Go Back   InterNACHI Inspection Forum > >

Notices

Electrical Inspections Contains discussions about electrical systems. This includes receptacles, panels, wiring, etc.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #16  
Old 3/10/19, 4:56 PM
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI's Avatar
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI Marcel R. Cyr, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Winslow, ME
Posts: 31,276
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccurrins View Post
That type of Square D breaker allows two conductors. I've installed a few panels like that and have inspected hundreds. Move on.
Chris, so why does the information on the breaker show only one wire?



CMI 2004-2017 Retired

Awards Committee Member
U.S. Member of the Year Winner 2009
45 Years Residential/Commercial Builder
Submit your AWARDS NOMINATIONS here
The InterNACHI Awards Committee is the final authority of issuance of any award the committee offers and any rules updates.
Reply With Quote
Need a home inspection in North Carolina? Check out InterNACHI's listing of North Carolina certified home inspectors. Or, find a home inspector anywhere in the world with our inspection search engine.
  #17  
Old 3/10/19, 5:03 PM
Christopher Currins, CMI Christopher Currins, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Godfrey, IL
Posts: 17,717
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcyr View Post
Chris, so why does the information on the breaker show only one wire?
Maybe identifying it as one pole/terminal, but still allows two conductors.

Is a QO breaker rated to accept 2 conductors under 1 terminal ?

Quote:
Resolution:
Yes, QO breakers (10-30A) are rated to accept 2 conductors under 1 terminal for copper wire size #14-#10.
The breakers are also rated to accept 1 conductor for wire size #14-#8 Cu or Al.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 3/10/19, 5:36 PM
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI's Avatar
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI Marcel R. Cyr, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Winslow, ME
Posts: 31,276
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccurrins View Post
Maybe identifying it as one pole/terminal, but still allows two conductors.

Is a QO breaker rated to accept 2 conductors under 1 terminal ?
If that is the case, there are a lot of HI's out there calling it wrong.
I had always looked at the pressure plate to see if it was made for two wires, never paid too much attention to the labels.

Hope others pay attention to all the posting on this subject.





CMI 2004-2017 Retired

Awards Committee Member
U.S. Member of the Year Winner 2009
45 Years Residential/Commercial Builder
Submit your AWARDS NOMINATIONS here
The InterNACHI Awards Committee is the final authority of issuance of any award the committee offers and any rules updates.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 3/10/19, 6:51 PM
Jim Port Jim Port is online now
Unmoderated Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 2,690
Please Note: Jim Port is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcyr View Post
This is what's on the side.
Attachment 205813

Isn't this showing the same information?
Attachment 205814

That label is indicates that only one aluminium or copper conductor is allowed in a certain size range but two copper are allowed in a different size combination.

The side label will show the size ranges and numbers allowed.

Last edited by Jim Port; 3/10/19 at 6:56 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 3/10/19, 6:53 PM
Robert Meier's Avatar
Robert Meier Robert Meier is online now
Active Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 3,296
Please Note: Robert Meier is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

QO breakers have allowed two conductor for at least four decades. Forget the label in post #1. If you pulled the CB you will see the wiring combinations on the side which clearly indicate two conductors when using the properly sized combinations.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 3/10/19, 8:40 PM
Jim Port Jim Port is online now
Unmoderated Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 2,690
Please Note: Jim Port is a non-member guest and is in no way affiliated with InterNACHI or its members.
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Meier View Post
QO breakers have allowed two conductor for at least four decades. Forget the label in post #1. If you pulled the CB you will see the wiring combinations on the side which clearly indicate two conductors when using the properly sized combinations.
Makes me wonder why these get called out as a defect. This is not a recent change that the training has not caught up with.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 3/10/19, 10:12 PM
Andrew Cox, HI 2899 Andrew Cox, HI 2899 is offline
Certified Professional Inspector (CPI) ®
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kissimmee, FL
Posts: 1,177
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccurrins View Post
That type of Square D breaker allows two conductors. I've installed a few panels like that and have inspected hundreds. Move on.
I too have inspected hundreds - but have never seen, or maybe not noticed this label. I was told long ago, in some workshop or seminar - that as a rule, Square D breakers are good for 2 conductors, but not all - to look at the label. Just for my frame of mind, I'm going to call the manufacturer tomorrow.



Andy Cox
Kissimmee, FL
You’re Your Own Job Security.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 3/11/19, 6:45 AM
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI's Avatar
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI Marcel R. Cyr, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Winslow, ME
Posts: 31,276
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Good call Andrew, and thanks for starting this thread I might learn something too. Never too old to learn. LOL



CMI 2004-2017 Retired

Awards Committee Member
U.S. Member of the Year Winner 2009
45 Years Residential/Commercial Builder
Submit your AWARDS NOMINATIONS here
The InterNACHI Awards Committee is the final authority of issuance of any award the committee offers and any rules updates.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 3/11/19, 8:16 AM
Joshua L. Frederick Joshua L. Frederick is online now
Certified Professional Inspector (CPI) ®
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Defiance, OH
Posts: 4,952
Send a message via AIM to jfrederick
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

I simply am amazed at the amount of time and emphasis that gets put on double taps, by so many inspectors, for something that is so trivial, and quite frankly, stupid, in the grand scheme of things.




http://aspecresidential.com

Defiance home inspector
Northwest Ohio home inspector
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 3/11/19, 8:21 AM
Roy Lewis, CMI's Avatar
Roy Lewis, CMI Roy Lewis, CMI is online now
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: North Florida
Posts: 13,649
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfrederick View Post
I simply am amazed at the amount of time and emphasis that gets put on double taps, by so many inspectors, for something that is so trivial, and quite frankly, stupid, in the grand scheme of things.
Yes! And you just proved it.




InterNACHI Lifetime Member.
www.1stproinspection.com
roy@1stproinspection.com
Serving Gainesville Florida and surrounding areas.
Florida Certified Contractor #CRC1328001
Florida Certified Home Inspector #HI7019
Deus solus me iudicare potest
#1st Pro Inspection
Well! They may have degrees, but that is not an indicator of common sense or right thinking...M. Larson circa 9-27-2018.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 3/11/19, 9:54 AM
Andrew Cox, HI 2899 Andrew Cox, HI 2899 is offline
Certified Professional Inspector (CPI) ®
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kissimmee, FL
Posts: 1,177
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

According to the manufacturer - that label does not mean anything. QO breakers will always accept 2 conductors (depending on size of the conductor). The only place on the breaker is on the side, embossed to show this...
So, I was taught wrong... I can't remember ever seeing this in the past, but I'll know now! Thanks everyone!



Andy Cox
Kissimmee, FL
You’re Your Own Job Security.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 3/11/19, 10:03 AM
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI's Avatar
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI Marcel R. Cyr, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Winslow, ME
Posts: 31,276
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by acox View Post
According to the manufacturer - that label does not mean anything. QO breakers will always accept 2 conductors (depending on size of the conductor). The only place on the breaker is on the side, embossed to show this...
So, I was taught wrong... I can't remember ever seeing this in the past, but I'll know now! Thanks everyone!
Thanks for looking into it Andrew. I believe there are quite a few HI's that have been calling it wrong or taught wrong.



CMI 2004-2017 Retired

Awards Committee Member
U.S. Member of the Year Winner 2009
45 Years Residential/Commercial Builder
Submit your AWARDS NOMINATIONS here
The InterNACHI Awards Committee is the final authority of issuance of any award the committee offers and any rules updates.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 3/11/19, 10:53 AM
Manny Marinos, CMI's Avatar
Manny Marinos, CMI Manny Marinos, CMI is offline
Certified Professional Inspector (CPI)
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: St. James NY
Posts: 516
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by acox View Post
According to the manufacturer - that label does not mean anything. QO breakers will always accept 2 conductors (depending on size of the conductor). The only place on the breaker is on the side, embossed to show this...
So, I was taught wrong... I can't remember ever seeing this in the past, but I'll know now! Thanks everyone!

Great info thanks. I will have to remember this!




Homeguard Home Inspection
Serving all of Nassau and Suffolk County
Long Island NY
631-606-0095
Long Island Home Inspections
Suffolk County Home Inspections
Nassau County Home Inspections
Reply With Quote
Need a home inspection in North Carolina? Check out InterNACHI's listing of North Carolina certified home inspectors. Or, find a home inspector anywhere in the world with our inspection search engine.
  #29  
Old 3/11/19, 3:24 PM
Larry Kage, CMI's Avatar
Larry Kage, CMI Larry Kage, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NW, MI
Posts: 18,645
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

Quote:
Originally Posted by acox View Post
According to the manufacturer - that label does not mean anything. QO breakers will always accept 2 conductors (depending on size of the conductor). The only place on the breaker is on the side, embossed to show this...
So, I was taught wrong... I can't remember ever seeing this in the past, but I'll know now! Thanks everyone!
Good to know, Andrew...

Thanks!




Awards Committee Officer
SUBMIT YOUR AWARD NOMINATIONS HERE:
http://co.nachi.org/inachiawards/

The InterNACHI Awards Committee is the final authority of the issuance of any award the committee offers and any rules interpretation updates.
____________________________________________

Larry Kage, CMI Lifetime Member
State Licensed Builder since 1973
InterNACHI Lifetime Member
~retired~

The above post represents my personal opinion.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 3/11/19, 4:01 PM
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI's Avatar
Marcel R. Cyr, CMI Marcel R. Cyr, CMI is offline
Certified Master Inspector ®
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Winslow, ME
Posts: 31,276
Default Re: Double-tapped Square D

I found posts that relate and explain the same thing as on this thread that dates back to 2007.
I guess some of us must have missed reading them. LOL



CMI 2004-2017 Retired

Awards Committee Member
U.S. Member of the Year Winner 2009
45 Years Residential/Commercial Builder
Submit your AWARDS NOMINATIONS here
The InterNACHI Awards Committee is the final authority of issuance of any award the committee offers and any rules updates.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
breaker, double-tapped, type, label, conductors

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:04 AM.
no new posts