Commercial Electrical Inspections

The inspector should be aware of the hazards associated with electricity and the requirements for PPE.

Here’s some information to be considered.

For those who are planning on using a SME Consultant, and where others will remove equipment covers, or open electrical cabinets during inspections while energized, you may find it useful to attend one of the seminars offered that covers electrical safety in the workplace.

Joe,

This is the reason I pay a licensed industrial electrician to perform any wild inspections on any commercial switch gear equipment when needed, if you’re not qualified to do it yourself, for gods sake don’t…!!!

Good point Joe!

Have a great Christmas and New Year…!!!

Here’s were I was coming from:

"E2018-01

**8.4.7 **Electrical:

**8.4.7.1 **Observations—Identify the electrical service provided
and observe the electrical distribution system including
distribution panels, transformers, meters, emergency generators,
general lighting systems, and other such equipment or
systems. Observe general electrical items, such as distribution
panels, type of wiring, energy management systems, emergency
power, lighting protection, etc. Identify any observed or
reported special or unusual electrical equipment, systems, or
devices at the subject property.

**8.4.7.2 **Out of Scope Issues[FONT=Arial][size=3]—Removing of electrical panel
and device covers, except if removed by building staff, EMF
issues, electrical testing, or operating of any electrical devices,
or opining on process related equipment or tenant owned
equipment."
[/size][/FONT]

Yep, I understand that Joe.

Thank you Dale, and here’s to a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

OK, talking commercial only here based upon the ASTM material.

Question: What voltages will we find in a commercial apartment, store, mall, restaurant, or office building, etc?

I understood a previous comment indicating that voltages greater than 240 volts would not be encountered by the commercial inspector?

This may be true for small commercial occupancies. but the following will be found in many of the types of commercial occupancies that will be inspected by a commercial inspector.

They include electrical and separately derived systems, services, branch circuit and feeders that will be operating at nominal system voltages of 120, 120/240, 208Y/120, 240, 347,** 480Y/277**, and 480.

Each Y service is 3 phase, 4 wire and if the commercial inspector is making the inspection and notes the conditions associated with the electrical inspection, there will be equipment that will operate at these voltages, why even the wall switches in some of the hotel meeting rooms will be supplying 277 volt fixtures, for example.

I also wanted to ask if the word home in an inspector’s title is confusing to some since the last red box I received from this person someone recently stated:

“[FONT=Arial Narrow][size=3]Keep your posts home inspector related.”[/size][/FONT]

Your welcome Joe…!

Somebody is slightly confused…:shock:

Indeed they will be present.

Exactly, I see these services every week.

Yep…correct-amondo…:smiley:

There is no reason to even touch any switch gear, distribution panels of course, since I am not performing work on any equipment I stay the heck away from it.

I’m certainly not qualified to perform any type of electrical work, besides wiring my own room additions etc, with Paul Abernathy on the phone…:D…:shock: :shock: :shock:

This is as close as I get besides documenting the amperage and voltage clearly written on the tags…!!..:lol:

Amazing just about every inspection I do, there is crap piled against the equipment always.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i247/badstucco1/Commercial122007031.jpg

Joe I have spent a large % of my career working in the industrial field with voltage ranging from 440 600 & 1240 volt AC equipment and any time you get above 240 volt with the average HI you are disturbing their comfort zone.

To many working in this field of inspecting have not grasped the concept of expanding their overall base knowledge level whether it be electrical, mechanical or structural and just strike out at anyone wanting to go above and beyond the status quo. I for one appreciate any type of information you desire to post keep up the good work.

Charley B.

Thanks guys, here’s what we find in the downtown area of Boston:

Accessibility, working space, etc., is often not acceptable.

Do you also verify that the equipment directories are accurate?

These systems are identified in the ATSM code.

How far into them will the commercial inspector go?

For example, will the information technology rooms be inspected, especially under the raised floors, and will they special requirement for disconnecting the equipment be check?

  • Distribution panels
  • Transformers
  • Meters
  • Emergency generators
  • General lighting systems
  • Type of wiring
  • Energy management systems
  • Emergency power
  • Lighting protection, etc.
    *]Identify any observed or reported special or unusual electrical equipment, systems, or devices at the subject property

Hi Joe,

I will have my licensed industrial electrician go as far as my client wants to pay me for.

Every customer has different requirements and expectations regarding what they want inspected, and to what degree.

So the ASTM standards mean nothing more than a baseline for an inspection, the client is the one who decides what they want done.

I have never met a commercial building investor/buyer that did not know exactly what they wanted inspected, and to what degree, their very intelligent people who do their homework before they buy anything.

Due Diligence is the most important factor before any purchase, and I charge according to what degree they would like to take the inspection level.

Thank you Dale, let’s say I am the owner of a property in downtown anywhere in the USA, and I give you the full responsibility to INSPECT each and every part of my buildings electrical system, not lookng for the observation type, but the actual inspection of all electrical systems starting from the roof down to the basements, if any.

I want to discuss these items, and with some input by others, hope to create some understanding of the inspection process instead, of the observation process.

PS: Did they mean: Lightning Protection instead of “lighting protection”

Hi Joe,

My company just does inspections, no destructive testing, no load cal’s, etc, zero, zilch, none, just visual inspections.

My electrician has to many inspections too do with me, but I can recommend a licensed electrical engineer to any client who does work by the hour, we do all our inspections by the job.

I have never had a client want to pay for an electrical engineer unless they plan on doing extensive renovations, then I just give the client his name and move on.

Kind of like Phase 1 environmental engineers, I recommend the company who does them for me if needed, but anything out of the scope of what the client wants to pay me for, I have them contact other people who can also help them with things I don’t do.

Joe,

You and I both know that to inspect (not merely examine) EVERY electrical component in an commercial or industrial setting could take weeks. That doesnt include mapping out all components.

You are reading to far into the ASTM standard. Remember, the standard includes much, but ultimately it is up to the client and inspector to determine what is examined. It is refered to as “risk tolerance level” on the clients part, and is directly tied to his/her pocketbook.

Dale is correct in his assertion that the depth of investigation is tied to the talent needed to perform the task, and the $$ required to perform to that level.

ASTM also clearly states that, sometimes, the time it takes to investigate and the $$ invested, aint worth it.

Joe please continue to post anything related to INSPECTIONS, some of us apreciate it. Merry*** Christmas :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: ***

Thank you and a Merry Christmas to you too!

Here’s the first page:

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The rest can be found here:

Electrical Inspection Checklists

I will be available if anyone needs any further information or clarification on any item, please let me know.

Happy New Year!

More here too:](http://joetedesco.org/cgi-bin/photoalbum/view_album/62044)

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Pictures show a very interesting panel to work on. The soffit built so you can open the panel door is just big enough so you can open the door.

As you can see in the photos the top screws are loose, can you blame the last electrician for leaving them loose?

You also can just barely read in the photo the working clearance label pasted to the cover of this panel stating the 36" clear working space rule.

List of all of the sections in the 2002 NEC that cover the requirements for removal of abandoned wiring.

372.13 Discontinued Outlets.
When an outlet is abandoned, discontinued, or removed, the sections of circuit conductors supplying the outlet shall be removed from the raceway. No splices or re insulated conductors, such as would be the case of abandoned outlets on loop wiring, shall be allowed in raceways.

374.7 Discontinued Outlets.
When an outlet is abandoned, discontinued, or removed, the sections of circuit conductors supplying the outlet shall be removed from the raceway. No splices or re insulated conductors, such as would be the case with abandoned outlets on loop wiring, shall be allowed in raceways.

390.7 Discontinued Outlets.
When an outlet is abandoned, discontinued, or removed, the sections of circuit conductors supplying the outlet shall be removed from the raceway. No splices or re insulated conductors, such as would be the case with abandoned outlets on loop wiring, shall be allowed in raceways.

640.2 Definitions.
For purposes of this article, the following definitions apply.
Abandoned Audio Distribution Cable. Installed audio distribution cable that is not terminated at equipment and not identified for future use with a tag.

640.3 Locations and Other Articles.
Circuits and equipment shall comply with 640.3(A) through (L), as applicable.
(A) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. The accessible portion of abandoned audio distribution cables shall not be permitted to remain. See 300.21.

645.5(D)(6) Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain unless contained in metal raceways.

725.2 Definitions.
For purposes of this article, the following definitions apply.
Abandoned Class 2, Class 3, and PLTC Cable. Installed Class 2, Class 3, and PLTC cable that is not terminated at equipment and not identified for future use with a tag.

725.3 Locations and Other Articles.
Circuits and equipment shall comply with the articles or sections listed in 725.3(A) through (E). Only those sections of Article 300 referenced in this article shall apply to Class 1, Class 2, and Class 3 circuits.
(A) Number and Size of Conductors in Raceway. Section 300.17.
(B) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. Section 300.21. The accessible portion of abandoned Class 2, Class 3, and PLTC cables shall not be permitted to remain.
© Ducts, Plenums, and Other Air-Handling Spaces. Section 300.22 for Class 1, Class 2, and Class 3 circuits installed in ducts, plenums, or other space used for environmental air. Type CL2P or CL3P cables shall be permitted for Class 2 and Class 3 circuits.

725.61 Applications of Listed Class 2, Class 3, and PLTC Cables.
Class 2, Class 3, and PLTC cables shall comply with any of the requirements described in 725.61(A) through (F).
(A) Plenum. Cables installed in ducts, plenums, and other spaces used for environmental air shall be Type CL2P or CL3P. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Listed wires and cables installed in compliance with 300.22 shall be permitted.
(B) Riser. Cables installed in risers shall be as described in any of (1), (2), or (3):
(1) Cables installed in vertical runs and penetrating more than one floor, or cables installed in vertical runs in a shaft, shall be Type CL2R or CL3R. Floor penetrations requiring Type CL2R or CL3R shall contain only cables suitable for riser or plenum use. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain.
(2) Other cables as covered in Table 725.61 and other listed wiring methods as covered in Chapter 3 shall be installed in metal raceways or located in a fireproof shaft having fire stops at each floor.
(3) Type CL2, CL3, CL2X, and CL3X cables shall be permitted in one- and two-family dwellings.
FPN: See 300.21 for fire stop requirements for floor penetrations.

725.61(E) Other Wiring Within Buildings. Cables installed in building locations other than those covered in 725.61(A) through (D) shall be as described in any of (1) through (6). Abandoned cables in hollow spaces shall not be permitted to remain.

760.2 Definitions.
For purposes of this article, the following definitions apply.
Abandoned Fire Alarm Cable. Installed fire alarm cable that is not terminated at equipment other than a connector and not identified for future use with a tag.

760.3 Locations and Other Articles.
Circuits and equipment shall comply with 760.3(A) through (F). Only those sections of Article 300 referenced in this article shall apply to fire alarm systems.
(A) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. Section 300.21. The accessible portion of abandoned fire alarm cables shall not be permitted to remain.

760.61 Applications of Listed PLFA Cables.
PLFA cables shall comply with the requirements described in either 760.61(A), (B), or © or where cable substitutions are made as shown in 760.61(D).
(A) Plenum. Cables installed in ducts, plenums, and other spaces used for environmental air shall be Type FPLP. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Types FPLP, FPLR, and FPL cables installed in compliance with 300.22 shall be permitted.
(B) Riser. Cables installed in risers shall be as described in either (1), (2), or (3):
(1) Cables installed in vertical runs and penetrating more than one floor, or cables installed in vertical runs in a shaft, shall be Type FPLR. Floor penetrations requiring Type FPLR shall contain only cables suitable for riser or plenum use. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain.
(2) Other cables shall be installed in metal raceways or located in a fireproof shaft having fire stops at each floor.
(3) Type FPL cable shall be permitted in one- and two-family dwellings.
FPN: See 300.21 for fire stop requirements for floor penetrations.

770.2 Definitions.
Abandoned Optical Fiber Cable. Installed optical fiber cable that is not terminated at equipment other than a connector and not identified for future use with a tag.

770.3 Locations and Other Articles.
Circuits and equipment shall comply with 770.3(A) and (B). Only those sections of Article 300 referenced in this article shall apply to optical fiber cables and raceways.
(A) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. The requirements of 300.21 for electrical installations shall also apply to installations of optical fiber cables and raceways. The accessible portion of abandoned optical fiber cables shall not be permitted to remain.

770.53 Applications of Listed Optical Fiber Cables and Raceways.
Nonconductive and conductive optical fiber cables shall comply with any of the requirements given in 770.53(A) through (E) or where cable substitutions are made as shown in 770.53(F).
(A) Plenum. Cables installed in ducts, plenums, and other spaces used for environmental air shall be Type OFNP or OFCP. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Types OFNR, OFCR, OFNG, OFN, OFCG, and OFC cables installed in compliance with 300.22 shall be permitted. Listed plenum optical fiber raceways shall be permitted to be installed in ducts and plenums as described in 300.22(B) and in other spaces used for environmental air as described in 300.22©. Only types OFNP and OFCP cables shall be permitted to be installed in these raceways.
(B) Riser. Cables installed in risers shall be as described in any of the following:
(1) Cables installed in vertical runs and penetrating more than one floor, or cables installed in vertical runs in a shaft, shall be Type OFNR or OFCR. Floor penetrations requiring Type OFNR or OFCR shall contain only cables suitable for riser or plenum use. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Listed riser optical fiber raceways shall be permitted to be installed in vertical riser runs in a shaft from floor to floor. Only Types OFNP, OFCP, OFNR and OFCR cables shall be permitted to be installed in these raceways.
(2) Types OFNG, OFN, OFCG, and OFC cables shall be permitted to be encased in a metal raceway or located in a fireproof shaft having fire stops at each floor.
(3) Types OFNG, OFN, OFCG, and OFC cables shall be permitted in one- and two-family dwellings.
FPN: See 300.21 for fire stop requirements for floor penetrations.

800.2 Definitions.
See Article 100. For purposes of this article, the following additional definitions apply.
Abandoned Communications Cable. Installed communications cable that is not terminated at both ends at a connector or other equipment and not identified for future use with a tag.

800.52(B) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. Installations in hollow spaces, vertical shafts, and ventilation or air-handling ducts shall be made so that the possible spread of fire or products of combustion is not substantially increased. Openings around penetrations through fire resistance-rated walls, partitions, floors, or ceilings shall be fire stopped using approved methods to maintain the fire resistance rating.
The accessible portion of abandoned communications cables shall not be permitted to remain.
FPN: Directories of electrical construction materials published by qualified testing laboratories contain many listing installation restrictions necessary to maintain the fire-resistive rating of assemblies where penetrations or openings are made.

800.53 Applications of Listed Communications Wires and Cables and Communications Raceways.
Communications wires and cables shall comply with the requirements of 800.53(A) through (F) or where cable substitutions are made in accordance with 800.53(G).
(A) Plenum. Cables installed in ducts, plenums, and other spaces used for environmental air shall be Type CMP. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Types CMP, CMR, CMG, CM, and CMX and communications wire installed in compliance with 300.22 shall be permitted. Listed plenum communications raceways shall be permitted to be installed in ducts and plenums as described in 300.22(B) and in other spaces used for environmental air as described in 300.22©. Only Type CMP cable shall be permitted to be installed in these raceways.
(B) Riser. Cables installed in risers shall comply with 800.53(B)(1), (B)(2), or (B)(3).
(1) Cables in Vertical Runs. Cables installed in vertical runs and penetrating more than one floor, or cables installed in vertical runs in a shaft, shall be Type CMR. Floor penetrations requiring Type CMR shall contain only cables suitable for riser or plenum use. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Listed riser communications raceways shall be permitted to be installed in vertical riser runs in a shaft from floor to floor. Only Type CMR and CMP cables shall be permitted to be installed in these raceways.
(2) Metal Raceways or Fireproof Shafts. Listed communications cables shall be encased in a metal raceway or located in a fireproof shaft having fire stops at each floor.
(3) One- and Two-Family Dwellings. Type CM and CMX cable shall be permitted in one- and two-family dwellings.
FPN: See 800.52(B) for fire stop requirements for floor penetrations.

820.2 Definitions.
See Article 100. For the purposes of this article, the following additional definitions apply.
Abandoned Coaxial Cable. Installed coaxial cable that is not terminated at equipment other than a coaxial connector and not identified for future use with a tag.

820.2 Definitions.
See Article 100. For the purposes of this article, the following additional definitions apply.
Abandoned Coaxial Cable. Installed coaxial cable that is not terminated at equipment other than a coaxial connector and not identified for future use with a tag.

820.3 Locations and Other Articles.
Circuits and equipment shall comply with 820.3(A) through (G).
(A) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. Section 300.21 shall apply. The accessible portion of Abandoned coaxial cables shall not be permitted to remain.

820.53 Applications of Listed CATV Cables.
CATV cables shall comply with the requirements of 820.53(A) through (D) or where cable substitutions are made as shown in Table 820.53.
(A) Plenum. Cables installed in ducts, plenums, and other spaces used for environmental air shall be Type CATVP. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Types CATVP, CATVR, CATV, and CATVX cables installed in compliance with 300.22 shall be permitted.
(B) Riser. Cables installed in risers shall comply with any of the requirements of 820.53(B)(1) through (B)(3).
(1) Cables in Vertical Runs. Cables installed in vertical runs and penetrating more than one floor, or cables installed in vertical runs in a shaft, shall be Type CATVR. Floor penetrations requiring Type CATVR shall contain only cables suitable for riser or plenum use. Abandoned Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain.
(2) Metal Raceways or Fireproof Shafts. Types CATV and CATVX cables shall be permitted to be encased in a metal raceway or located in a fireproof shaft having fire stops at each floor.
(3) One- and Two-Family Dwellings. Types CATV and CATVX cables shall be permitted in one- and two-family dwellings.
FPN: See 820.53(A) for the fire stop requirements for floor penetrations.
© Cable Trays. Cables installed in cable trays shall be Types CATVP, CATVR, and CATV.
(D) Other Wiring Within Buildings. Cables installed in building locations other than the locations covered in 820.53(A) and (B) shall be with any of the requirements in 820.53(D)(1) through (5). Abandoned cables in hollow spaces shall not be permitted to remain.
(1) General. Type CATV shall be permitted.
(2) In Raceways. Type CATVX shall be permitted to be installed in a raceway.
(3) Non concealed Spaces. Type CATVX shall be permitted to be installed in non concealed spaces where the exposed length of cable does not exceed 3 m (10 ft).

830.2 Definitions.
See Article 100. For purposes of this article, the following additional definitions apply.
Abandoned Network-Powered Broadband Communications Cable. Installed network-powered broadband communications cable that is not terminated at equipment other than a connector and not identified for future use with a tag.

830.3 Locations and Other Articles.
Circuits and equipment shall comply with 830.3(A) through (D).
(A) Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion. Section 300.21 shall apply. The accessible portion of abandoned network-powered broadband communications cables shall not be permitted to remain.

830.55 Low-Power Network-Powered Broadband Communications System Wiring Methods.
Low-power network-powered broadband communications systems shall comply with any of the requirements of 830.55(A) through (D).
(A) In Buildings. Low-power network-powered broadband communications systems shall be installed within buildings using listed Type BLX or Type BLP network-powered broadband communications low power cables.
(B) Ducts, Plenums, and Other Air-Handling Spaces. Cables installed in ducts, plenums, and other spaces used for environmental air shall be Type BLP. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain. Type BLX cable installed in compliance with 300.22 shall be permitted.
© Riser. Cables installed in risers shall comply with any of the requirements in 830.55©(1), ©(2), or ©(3).
(1) Cables in Vertical Runs. Cables installed in vertical runs and penetrating more than one floor, or cables installed in vertical runs in a shaft, shall be Type BLP or BMR. Floor penetrations requiring Type BMR shall contain only cables suitable for riser or plenum use. Abandoned cables shall not be permitted to remain.