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  #1381  
Old 8/14/18, 8:25 AM
Michael Bazzo, CMI's Avatar
Michael Bazzo, CMI Michael Bazzo, CMI is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Taking care of the estate can take awhile....All the best to you and yours.



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  #1382  
Old 8/14/18, 4:48 PM
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Larry Kage, CMI Larry Kage, CMI is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Quote:
Originally Posted by mbazzo View Post
Taking care of the estate can take awhile....All the best to you and yours.
You're a good man, Mike. Thanks for the best regards.

I hope you get a break now and then,
Larry




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  #1383  
Old 8/15/18, 10:28 AM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Larry, sorry to read about your wife's folks.
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  #1384  
Old 8/15/18, 10:36 AM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Apparently most can't get it to 'register' or don't want to understand, sad crap.


"Chronic water penetration through foundation wall led to extensive deterioration and crumbling of at least one course of block..."
Report: Deadly Hamilton House Collapse Caused By Long-Term Water Damage << CBS Philly
One point is lol, installing interior drainage systems and sump pumps do NOT stop water penetration through foundation walls!! And if one doesn't stop water from where it's entering then one won't stop/prevent mold either.


Like this example, multiple exterior cracks in block foundation wall and BOTTOM course deteriorating, wall is bowed in, water PENETRATES through these cracks!
YouTube


MOLD behind drywall 'n paneling, homeowners gets water in on floor
YouTube
One point is, some home inspectors would tell homeowner to lol, raise and slope the grade and NOT remove any drywall.... how is that helping a buyer, seller? Geeeeeeeeeeez C'mon


:30... BOTTOM course of block foundation walls DETERIORATED
YouTube
Ya see the lousy wall anchors?
See the interior drainage system?
Cost over $20,000 !
Use your brain a little bit please lol, on the EXTERIOR of these walls there are exterior cracks AND the wall is bowed in... see previous video---horizontal crack down low.


So, installing wall anchors and an interior drainage system and sump pump does NOT stop further water penetration THROUGH the exterior cracks in these walls!
You have to go outside to waterproof the exterior cracks and if you backfill with all-most gravel you will reduce the lateral soil pressure acting upon the wall, yeah lateral aka sideways expansive clay soil pressure and when there are underground roots along/against the wall you'll be able to remove those as well, NO interior system does that!


If one were to slap on some carbon fiber straps on the inside then those also do NOT relieve/remove/reduce any exterior lateral pressure against the wall, your getting lied to people, yes you are!


When someone gets water on their basement floor, one should not be telling anyone to raise and slope the grade or add 100' long downspout extensions....or to install an interior system, it's negligent, incompetent crap. Identify--determine the actual problem, then proceed with correct solution AFTER one correctly and honestly IDENTIFIES the homeowners problem!
Grosse Pointe Michigan, this lady had couple interior basement system Bozo heads over who of course tried talking her into an interior system and sump pump which would have cost MUCH MUCH more than what we did, which was what she and the foundation wall needed in order to stop mold etc inside
YouTube
If a home inspector tells anyone like this lady to raise and slope the grade, add long downspout ext's or call an interior system company and the mold gets worse, YOU are partly to blame, oh yes you are. If your not capable of identifying the actual problem(s) or, don't want to (understand that) then leave it alone, don't open your pie hole and keep your inspection fee

Last edited by john bubber; 8/15/18 at 11:00 AM..
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  #1385  
Old 8/15/18, 1:04 PM
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Larry Kage, CMI Larry Kage, CMI is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Quote:
Originally Posted by john bubber View Post
Larry, sorry to read about your wife's folks.
Thanks, Mark. We appreciate your condolences.




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  #1386  
Old 8/15/18, 3:59 PM
Mike Wilson Mike Wilson is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Mr Bubber/Anderson,

I thought I would pop in here and express my gratitude for the advice and expertise you provide on this forum. I experienced a water infiltration issue in the basement of a recently purchased house, and mainly your advice to determine where and why water is entering from the exterior was what allowed me to avoid paying unnecessary charges for services I was offered, such as interior systems, footer tile inspections and cleaning, and whole house exterior waterproofing to the tune of 20-30k. Not one person suggested that they would figure out why water was entering, only that they would perform a service and it would hopefully fix the problem. So I didn't pull the trigger. In the end, none of them would have actually fixed the problem entirely. After observing the problem for about a year, since it happened so infrequently, and cutting through no less than 2 subfloors to gain access to previously unknown/inaccessible crawlspaces, I determined that leaking downspout drain line joints were pouring gallons upon gallons of water into these crawlspaces and eventually filling them to the point that they leaked either into other crawlspaces or into the basement. Only one basement wall had water infiltrating directly from the exterior clay/soil.

So I set about to waterproof the wall that leaked due to below grade cracks, and replace/rerun the downspout lines of the house and bypass the leaky old clay lines, which inexplicably run through crawlspaces, the garage floor, etc, making them nearly impossible to properly repair. Specifically your advice in posts 503 and 981, and the pictures in your albums were extremely helpful in preparing for all of the important pieces that have to be lined up for a job like this. Most everything that you described in your posts turned out to be accurate. I encountered random construction debris everywhere in the trench. Random concrete work from the previous waterproofing job, which unfortunately removal was not an option for me. Footer tiles appeared to be in good working order. Typical vertical cracks not visible from the interior.

One thing I'd like to know in retrospect: how the heck did you line someone up to just bring in heavy machinery and scoop away the clay on the street, and keep it affordable? Especially the smaller loads. At least that's how it appears you dispose if it in your albums. Best/most affordable I could come up with was a guy that would haul it away in a trailer I loaded myself. Being that I excavated about 10 yards, it was tedious, and one of the most expensive parts of the job (gravel was tops). Permits were also nearly $250, but that included registering as a general contractor.

Speaking of tedious, much respect for doing what you do on a daily basis. I set aside a 4 day weekend for a 30-ish foot long wall and some shorter crawlspace walls. I felt like a walking/limping corpse at the end, and for days afterward, and that was with the assistance of a friend for 2 afternoons.

So anyways, thanks, keep up the posts, as they are helping others avoid wasting money and allowing further damage to their foundation walls.

Here's a link with some pictures/videos with captions of the problems and my attempt at the 'bubber' method. Hopefully it works. Let me know what you think.

water - Google Photos

Thanks

Mike
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  #1387  
Old 8/16/18, 4:33 PM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Mr. Mike,


Thanks for the kind words, makes Uncle Bubb's feel temporarily content that my mouth/posts reached someone and helped.


You had patience, many others unfortunately do not.


Wow Mike, 2 sub floors? Pain in the a......!


Yes sir, the work will kick butt, glad you made it through lol, being 59 and still digging, i wake up in pain and just try to shrug it off and as you know lol BEER can be helpful.


KUDOS to your friend, very cool of him to help! Need more like that, a true friend with actions rather than words.


Your photos and captions are great.


Yeah trying to find a good, honest contractor to pick up the soil and be 'on time' fairly often isn't easy but we have a good one in a father/son team, T. Fiore. Cost is approx. $400 per load, small load now costs the same. Am thankful to have them pick up for us.


Sucks that you had to load the soil rather than have it scooped up, not easy especially after having dug the shtt out, you busted your azz and saved yourself $$$$, love hearing this! BEER and Mama's rundown can work wonders.


Let me eyeball your photos a bit longer, prolly have a Q or two if you don't mind but phone is ringing so i'll look later tonight n get back with any Q's


Thanks again for the kind words, it does help this old man get through many days of having to deal with sooo many scamming, negligent, fraudulent morons in this business who confuse and lie to many homeowners, some days i just feel like i'm at the end of my rope but then i remember posts like yours.
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  #1388  
Old 8/17/18, 4:26 AM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Mike,


had more time to look at your photos, do i have it right... there was a sprinkler system/piping that went through the basement wall or crawl wall and were you getting any water in that-area?


where someone previously applied some tar, did they backfill with soil/dirt or did they backfill with some gravel? And I'm guessing no visqueen on-over tar, right?


looks like you had multiple exterior cracks in wall, did the sprinkler line/pipe go through the wall at--near the corner where you applied more hydraulic cement or was it near the center of the basement wall, just below grade where one can see what appears to be a circular application of hyd-cement?


and the space between the old and new crawls where you got water in, help lol, that water was accumulating because of the old piece of crap downspout ext underground? Or were there some exterior openings, just wondering. (previous waterproofers busted a hole in basement wall)
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  #1389  
Old 8/17/18, 10:34 AM
Mike Wilson Mike Wilson is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Hi Mark,

Yes, you've got the location of the sprinkler piping penetration correct, where the circular application of hydraulic cement is at the top-center of the wall. I believe it and the two hairline cracks that form a 'v' under those two glass block windows were causing multiple slow trickles of water on the inside base of the wall. Hard to know now that's it's all dug up and sealed. As you know, the cracks became obvious as the wall was scraped and brushed, as they remained very dark and damp while the rest of the wall dried.

The previous tar job on the old crawlspace wall was just that, tar. No visqueen. And they backfilled with the same clay they dug out. And there was also a decent amount of concrete they poured around the base of the wall that I simply did not have the time or tools to break out to expose the original footer. Regardless, the water issues were occuring inside the footprint of the new additon (I'll try to elaborate below). Only around the existing pvc downspout line that ran along/through the newer addition crawlspace was there any gravel, and I'm sure it was just to meet code.

The video of the water gushing in, that's where it gets confusing and really took me a while to figure out what was happening. The house originally had a back porch where the new addition now sits. They left the foundation of that porch and built around it. You can still see the footprint of that porch footing when you are in the new crawlspace. And like the crawlspace in the front of the house, a clay downspout line ran parallel to the back of the house and underneath the porch. The builders of the new addition decided to take their new downspout on that side of the house and bring it through their new foundation and tie it into the existing clay line running under the old porch. I can only guess that there is at least one more significant break in the line right at or near that junction, other than the one I photographed and attempted to patch, which had created an easy path for water to fall down to the base of the older crawlspace where I took the video. That corner of that older crawlspace is within the rectangular footprint of the new addition. I drew another map and added it to the album, maybe that will help. Light blue is the new addition crawlspace. Gray is the old porch footing. Brown is crawlspace floor. Purple is the path of the existing downspout line(s). I'm the stick figure taking a video of the horror from the basement through the hole that was created by the waterproofers to tar the inside of that crawlspace.

Shared album - Mike Wilson - Google Photos

Mike
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  #1390  
Old 8/17/18, 1:53 PM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

so because there is x-amount of concrete on the exterior of where they busted a hole through wall, you couldn't get-to-it, correct? But you did seal the inside and obviously laid new pipe outside and waterproofed everything you could... and no problems since?
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  #1391  
Old 8/17/18, 2:11 PM
Mike Wilson Mike Wilson is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

Correct, I left a stub of the old pvc sticking out of the concrete where it penetrated, then covered/filled it with hydraulic cement, then tar and visqueen. And then routed the new line around it and along the side of the house. Have not had issues since, though we've only had one serious downpour in that time. However, that back crawlspace where the water was pouring in was continuously damp and spongy when it wasn't being actively flooded. It's now dryer than it's ever been since we moved in and continues to dry out. The bamboo is withering. Keeping my fingers crossed.
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  #1392  
Old 8/17/18, 3:48 PM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

What state are you in Mike?


Job well done man, you busted your azz and saved a lot of green.
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  #1393  
Old 8/17/18, 4:52 PM
Mike Wilson Mike Wilson is offline
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Default Re: something else to chew on

East side of Cleveland. I notice a lot of similarities between the houses here and those in your albums from Detroit. Thanks again.
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  #1394  
Old 8/18/18, 4:22 AM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

yes sir Mike, best of luck to you 'n your family.
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  #1395  
Old 8/18/18, 4:27 AM
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Default Re: something else to chew on

"A buckled foundation wall is what caused the roofs to collapse.... no structural problems were found in any of the inspected properties though most showed evidence of WATER INFILTRATION"
Buckled Foundation Causes Rowhome Roofs to Collapse - NBC 10 Philadelphia
Hmmm, so ya don't want to STOP water penetration into/through foundation walls and instead, install a moronic, inept interior basement drainage system huh? Okie dokie.


Inspections? By whom? Do they REALLY know what to look for? Say again, just because one may not see much if any evidence of a structural problem or cracks or water penetration inside does NOT ever mean there are not any problems in--with the stupid foundation wall on the OUTSIDE (see the youtube videos that have been posted)
Here's one, hmmm, look at the HORIZONTAL crack down low, wall is bowed in, water is---has been PENETRATING the foundation wall.
YouTube
Water has been penetrating the foundation wall.
The water and the clay soil and some underground roots caused the problems, weakened the wall.
And yet the interior drainage system companies will be called for estimates and incompetently tell homeowners they DON'T need exterior waterproofing and only need an interior water-diverting system and let's say, maybe some carbon fiber straps or wall anchors.
Well I got some NEWS for ya, installing an interior system and carbon fiber straps etc on the inside will not, does NOT.... STOP water penetration through those exterior cracks and weakened joints and does not relieve-reduce any soil pressure or roots OFF the dang wall.


This video shows another moron installed another moronic incompetent interior drainage system and sump pump, then the wall bowed in.. What was ALWAYS needed was exterior waterproofing, NOT an interior system! The interior systems don't STOP water penetration through the wall! They don't remove-relieve-reduce any exterior lateral soil pressure or possible underground roots etc
YouTube
Hey, quite a few of these interior companies/contractors cover these walls with bright wall paneling etc so YOU may not SEE cracks widening, you prolly won't see that a wall has bowed in since the Bozo-brains installed the interior drainage system, sheesh. You won't see possible mold behind the crap they put on the foundation wall

Last edited by john bubber; 8/18/18 at 4:46 AM..
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