new construction write ups ?

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new construction write ups ?

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five.five
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Posted: Jun 19, 2005 7:44 AM       Post Subject:

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what do you guys write up on new construction ?
I am inspecting a house that has a few visible eye sore items, but does not effect the operation. for instance:
three car garage, three metal garage doors.
All three have bent garage doors where someone may have used their foot on the inside of the garage door to close the door and bent the bottom of the door:

[ Image: https://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/usrimages/M/MVC-010S.JPG ]

the report reads this does not affect the operation of the door.

Or the new rain gutter installed is dented, same story:
the report reads this does not affect the operation of the rain gutter.
(I'll spare you guys the pic)
The homeowner lives in California, but is having this home built here in Texas, and is expecting to move in a week or two at the most.
He is expecting to move in, and everything be perfect.
The builder got "excited" that I was there, again, but I explained to him the homeowner can't move in with me, and he expects his 3000+ sq. foot house to be perfect when he moves in.
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Marcel Cyr

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Posted: Jun 19, 2005 6:09 PM       Post Subject:
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First of all, there is no such thing as a perfect Home.
Second, the Architect of the Home should have made a punchlist of things that need corrected to be of acceptable value.

If those inspected items were of objectionable value to the new buyer, then he remedial process would be in order, by the Contractor or Builder.

Since this was a new Home, and chances are, that the Builder is long gone, I would suggest it be noted as such and the buyer can negotiate the price of the new home accordingly.


Marcel
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Monte Lunde
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Posted: Jun 19, 2005 6:37 PM       Post Subject:

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I second the above statement

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Monte Lunde CCI, CCPM, CRI
Viking Construction Services Inc.

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Richard Bennett

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Posted: Jun 19, 2005 7:22 PM       Post Subject:
If you purchased a new BMW, Town car etc. it should not have a bent or dented door

RLB
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Emmanuel Scanlan

PS Inspection & Property Services LLC
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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 8:15 AM       Post Subject:
Hello five.five,

The garage doors are a required write-up per TREC SOP. The bending of the door can cause gaps at the bottom allowing rains and other inside.

Quote:
(e) Exterior walls and doors....

(2) Report as in need of repair deficiencies in the condition and operation of exterior doors and garage doors, including door locks and latches when present.


The gutters could be interpreted as requiring reporting. Bent gutters on the inside can allow water to drip down the siding material and on the outside may not catch rain as it cascades off the roof.

Quote:
(h) Roof, roof structure and attic:

(11) Report as in need of repair deficiencies in visible installed gutter and downspout systems.


In either case it does not hurt to be safe especially with new construction! Letting the client know there are defects less than what they are paying for is important when they spend so much money on a new home.

Besides, if you let the client know they may want you to reinspect for them.

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Manny (Emmanuel) Scanlan

Knowledge is power, but sharing knowledge brings peace!

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Larry Ewens

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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 8:21 AM       Post Subject:
To me it is a question of what I would consider acceptable. I it were me buying the house I wouldn't want visible defects staring at me every time I drove up to the house. If the builder was that sloppy I think I would be looking deeper for more serious issues.

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Joseph Kormos

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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 10:23 AM       Post Subject:
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Jeffrey Pope

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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 10:53 AM       Post Subject:
Darren,

Email me and I will send you a copy of a report I did for an out of state client - new construction. The builder wanted them to sign off on the final so that the lender would fund the home. They called me first.

I pick out all blemishes on new construction.

InspectorJeff@sbcglobal.net

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Jeff Pope
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Marcel Cyr

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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 6:27 PM       Post Subject:
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Hi. Jeff;

Respect your views on this, but might add that if every new home in the industry were to be inspected for blemishes, everyone of them would be found unacceptable.

In new Construction, you need to look at the installed Product as a whole and establish a performance standard of quality as a whole. If siding is installed with galvanized nails instead of stainless steel nails, where there will be an adverse affect on the product in the years to come, this is a note to make. A blemish in the siding paint to me is irrelevant. Common aesthetics can be corrected with routine maintenance.
Although, one might feel that he is buying a home free of defects, blemishes will occur on the best of Projects.
I have yet to have seen a perfect Home, and that includes the ones I build, especially if my wife is nearby.
It would be prudent at a new home inspection to care more on code compliance, safety, and product suitability and proper installation to maintain a Home that will endure the test of time, which we are all concerned about, since we pay for these darn things for 30 years or better.

This is just a comment based on what I see here in Maine. I am sure your area, might be different.

Marcel

A mistake, only becomes an error when it can not be corrected.
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Doug Edwards

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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 7:27 PM       Post Subject:
As someone who has inspected a few new construction homes for out of town buyers that is exactly what they were expecting me to do. I put all the blemishes on the report too but reported them as such. I then do not have to explain to them about items they themselves find after they move into the home and find them asking themselves. "What the hell did we pay him for. This isn't on the report" "That guy did a crappy job" A statement from me perhaps saying "it isn't important or major" is probably not going to cut it with someone who has spent several hundreds of thousands of dollars. If we are the inspectors than that is what we should do. I do not arbitrate between the other two parties either. I only inspect. What may not be important to me may be important as hell to the new owners and that is who I work for. That is my perspective. I do not go out of my way to be a flaming jerk and nitpick but bent doors and items that costs hundreds of dollars ought to be right...not perfect....but right.
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Jeffrey Pope

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Posted: Jun 20, 2005 10:57 PM       Post Subject:
mcyr wrote:
Respect your views on this, but might add that if every new home in the industry were to be inspected for blemishes, everyone of them would be found unacceptable.


Quite true, however, I am not referring to smudges on the granite floors.

Excessive "blemishes" are also indications of poor workmanship. Things like mismatched color coat on stucco patching/repairs. Daylight through door jambs of the garage doors and scratched glass on the shower enclosure. . .

Remember, a 3000 sq ft new home in CA will set you back about 950K.

Of course all the typical stuff goes in as well - improper roofing material installation, large cracks in PT slabs, reverse slope in the dishwasher drain line, and the white ungrounded conductor at the condenser breaker icon_biggrin.gif

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Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
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five.five
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Posted: Jun 21, 2005 1:34 PM       Post Subject:

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Mr. Pope,
I will send you an e-mail today.
I had a long talk with the client, I decided to call out the garage doors, the bent rain gutter, etc. etc.
I explained to him, that while some inspectors may not call out some "visable defects" in the appearance of some items, that I would.
I explained to him, over the past few weeks of communication ( I also did a phase inspection for him) I felt that he wanted me to do a type of walkthrough inspection as well.
The client agreed with my statement, and thanked me for being "so critical"
The client is in California, I am in Texas, and he is in the middle of moving, just found out they are expecting their first kid, changing jobs, and on and on.
Between all of that, and needing a licensed, qualified, plumber, electrician, and HVAC called out to their new home to fix the builders work, he wants to know EVERYTHING.
He was happy with the verbal report I gave him over the phone, and Fed-Ex dropped of the written report this morning.

Someone here has the line below their signature " I'll inspect your home as if it were mine" (or something like that - no offence) and I believe I did.

Respectfully,
Darren
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Marcel Cyr

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Posted: Jun 21, 2005 6:28 PM       Post Subject:
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I agree with all you guys and respect your diligence in the inspection of new home.
Unfortunately, here in Maine, houses are not quite up to par or caliber of the California Coastline.
Inspections in Maine on New Constructed Homes would require care in business ethics and conscionable advice, due the fact the towns are so small.
So, somewhat, the circumstances are somewhat different that you would encounter. I would be cautious up here to nit-pick the finishes on the premises, due the fact that another inspector would let it slide or dose not care.

Therefore, comments on workmanship should be noted as fair, good, or bad, or under standard of practice of acceptability. If generalized, it will still communicate your concern and not show the Real Estate people that you are taking the place apart for the potential buyer. Then they will not call you back or refer you to future clients, because you are causing to much grief to them and the seller. This is how it works up here, in Maine.

Real Estate want a report, to make it official, and clean sale. No hang ups. Unfortunately, this is not right in my book, cause I like to note it as I see it. I have found, that how you word it, to respect everyone's interest, and still make your point as to what you inspect will not put you in the Category of nitpicking paid Inspector that has no regarding respect of the Builder.

Being a Builder myself, mostly Commercial and most jobs are negotiated and/or design built, I have found, that towards the end of the job, I proceed to inspect the building accompanied with our Project Manager and literally go around and paste blue painters tape on deficiencies on wall ceilings or trim etc.,. Once this has been corrected, I have the Architect and/or the owner go through his building and supply him with the same blue tape.
Knowing that we went through that extreme to provide an adequate building, you would be surprised, as to how much more at ease the Owner is to nit picking items. Almost all of them have been corrected already.

I would imagine that generalizing work performance and quality of the finished products of a House in general, would not sound as critique and offensive to the seller and/or the new potential buyer would not be so reluctant to buy the property due to minor deficiencies.
This generalization, would also provide the inspection performance and adequate protection, that the Inspector did note minor deficiencies existed, but not prominently pronounced in any particular area.

Everyone is happy, you did your job and they will call you again.


Have a good day.

Marcel
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Trent Fluegel

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Posted: Jun 28, 2005 1:09 PM       Post Subject:
I have often used the National Association of Home Builders residential construction perfpormance guidelines when doing a new construction or end of warranty inspection. It should be available at www.NAHB.org


Trent
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alex medic
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Posted: Sep 16, 2005 3:06 PM       Post Subject:

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I it were me buying the house I wouldn't want visible defects staring at me every time I drove up to the house. If the builder was that sloppy I think I would be looking deeper for more serious issues.

http://www.highspeedsat.com/-satellite-phone-rental/index.htm
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Marcel Cyr

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Posted: Sep 16, 2005 4:16 PM       Post Subject:
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Trent;
Thanks for the information link.

Alex: I agree, that if it is bad enough deficiency, and stares you in the face, yes I would definitely call it out.
My latter post kind of indicated that but was talking of more nit pick stuff that would not stare at you but you had to work in finding it. That is what I meant.

Marcel
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carl brown
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Posted: Dec 22, 2005 7:47 AM       Post Subject:

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http://www.badstucco.com
The blemished surface is not good but whats under it is worse!
http://www.badstucco.com/bricks/bricks.htm

http://www.badstucco.com/Leaks101_files/frame.htm

Or you might see this new kind of flashing method!

http://www.badstucco.com/ff.htm

And don't forget the house wrap/crap!
http://www.badstucco.com/housewrap/HOUSEWRAP.htm

Then you might wonder why I seem mad about it all!
http://www.badstucco.com/howwe.htm


No moisture barrier onder the trim is that why my window and stucco is leaking??
http://www.badstucco.com/repair2.html
Why don't the city inspectors/codes do a better job?
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Marcel Cyr

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Posted: Dec 22, 2005 6:11 PM       Post Subject:
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Hi. Carl;

Code Inforcement Officers are there to do just that, Inforce the minimum requirements for buiding components which include electrical, mechanical, plumbing, framing, foundation, and site setbacks.

Stucco installation is beyound their scope of work and dose not really fall into a code category.

It is therefore, safe to assume that there is a house inspector available to the buyer available at the time of the purchace. That is where NACHI inspectors come in to play.

It is good that you have researched this product and assummably also the installation techniqes that are used. The extended knowlegde in this type of work will enhance your inspecting skills to the public.

Good Luck.

Marcel
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Joseph Kormos

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Posted: Dec 22, 2005 6:19 PM       Post Subject:
Thanks Carl for the post

Joe icon_biggrin.gif icon_biggrin.gif
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carl brown
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Posted: Dec 22, 2005 6:30 PM       Post Subject:

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mcyr wrote:
icon_smile.gif icon_smile.gif

Hi. Carl;

Code Inforcement Officers are there to do just that, Inforce the minimum requirements for buiding components which include electrical, mechanical, plumbing, framing, foundation, and site setbacks.

Stucco installation is beyound their scope of work and dose not really fall into a code category.

It is therefore, safe to assume that there is a house inspector available to the buyer available at the time of the purchace. That is where NACHI inspectors come in to play.

It is good that you have researched this product and assummably also the installation techniqes that are used. The extended knowlegde in this type of work will enhance your inspecting skills to the public.

Good Luck.

Marcel


They are now doing moisture barrier and lath inspections in ovpk ks and so called window&flashing inspections, it is spreading to the other citys in the kc metro!
My knowlegde comes from the trade its self! Going on 27 years and I choose to quit. I am not going to even try to compete with whats going on here. The house wrap guys (tyvek) will not return my calls,The window salesman won't either, most of the codes officials, and when I called them about the brick job the city guy said what do you want me to do drop everything and run everytime you call!!! icon_twisted.gif
The builder said (O no that could cost me a sale) icon_rolleyes.gif

So I am going to try to help both those fellows out! When I caught up with the new homeowner I gave them a set of 8x10s and told them to call me when they went to court I have a little story for them! And i would be a witness!

I think it would make them start to pay a little more attention if guys/gals like yourselves with credentials were posting in the new forum at http://www.badstucco.com
So I invite you all to register and post!

Sincerely
Carl Brown
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