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  #1  
Old 11/19/06, 12:11 PM
Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI's Avatar
Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI is offline
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Default Backwater valve in new homes?

Hi everyone, talked to this fellow and Just got this e-mail and wanted to
find out for sure what is what with the backwater valve.
Subject: Backwater Valve in new homes


> Hi Chuck,

> We just chatted on the phone and I already want to thank you for taking
> the time and answering my questions.
> My question is if Ontario has a requirement in the building code making it
> mandetory for new homes to have a backwater valve and if a properly
> installed backwater valve is something that we can check or verify the
> presence of.
> As I said over the phone it looks as though this is code in Manitoba and
> this web site shows that home owners in Manitoba ( at least in Winnipeg)
> are able to inspect and clean out their backwater valve.
>
> http://winnipeg.ca/waterandwaste/sewage/basementFlooding.stm
>
> Of course I do understand as well that winnipeg is a flood plain area and
> they would have strickter requirements on this type of thing.
>
> Thanks again,
>



Chuck Crooker I.M.M., Canadian Home Inspectorhttp://www.crookerhancox.com "Not just an inspection, an Education!!!"
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  #2  
Old 11/19/06, 2:33 PM
Rob A. Parker Rob A. Parker is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Chuck to answer your question 7.1.7.2 ontario code Accessibility (1) every fixture ,plumbing appliance ,intercepter,cleanout,valve,device or piece of equipment shall be so located that it is readily accessible for use,cleaning and maintenance.This is from the 1997 code book
Rob
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  #3  
Old 11/19/06, 2:42 PM
Darrell B. Hadler's Avatar
Darrell B. Hadler Darrell B. Hadler is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

about all you can check is to see if its installed in the right direction of the flow. It should have and arrow on it indicating the direction. I'm assuming your talking about the drainage system here, and there is usually a compartment covered with wood or metal plate in the concrete floor close to the main clean-out. In our area, they place a sticker on the electrical panel to let the home owner know if one has been installed in the home.

If your talking about a back flow preventer in the water supply system, these too can also be installed backwards...just check for the directional arrow for correct installation.



Darrell Hadler CMI
Five Star Home Inspections
Medicine Hat, AB. Canada
NACHI# 04111082 Cell phone# (403)502-3593
Inspected once . . . inspected right!

Last edited by dhadler; 11/19/06 at 2:46 PM..
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Old 11/19/06, 2:54 PM
Wolfram Jung Wolfram Jung is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Chuck,
although I think it's a really good idea if one bulds a new home to install one, to the best of my knowledge there is no building code requirement in Ontario for new homes to have a drainage back flow prevention valve. However, if someone knows the relavant code section I could be proven wrong. Have not look at code in quit some time.
Wolf
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  #5  
Old 11/19/06, 5:05 PM
Vern Mitchinson, CCHI CMI's Avatar
Vern Mitchinson, CCHI CMI Vern Mitchinson, CCHI CMI is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

This device was invented by a chap in St Albert, Alberta and is required on all new homes in St Albert. It is recommended by the City of Edmonton. It can only be installed with the flow in the correct direction, If it is installed backwards it will stop the flow. It is designed to allow the sewer to vent and water to flow through. The valve is activated when water flows back. It shuts off. Hence the name "back flow preventer". All other valves are called check valves at lease that's what I call them just to keep it straight in my mind. Thus I know what I'm talking about.
I would be interested in knowing what other municipalities require them.
I think they should be added to all the building code

Last edited by vmitchinson; 11/20/06 at 3:29 AM..
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  #6  
Old 11/20/06, 2:27 AM
Terry Mels Terry Mels is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

i don't think that it is code but most comercial buildings in peterborough area the insurance companys are making it manditory that they install backflow preventors. No backflow preventor no insurance. That could be starting to flow toward residential as well.
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  #7  
Old 11/20/06, 12:01 PM
Larry Ewens, C.M.R.I.C.'s Avatar
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

The code seems to be a bit ambiguous on the subject.
7.4.6.4. says
1 A backwater valve or a gate valve shall not be installed in a building drain or in a building sewer.
2 Except as provided in sentences 3 4 and 5 where a building drain or a branch may be subjected to backflow a gate valve or a backwater valve shall be installed on every fixture drain connected to them where the fixture is located below the level of the adjoining street.

I think that sentence 5 is the pertenent one here.
A subsoil drainage pipe that drains into a sanitary drainage system that is subject to surcharge shall be connected in such a manner that sewage cannot back up into the subsoil drainage pipe.
On one hand it says no and then gives 3 or 4 reasons to have them installed.
Larry
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  #8  
Old 11/21/06, 7:22 AM
Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI's Avatar
Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lewens
The code seems to be a bit ambiguous on the subject.
7.4.6.4. says
1 A backwater valve or a gate valve shall not be installed in a building drain or in a building sewer.
2 Except as provided in sentences 3 4 and 5 where a building drain or a branch may be subjected to backflow a gate valve or a backwater valve shall be installed on every fixture drain connected to them where the fixture is located below the level of the adjoining street.

I think that sentence 5 is the pertenent one here.
A subsoil drainage pipe that drains into a sanitary drainage system that is subject to surcharge shall be connected in such a manner that sewage cannot back up into the subsoil drainage pipe.
On one hand it says no and then gives 3 or 4 reasons to have them installed.
Larry

What Larry said plus; Appendix "A" A-7.4.6.4.[1] and A-7.4.6.4.[5]

The appendix clarifies this further.





'Imagination is more important than knowledge' (sometimes)
Mario Kyriacou CHI CMI-
NACHI Canadian Member of the Year 2007

http://www.360degreesbuildinginspections.com


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  #9  
Old 11/21/06, 11:01 AM
Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI's Avatar
Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkyriacou
What Larry said plus; Appendix "A" A-7.4.6.4.[1] and A-7.4.6.4.[5]

The appendix clarifies this further.
Only clarifies for the ones that have the book?



Chuck Crooker I.M.M., Canadian Home Inspectorhttp://www.crookerhancox.com "Not just an inspection, an Education!!!"
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  #10  
Old 11/21/06, 12:55 PM
Larry Ewens, C.M.R.I.C.'s Avatar
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Appendix
A-7.4.6.4.(5)
Protection From Backflow Caused By Surcharge
These requirements are intended to apply when in the opinion of the local authority having jurisdiction there is a danger of backup from a public sewer.

So I guess it is up to the local authority as to when and if a backwater valve is required.
Larry
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  #11  
Old 11/21/06, 12:56 PM
Larry Ewens, C.M.R.I.C.'s Avatar
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Chuck
If you ever need the "book" call me and I will loan you mine.
Larry
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  #12  
Old 11/21/06, 4:57 PM
Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI's Avatar
Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrooker
Only clarifies for the ones that have the book?
Charles

E-mail me your address and I will put one in the mail for you.[ Part 7 Plumbing Code book]





'Imagination is more important than knowledge' (sometimes)
Mario Kyriacou CHI CMI-
NACHI Canadian Member of the Year 2007

http://www.360degreesbuildinginspections.com


Tel.# 647-716-6132
e-mail torontohomeinspector@yahoo.com
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  #13  
Old 11/22/06, 10:45 PM
dsmith1 dsmith1 is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

You may want to advise your clients to check with their individual municipalities. The city where I live passed a bylaw that states all homeowners must install a backwater valve at their expense if they do not have one. They also stated that as of a certain date they would no longer compensate any one who did not have a backwater valve and who was flooded because of a city sewer.
http://ville.saint-lazare.qc.ca/docu...694_notice.pdf
I think it's a good idea to recommend one even if not required by law.
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  #14  
Old 11/27/06, 1:54 PM
Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI's Avatar
Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI Charles R. N. Crooker, CMI is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkyriacou
Charles

E-mail me your address and I will put one in the mail for you.[ Part 7 Plumbing Code book]
Thanx Mario, I owe you one.



Chuck Crooker I.M.M., Canadian Home Inspectorhttp://www.crookerhancox.com "Not just an inspection, an Education!!!"
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  #15  
Old 11/27/06, 11:28 PM
Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI's Avatar
Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI Mario A. Kyriacou, CHI is offline
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Default Re: Backwater valve in new homes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrooker
Thanx Mario, I owe you one.
Charles

Your welcome.

I hope you received it today, Canada Post said that it would be delivered today!
</IMG></IMG>





'Imagination is more important than knowledge' (sometimes)
Mario Kyriacou CHI CMI-
NACHI Canadian Member of the Year 2007

http://www.360degreesbuildinginspections.com


Tel.# 647-716-6132
e-mail torontohomeinspector@yahoo.com
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