PT plywood, nothing in the standards describes what to use but since they only paid $75.00 to do it I figured the cost was about right.

Well the senior auditor said no good. Has to be covered with Lexan. I said WHAT!!!!!! are you for real? A piece of Lexan is twice what your willing to pay to cover the hole, never mind labor!!! His response was " you can't put PT inside someones house " I said, the basement is NOT!!! living space and if you don't think it's OK then why is the first plate on the foundation PT!!!!!

He said he would let it go this time.

Boy the more I think about it ???????????[/quote]

YEPP!

[ROBERT V. YOUNG]

Why can't they do that now James.
If I had an IR camera I would be charging more and inventing how to sell it uses and open a new methodology of sales and practices for that edevice.
It is a simple as that.
Its sales man-ship and how YOU PERCEIVE YOUR WORTH.
Sell yourself and reinvent, to plain inventing from scratch.

As for that minimum standard OR having to be a builder to be a HI.
That is too blanket a statement to make, also being exclusionary.
Example.
To look at a standard as a minimum or maximum is measuring.
That certification or license you have obtained to provide a service is statement enough that you are qualified.
Its like saying minimum code.
Its code or in violation of.
As to the minimum HI standard, you have passed a test and are certified through , or CERTIFIED TO belong to that association or not.
Calling myself a certified residential building inspector is a description of myself in order to answer any potential costumers questions about my merit. I also explain my building experience and embellish my main selling points with honest and simple fact.
I am inventing a name and hope it can be used to bring the TRADE FORWARD.
You call yourself what you want , home inspector, king of Sheba its OK with me.I am a residential building inspector and Certified.
Knowing where to draw that or cross that legal line is challenged daily in an effort to describe a title, position, describe area of expertize, etc.
So when you start trying to put everything into a title, description, designation, level, accreditation when there is no need at the moment, it only frustrates me.
Your are endlessly trying to put everything into a classification.or level for some needless intellectual recognition, when everything has been satisfactorily defined already.
If its not broken then do not fix it.

[Richard L. Overton]

I am so happy to see this and cannot wait for it to happen. Some of these energy rating organizations have been trying to live in there "Walled garden" and I am thankful for Nachi in helping us to get in. For monthes I have been watching and waiting to see which one of the two dominate energy audit organizations would be the most generally accepted. BPI definatly more technical,but as a home inspector I think it is a bit much. Seems to me that doing things like an air door test is useless unless you are going to make improvements and then verify results. I do not need an air door to tell me that a 1970 era home is going to leak air-it is. I would use one before and after doing air infiltration improvements to verify effectiveness, but not just to give me some number to put on a report.

As for some energy auditors recommending cfl's during an audit- you should- not just for the electricty they save on lighting, but the savings of taking the heat by product of incandescent lamps off your cooling budget.

Very much enjoy these forums and the opinions expressed, Rich

[Steven C. Waskewicz]

BUMP