Sun Nuclear 1027 - Not NRSB Approved

Hey Guys,

Just wanted to drop a line and let you know that if anyone is looking to get a Sun Nuclear 1027 Con. Use Monitor....the NRSB has stated they are not approved....well their chamber is not approved and because of this they will not recognize any of the Sun Nuclear 1027 results or products until which time they comply...( ie: Pay the fee and send in the paperwork )

Just in case anyone was jumping into the Radon Market and looking for a Con. Use Monitor…

Paul:

Do you have a link to substantiate your assertion?

I have forwarded your post along to Sun Nuclear Corporation for their comment and view…

The Sun Nuclear Monitor is an accurate piece of equipment. For Calibrations, our office has used Bowser Morner http://www.bowser-morner.com/calispiking.html and Gemmill Labs http://gemmilllabs.com/

These are PA State approved for Licensing requirements.

Joseph,

Are you saying my conversation with Michelle at NRSB is incorrect…no I dont have anything to back it up…I am not bashing Sun Nuclear…I got one of their units…

I am MORE posting it because I dont like NRSB’s stance…I know I spoke with them today…you can TRUST me or NOT TRUST me…I have not given anyone reason to NOT ever trust my posts…I spend ALOT of time giving FREE education…anyway I digress.

Has nothing to do with Sun Nuclear…I said NOTHING bad about their equipment…you BETTER make that clear with Sun Nuclears " Laura" before you go saying i am saying anything BAD about them…NOT THE CASE…

I am warning members who may jump into radon testing and think they are going to get into a cont. use monitor…the NRSB “MICHELLE” has stated directly to me…they do not accept the Sun Nuclear 1027 at this time because their calibration and chamber test do not comply…

Not sure WHERE that is bashing anything…it is a FACT…

They as a manufacturer were grandfathered in I guess for years…BUT the NRSB is starting to crack down on this for some reason…petty if you ask me…but it is FACT…

Don’t be telling Sun Nuclear I am bashing their unit or them…I plan on speaking with them on wednesday and I better not hear that…I never did such a thing…just giving FIRST hand reports of what the NRSB told me today and in regards to my conversation with Sun Nuclear…they have the paperwork their…just they need to execute it…

I dont want anyone thinking they can join NRSB right now and submit a 1027 Sun Nuclear Unit and have it approved…because it wont happen…who is my source…CALL NRSB directly and ask them…

1 Like

It is clear by your post heading that it was not your intention to single out Sun Nuclear Corporation…

BTW…the NRSB did say the unit could be sent to a lab and tested and they would then approve it…but my post is for newbies getting into it.

You can’t use the calibration sheet that comes with the 1027 is all, even if one is provided which they do.

Not sure HOW this went to bashing Sun Nuclear…you on their payroll?

Anyway…was only trying to save a member from having issues…if they tried to get into the market and submitted the 1027 and its calibration sheet…the NRSB rejected one I sent in today because of it.

They did say I could get it tested in an approved lab and they would use it…but VERY inconvient for a newbie to have to deal with that on the first go-around is why…

look…if I wanted to bash I would have said it is a piece of CRAP…dont buy it because it does not work…and so on…NOT what I posted…

I was only posting first hand knowledge…hell if EVERY post I make is IMPLIED something…sh*t I might has well give up now…lol

http://www.epa.gov/radon/pubs/devprot1.html

“Indoor Radon and Radon Decay Product Measurement Device Protocols”

2.1.11 Quality Assurance****2.1.11.3 Duplicate Measurements. When two or more CR monitors of the same type (e.g., scintillation cell, ionization chamber, or silicon detector types) are available, the precision of the measurements can be estimated by operating the monitors side-by-side. The analysis of duplicate results should follow the methodology described by Goldin (section 5.3 of Goldin 1984), by Taylor (Taylor 1987), or by the EPA (U.S. EPA 1984). Whatever procedures are used must be documented prior to beginning measurements. Consistent failure in duplicate agreement may indicate a problem in the measurement process and should be investigated.

---------------------------

How do you fulfill quality insurance (standard 2.1.11.3 Duplicate Measurements) if you only have One Monitor?

How do you conduct your side by side duplicate tests?

Joseph,

The Sun Nuclear is new to me…I have used Charcoal in the past…we are not doing radon inspection right now, too busy with electrical work and lack of wanting it done in our area…we were adding this unit and wanted to get it sent in…when it was rejected.

“When two or more CR monitors of the same type (e.g., scintillation cell, ionization chamber, or silicon detector types) are available”

"2.4.11.3 Duplicate (Collocated) Detectors. Anyone providing measurement services with AC devices should place duplicate detectors in enough houses to test the precision of the measurement. The number of duplicate detectors deployed should be approximately 10 percent of the number of detectors deployed each month or 50, whichever is smaller. The duplicate detectors should be shipped, stored, exposed, and analyzed under the same conditions, and not identified as duplicates to the processing laboratory. The locations selected to receive duplicates should be distributed systematically throughout the entire population of samples. Groups selling measurement services to homeowners can do this by providing two detectors instead of one to a random selection of purchasers, with instructions to place them side-by-side. Consideration should be given to providing some means to ensure that the duplicate detectors are not separated during the measurement period. Data from duplicate detectors should be evaluated using the procedures described by Goldin (Section 5.3 of Goldin 1984), by Taylor (Taylor 1987), or by the EPA (U.S. EPA 1984). Whatever procedures are used must be documented prior to beginning measurements. Consistent failure in duplicate agreement may indicate a problem in the measurement process and should be investigated. "

This is why I posted it…I am not going to get into a pissing contest with you Joseph…I was only stating FACT…call them yourself…I am sure Sun Nuclear and NRSB will tell you the same information.

We wanted a Sun Nuclear to play with and actually intended to buy a few more…but not until they file the paperwork or the NRSB lightens up a bit…

No biggie…I really though it would SAVE a member from making a purchase and being surprised…I am sure the Sun Nuclear units are great…that is WHY our firm bought one…just surprised it can’t be used in it’s present state is all.

http://www.vdh.virginia.gov/rad/RHP-RADON.asp

Are you currently listed as Certified to be proficient in screening or testing for Radon with the Virginia Indoor Radon Program?

Joseph,

You know what…MY personal family issues of WHY me and my brother are not speaking or testing for Radon right now is PRIVATE and PERSONAL…actually NONE of your business actually.

AS for VA…you don’t have to be Certified with VA…they only care you are in either of the TWO main associations and thats it…nothing more…nothing less.

My post was to MAKE SURE a new member does not buy a unit ( namely the Sun Nuclear 1027 ) and try to submit it for approval into the NRSB…they wont accept it UNLESS they get it and have it calibrated with someone else other than the forms that Sun Nuclear sends…FROM the MOUTH of NRSB directly…feel free to call them on it…

I will find it QUITE funny if they change their tune…

Anyway…I intend to send BACK my latest Sun Nuclear Unit…not because it is a bad unit…I like the new models look…but tooooo much hassle if you ask me…and only wanted to save other members from experiencing the same problems.

BTW…this IS a forum to help others…IF ANYONE does not agree simply call NRSB and ASK them directly…tell them you would like to use THIS monitor and submit it for acceptance using the calibration form submitted with the 1027 model…and you will see…not possible at this time.

Again no bashing to Sun Nuclear…great company…good people…just the FACTS…

I’m in KC. One of the new HI guys here called me today and said the same thing Paul did. He just bought a Sun Nuclear and NRSB told him that unless he sent it somewhere like Bowser-Morner (not sure of spelling) in Ohio to get it calibrated they wouldn’t accept it for his NRSB Certification, etc …

THANK YOU DAN…I got tired of being called a LIAR without actually posting it in so many terms…

I orginally posted it to SAVE a guy like your new HI…from the hassle…you dont spend $ 600.00 on a unit to then have to send it away AGAIN for 100-200 dollars…this does not happen with AC or EL units and so on…when you BUY a unit that is LISTED on the NRSB list…you expect it to come calibrated and with an approved certificate the NRSB will accept…

I was ONLY posting this to save other guys potential issues…BUT NO…I get questions like…Are you Certified Paul?..and made the feel like I was calling Sun Nuclear a bad product…never said a thing…

Man I will NEVER learn my lesson…stay in the Electrical Forum where my comfort level is…

Paul:

I have multiple CRM’s as well as Rad Elec E-Perm Equipment.

Generally, to obtain a State License or NRSB Certification, proficiency must be initially demonstrated with an independant and recognized Lab such as Bowser Morner.

It has been that way for many years. Nothing has changed. You have revealed nothing new.

This applies to all types and manufacturers of radon related equipment. It is not specific to Sun Nuclear as you suggest.

I dont suggest anything…this is what the NRSB told me…and based on my conversation with Sun Nuclear they knew they had to do the paperwork.

Not sure WHY i am going into this with you…it is very obvious you have taken offense to a perfectly GOOD post…that is FACTUAL.

I think you need to call NRSB and ask them…and also call Sun Nuclear and ask to speak with Laura…Ext 230 for more details.

Either way…My unit we were looking at and observing is going in the mail tomorrow…for a credit.

FYI-

This is what the NRSB posts on their site :

Approved Measurement Devices
To assure consumers and the public that radon measurement devices are accurate and reliable, the National Radon Safety Board has created a panel for device evaluation and approval. This panel will establish procedures and protocols for the performance of proficiency tests by NRSB accredited chambers. The criteria used by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency for radon proficiency – the Draft Instrument Evaluation Program – will be used as the basis for these criteria, and recommendations will be made to the USEPA regarding proposed changes. Devices which have met USEPA requirements will be accepted without further evaluation or testing.

Ok…when we purchased our Sun Nuclear unit I was told the calibration and chamber testing certficate would be included and it was, they are a manufacturer and do the testing of the units and the NRSB simply said they have not been approved as far as their chamber is concerned to issue the certifications for approval by their organization…THAT is all I was saying…

Are you bold enough to say that no matter WHAT device you use…they all BEFORE you use them have to be sent to an lab for this testing…hmmmm…not what RadElec has stated…and it is not what was stated to me before my firm bought one of the 1027 units…so rather than go through the hassle I got FIRST HAND from the NRSB today…it was GOOD information to post to other members…so they dont have to do through it…

AND was confirmed by Dans post previously…I am not the only one that has experienced this…

I asked ALL these questions before we purchased the unit and it was said no problem…but problems happened…

Also on the Sun Nuclear Site it clearly states the Sun Nuclear 1027 is approved for real estate transactions by the EPA…in fact here is what it quotes :
The technology employed in the Model 1027 has been used commercially since 1986, when it was first introduced as the Model 1022, At Ease Professional Radon Tester. The Sun Nuclear Corporation, Model 1027 Professional Continuous Radon Monitor is classified as a Continuous Radon Monitor (CRM) testing device, and has been evaluated and accepted by the US EPA](http://javascript<b></b>:ShowZoneMap()) for use in real estate transaction testing.

So…I agree…they ARE fine units and are approved by the EPA…but when I spoke with SN today they said usually they were accepted by NRSB and they figured it was a grandfather thing or something…but said for some reason in the past 2 weeks they have cracked down and not accepted their units…because they have a chamber and do calibrations and offer the certificate as I was TOLD…so again…nothing was SAID about the units…looks like an AWESOME unit…just they should not have said their certificate would work if the NRSB will not allow it…thats all

What is the NRSB?

Hi Wayne!