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Electrical Inspections Contains discussions about electrical systems. This includes receptacles, panels, wiring, etc.

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  #16  
Old 1/12/18, 2:59 PM
Brad Barbour's Avatar
Brad Barbour Brad Barbour is online now
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Default Re: Breaker rating

Quote:
My comment was directed at the association that does not prepare its members with adequate knowledge to do the job. This was just another example of where a CMI or CPI asked a very basic question that should be in the training program. I would expect these questions in the student area, but not from the higher certification levels. It was not a personal attack. As it is now the students can post erroneous defects and they are never corrected, even though the area is supposed to be moderated.
Funny thing is I did know the answer, but it has been buried over the years (has that ever happened to you? or do you remember everything you have been taught?...forever), as I looked at the breaker labeling and did not just assume that the conductor was undersized.
There are many things I'm sure I know and see every day that you don't, do you think that's possible?
The above response is the reason many people don't ask questions on these forums, and search in vain by other means for answers. This thread has well over 100 views but only a couple people responded...what does that tell you?
Was this really the place to lament the lack of training home inspectors have? could you have sent an email to Ben or Nick with suggestions?
I did in the beginning of this thread state there is no A.C., but you chose to ignore that...or did you make a mistake?
As I gain more knowledge (about 1300 inspections so far) I have helped fellow inspectors with questions, sometimes I do see stupid questions, but I feel fortunate to have the answer and I joyfully help, without Lording my knowledge over someone else.



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  #17  
Old 1/12/18, 3:12 PM
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Default Re: Breaker rating

I always thought that if the average electrician was better trained, more professional and conscientious, I wouldn't have to spend so much time and energy documenting all of the deficiencies in their work.

Folks tend to forget to mind their own houses sometimes when they're guests in someone else's



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  #18  
Old 1/12/18, 4:21 PM
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Default Re: Breaker rating

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Originally Posted by bbarbour1 View Post
I looked again, that is what it says (#8-#14), so why is a #14 ok on a 30 amp breaker? can someone help out this home inspector?
A few things, as mentioned that breaker frame is a standard size that can be constructed with different internal trip components for different ampacities however the clamping mechanism holding the conductor(s) is the same whether it's a 15, 20, 25, 30 ampere rating.

IMO you were correct to assume that the #14 conductors on a 30 amp CB were incorrect for a few reasons, for one if this were feeding an AC unit in a house it would almost always be 240 volts which means that it would have a 2-pole or two single pole CB's with handle ties. There are installations where a 30 amp 120 volt circuit can be wired with #14 conductors but for the most part you will almost never see that in an average dwelling.

One last thing, no one should be discouraged from asking questions.
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  #19  
Old 1/12/18, 10:32 PM
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Default Re: Breaker rating

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but for the most part you will almost never see that in an average dwelling
Exactly!




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  #20  
Old 1/13/18, 3:27 PM
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Default Re: Breaker rating

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Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
Yes, the breaker will allow 30 amps to flow, but that may be what is needed to allow a motor or compressor to start. Once running the current draw will drop down to a fraction of the startup current.
Shouldn't breakers be designed for defects in the system? Regardless of code, which does allow for it, if there's worn bearings or other problem with the A/C that allows for a continuous pull of 30 amps for an extended period, don't you want the breaker to protect the wire, not the appliance? Trying to wrap my head around the logic.
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  #21  
Old 1/13/18, 3:56 PM
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Default Re: Breaker rating

There is overload protection built into the motor that would take care of that issue.
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  #22  
Old 1/13/18, 4:10 PM
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Default Re: Breaker rating

Quote:
Originally Posted by snadeau View Post
Shouldn't breakers be designed for defects in the system? Regardless of code, which does allow for it, if there's worn bearings or other problem with the A/C that allows for a continuous pull of 30 amps for an extended period, don't you want the breaker to protect the wire, not the appliance? Trying to wrap my head around the logic.

As Jim stated the overloads protect the conductors from being loaded beyond their ampacity. The OCPD it's only providing short circuit and groud fault protection.
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  #23  
Old 1/14/18, 11:49 AM
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Steve Nadeau Steve Nadeau is online now
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Default Re: Breaker rating

Thanks Jim Port and Robert Meier.
I've been in the building trades for 42 years and did not know that. As inspectors, we're generalists in every trade and we carry around in our head enough general knowledge to make us pretty darn valuable - and a day doesn't go by where I don't try to add to that knowledge and my value.

Let's keep encouraging those questions with the attitude that the only dumb question is the one not asked -
Again, thanks for your explanation.
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