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  #16  
Old 2/13/12, 6:33 PM
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Michael Larson Michael Larson is online now
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfunderburk View Post
How do you do that in a slab home when the range is not on an exterior wall?

There is no reason to call a re-circulating range hood a defect unless it's a broiler ('jenn-air' type range). I simply identify the the type of hood (re-circulating, or exhaust system).
I don't call it a defect.

I am letting the client know that whether the vent exhausts to the exterior or not.

A range does not have to be on an exterior wall to to vent to the exterior.

They can be ducted up and over, through the roof or to the adjacent sidewall.

What I am saying is that most clients hadn't even considered it.



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  #17  
Old 2/13/12, 6:35 PM
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwilson3 View Post
It is not unusual to find co levels of 200PPM at the top of a gas range when the oven is on. I always recommend outside exhaust with a gas range
A properly adjusted gas burner should not be emitting anywhere near that level of CO.



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  #18  
Old 2/13/12, 7:54 PM
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Barry Adair Barry Adair is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlarson View Post
A properly adjusted gas burner should not be emitting anywhere near that level of CO.
certified/passed units are delivered emitting these elevated levels and greater depending on model and what their tests have been approved for

just one of many examples
http://www.scribd.com/doc/47165381/C...ONOXIDE-LEVELS

yes the clients/owners are notified



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  #19  
Old 2/13/12, 8:16 PM
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Michael Larson Michael Larson is online now
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Thanks Barry.

But then that is why the owner's manual states that they are not to be used as a heating source.

I have never measured anything close to that.



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  #20  
Old 2/13/12, 8:29 PM
Christopher Currins, CMI Christopher Currins, CMI is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlarson View Post
Exception: Where installed in accordance with the manufacturer’s installation instructions, and where mechanical or natural ventilation is otherwise provided, listed and labeled ductless range hoods shall not be required to discharge to the outdoors.
Key phrase "or natural ventilation is otherwise provided". Kitchens have operable windows in most, if not all homes/condos I inspect.
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  #21  
Old 2/13/12, 8:45 PM
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Shane Goguen Shane Goguen is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

More important than any code. CLEAN the DAMN filter. I dont know how many times i put out a fire for that simple reason. Somebody has a grease fire, they lift the flaming pan/pot off the stove and boom the rangehood is on fire! Been to quite a bit of those trust me!
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  #22  
Old 2/13/12, 9:30 PM
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Joseph W. Keresztury Joseph W. Keresztury is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Originally Posted by jfunderburk
How do you do that in a slab home when the range is not on an exterior wall?

JF: It's called a downdraft vent that is still vented to the exterior w/ 6" PVC piping roughed in before slab pour.



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  #23  
Old 2/13/12, 10:20 PM
William T. Misegades William T. Misegades is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkeresztury View Post
Originally Posted by jfunderburk
How do you do that in a slab home when the range is not on an exterior wall?

JF: It's called a downdraft vent that is still vented to the exterior w/ 6" PVC piping roughed in before slab pour.

You beat me to it.
Most of my new construction inspections have the cooktop on the island with the downdraft vent to the exterior.



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  #24  
Old 2/13/12, 10:50 PM
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Joseph W. Keresztury Joseph W. Keresztury is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Will, maybe you can help me here, with an opinion that is relating to my issue. You mention on your post about new construction inspections, so I hope you can relate. I used a comment from one of the courses here that stated- (InterNachi qoute) "Remember when evaluating homes with gas ranges or cook tops that gas code requires they be vented to the building exterior through a hard-ducted vent. Re circulating models do not satisfy the code requirement."
I have had a neighborhood (lots of referrals) with a lot of warranty inspections that I have done that the clients weren't happy with their gas cooktop recirculating ventahood (not vented to outside). So I have qouted in the reports- the InterNational Association of Home Inspectors as stating that: "Remember when evaluating homes with gas ranges or cook tops that gas code requires they be vented to the building exterior through a hard-ducted vent. Re circulating models do not satisfy the code requirement." this being to these people that are countingg on me and don't want to here that I'm not a code compliance inspector since I qouted the Nachi claim that actually does qoute gas code. So Will, my question to you is how would you handle this.



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Last edited by jkeresztury; 2/14/12 at 4:51 AM..
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  #25  
Old 2/14/12, 1:03 AM
William T. Misegades William T. Misegades is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Joe, here is the dilemma...You said the "C" word, but did not back it up with an actual code quote (which could or could not be a good thing) and this could be a potential problem as you already know we are not code compliance inspectors...

First of all, why are your clients wanting this to be rectified? Are they having real issues with their kitchens venting properly? Or are they just freaked out because of the "Re circulating models do not satisfy the code requirement" statement?

Here is an option and it won't be great IF the builder installed appliances in accordance with the manufacturers instructions and IF in these cases they do not require the use of a range hood venting to the exterior.

If you know what the appliances are and their model# and serial#, you can do some research to find out how the manufacturer wants its appliances vented (if not, either you call the buyers or go to their places). Also, make sure the exception that allows ductless range hoods aren't violated by the builder.

From there and if all is installed the right way, you do the right thing and tell your clients that although you disagree and think it would be better practice to have the hood vented to the exterior because it improves air quality (by removing combustion products, moisture, grease, and heat etc...) there is an exception (and give them the exception), and the builder did install the appliances according to manufacturer's instructions. So, they need not worry.

or

After having done the research on the appliances and you find out the builder installed them correctly, you can go back to your client and simply say: I did some research on your specific appliances and they indeed do not require having the range hood vented to the exterior because you have mechanical or natural ventilation provided.

Or

You could gamble (and this is NOT what I would do) and quote the articles that Joe F. pasted at the end of his post#3 as well as Ben's in post#6 and see what the builder says. But then it might make matter worse if the builder comes back with the exception rule.

Let us know how it turns out!



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Will Misegades
TREC# 10465
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  #26  
Old 2/14/12, 4:50 AM
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Joseph W. Keresztury Joseph W. Keresztury is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Thanx Will,
I've got another warranty inspection coming up today in the same neighborhood, same builder and will get the range and hood info to review manufacturers requirements, instructions.



Joe Keresztury
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Home Inspections in San Antonio,
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  #27  
Old 2/14/12, 10:55 AM
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkeresztury View Post
Originally Posted by jfunderburk
How do you do that in a slab home when the range is not on an exterior wall?

JF: It's called a downdraft vent that is still vented to the exterior w/ 6" PVC piping roughed in before slab pour.
So you would recommend that in an existing home? I doubt many home inspectors do inspections before the slab is poured.



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  #28  
Old 2/14/12, 1:43 PM
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Joseph W. Keresztury Joseph W. Keresztury is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Joe alot of my inspections are new home construction inspections, so I do alot of slab pre pour inspections. If a client emails me the house plan PDF than I can verify rough ins, in addition to just inspection of slab components off the engineered foundation plan.
If on an existing home a vent is not present for cooktop at island, I will call it out. I'm not going to recommend anything. But it should of had down draft vent to exterior. I would call it out as a deficiency.



Joe Keresztury
JWK Inspections
Home Inspections in San Antonio,
Schertz, Cibolo, New Braunfels, Boerne
and all surrounding South Texas areas
www.jwkhomeinspections.com

Last edited by jkeresztury; 2/14/12 at 1:50 PM..
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  #29  
Old 2/14/12, 10:03 PM
William T. Misegades William T. Misegades is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkeresztury View Post
Thanx Will,
I've got another warranty inspection coming up today in the same neighborhood, same builder and will get the range and hood info to review manufacturers requirements, instructions.
So, how did it turn out?



Where there is a Will there is a Way!

Will Misegades
TREC# 10465
RedFish Home Inspections

www.redfishinspections.com
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  #30  
Old 2/15/12, 1:12 PM
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Joseph W. Keresztury Joseph W. Keresztury is offline
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Default Re: Range Hoods and Exhaust Ducts

At my warranty inspection today (same builder, neighborhood & appliances) as the others w/ this situation I checked the appliance booklets, instructions. Couldn't really find anything claryfing recirculating exhaust vents could be used in lieu of exterior vented.
After that inspection I went by the clients house that has been pushing the issue with builder. From my inspection report the builder had responded to client about issue with the copied page of the IRC (sec.1503) with the exception clause highlighted that the manufacturer specs could allow recirculating vents. But as I discussed with client they or I have not been able to find in manual anything that allows and even addresses recirculating vents in lieu of vented to exterior. So, I told client they should have builder show them where in the manufacturers specs it states anything that makes the exception apply.
Client also had called manufacturer about issue and was told "we'll get back to you". A few days later after follow up call to manufacturer they were told "We are looking into it".
That's were it all stands now.



Joe Keresztury
JWK Inspections
Home Inspections in San Antonio,
Schertz, Cibolo, New Braunfels, Boerne
and all surrounding South Texas areas
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