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  #1  
Old 5/7/13, 8:39 AM
Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI is online now
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Default Rule change

https://www.flrules.org/gateway/ruleNo.asp?id=61-30.812

Notice of Change/Withdrawal

DEPARTMENT OF BUSINESS AND PROFESSIONAL REGULATION
RULE NOS.: RULE TITLES:
61-30.402 Continuing Education Requirements for Biennial Renewal
61-30.812 Standards of Practice, General Limitations and Exclusions
NOTICE OF WITHDRAWAL
Notice is hereby given that the above rule, as noticed in Vol. 39, No. 7, January 10, 2013 issue of the Florida Administrative Register has been withdrawn.
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  #2  
Old 5/7/13, 9:13 AM
Michael J. Meeker, CMI's Avatar
Michael J. Meeker, CMI Michael J. Meeker, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

What does that mean? Are they starting over yet again?



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  #3  
Old 5/7/13, 9:19 AM
Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmeeker View Post
What does that mean? Are they starting over yet again?
Why would it concern you?
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  #4  
Old 5/7/13, 9:23 AM
Michael J. Meeker, CMI's Avatar
Michael J. Meeker, CMI Michael J. Meeker, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Because I am an Evil Gun Totting Mole for the Evil Contractors

Just curious, trust me I will not get involved and will play by what ever dumb a s s stuff they decide to tell you all you must or must not do.



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  #5  
Old 5/7/13, 1:22 PM
Wayne Collier, HI5099's Avatar
Wayne Collier, HI5099 Wayne Collier, HI5099 is offline
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Default Re: Rule change

Thanks Eric, Russ and Steve
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  #6  
Old 5/7/13, 1:58 PM
Richard Haynes Richard Haynes is offline
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Default Re: Rule change

Some background and information about the proposed rules. I attended the rules hearing on March 21, 2013. I have not listened to the recording. I was surprised by the lack of attendance or lack of comments during the hearing from Home Inspectors. There may have been additional parties listening in on the hearing who did not provide comment.

This is the history on the rules document, as I know it.

Draft rules were posted on DBPR’s website on the Home Inspector page. Comments and recommendations were invited to be made to Mr. Morrison. This area of the website is now “temporarily unavailable” and has been removed for some time.

On January 10, 2013 the proposed rules were first published. These contained changes that were submitted. I submitted recommended changes that were accepted. My recommendation was concerned with limiting what the rules can do. The rules may only be about what is supposed to be done in accordance with the FL Statutes. You may consult FL Statute #120 to clarify.

If anyone had issues with the proposed rules as first published, they could request a hearing. I was told that several parties had requested a hearing.

In February I posted about misinformation regarding continuing education requirements being put out and the link at https://flrules.org/, where the rules information could be found. The proposed rules document of 1/10/13 had changes to continuing education requirements. I requested Mr. Morrison to put something on the website to clarify this confusion. My concern was that people would not pay/attend continuing education seminars or classes that they might not need since this part of the rules was not firmly established. There is still nothing posted on the website in regards to this issue.

The Notice about the hearing of March 21, 2013 was posted on March 6, 2013.

The documents that included the proposed rules to be discussed at the March 21, 2013 hearing were not posted but I received these from Mr. Morrison. These are the missing documents and I have attached them for clarification.

The hearing was held on March 21, 2013.

The next documents were posted on April 26, 2013. These documents incorporated the changes that were made after the hearing.

On May 7, 2013, Rules 61-30.402 Continuing Education and 61-30.812 SOP General Limitations and Exclusions were withdrawn.

After a period of time DBPR will rewrite the rules and they will be posted again. If anyone has concerns at that time with the revised rules they will have the opportunity to request a hearing concerning the revised rules.

Also, if someone out there is curious as to who submitted what in regards to any of the rules, they only need to ask. DBPR must provide this publicly available information, it may cost a small amount.

HomeInspectorsRulesHEARINGAgenda.doc

NoticeofChangeWithSERCs.doc

NoticeofHomeInspectorRuleHearing.doc
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  #7  
Old 5/7/13, 2:06 PM
Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Shortly after the amended rules were posted on the 26th, several inquiries were made and the end result was the following from may 2, 2013:

Quote:
The Department intends to withdraw Rule 61-30.812, F.A.C. As you know, JAPC and the Department have received numerous public comments after the final public hearing and after the publication of the Notice of Change. Pursuant to Section 120.56, F.S., the Department is not able to make any language amendments to the rule based on public comments at this point in the process. However, the Department does wish to address the concerns of licensees. Therefore, the Department will withdraw this one rule. I anticipate being able to publish the withdrawal no later than next Tuesday. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns
I suspect at some time these issues will be brought up again.
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  #8  
Old 5/7/13, 2:25 PM
Russell J. Hensel's Avatar
Russell J. Hensel Russell J. Hensel is offline
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Default Re: Rule change

Lets not make this a personal fight.

From the way I see it, the people trying to screw us, get paid to do exactly that. Can you blame them, we took the wind mits from them. So we opened a can of worm and thought they were going to play nice?

There is one guy I am super mad at and its that fat guy from SW Florida, his name is Russ Hensel! He did not research this, he did nothing and assumed someone else was going to do it for him. The only person I can blame is me.

Being the martyr or phophet is going to accomplish nothing. But now that we are a little more educated, have some leadership guiding us andseem to be somewhat unified, we can make things happen and this is the proof of that. There are NUMEROUS people who made this happen and most want to stay out of the lime light. It was asked of me to bring the issues to light and try and find people of like mind and goals to help us bring our message to light.

So now we know where the artillery fire is coming from, when the next sneak attack will take place and what the egenda will be. So how do we prepare ourselves? With a strategy meeting BEFORE the actual meeting.

All of this will be emailed well in advance of the meeting so we can have a conference call and we can come to a general concensus. So get your thinking caps on, think of ways we can do things, bring quesions and ideas.

We are on our way, we made some headway and please do not think this is a done deal, because it is not even close to being a done deal.

Thanks to everyone, you hard work, time and trust me I understand that trying to run a company, promote growth, have family time and find 2 minutes of peace is rare and yet you give your time to help the profession. THANKS

Love ya guys and appreciate it very much

Russ



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  #9  
Old 5/7/13, 2:33 PM
Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhensel View Post
Lets not make this a personal fight.

From the way I see it, the people trying to screw us, get paid to do exactly that. Can you blame them, we took the wind mits from them. So we opened a can of worm and thought they were going to play nice?

There is one guy I am super mad at and its that fat guy from SW Florida, his name is Russ Hensel! He did not research this, he did nothing and assumed someone else was going to do it for him. The only person I can blame is me.

Being the martyr or phophet is going to accomplish nothing. But now that we are a little more educated, have some leadership guiding us andseem to be somewhat unified, we can make things happen and this is the proof of that. There are NUMEROUS people who made this happen and most want to stay out of the lime light. It was asked of me to bring the issues to light and try and find people of like mind and goals to help us bring our message to light.

So now we know where the artillery fire is coming from, when the next sneak attack will take place and what the egenda will be. So how do we prepare ourselves? With a strategy meeting BEFORE the actual meeting.

All of this will be emailed well in advance of the meeting so we can have a conference call and we can come to a general concensus. So get your thinking caps on, think of ways we can do things, bring quesions and ideas.

We are on our way, we made some headway and please do not think this is a done deal, because it is not even close to being a done deal.

Thanks to everyone, you hard work, time and trust me I understand that trying to run a company, promote growth, have family time and find 2 minutes of peace is rare and yet you give your time to help the profession. THANKS

Love ya guys and appreciate it very much

Russ
With all due respect, when someone tries to put me out of business, I take that very personal!

When I read through the proposed rules changes, I knew that most would never be passed. That is what I addressed in my 8 page letter to those in charge. There were a few that were questionable, but now, that we have a little knowledge and a few allies, it is time to take control of our profession.

Our biggest ally is the law. Learn it and research it.
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  #10  
Old 5/7/13, 4:38 PM
Richard Haynes Richard Haynes is offline
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Default Re: Rule change

Attached is the main document provided before the rules hearing of March 21, 2013. The file was too big to be sent earlier. I made the document two parts.

Rules Part1.doc

Rules-Part2.doc
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  #11  
Old 5/7/13, 5:27 PM
Russell J. Hensel's Avatar
Russell J. Hensel Russell J. Hensel is offline
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Default Re: Rule change

Richard, no disrespect but why didn't you notify the masses? Just asking not acusing.



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  #12  
Old 5/7/13, 6:08 PM
Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhaynes View Post
Attached is the main document provided before the rules hearing of March 21, 2013. The file was too big to be sent earlier. I made the document two parts.

Attachment 64975

Attachment 64976
That document is a result of a letter dated February 28, to the DBPR asking for the corrections in spelling as well as striking lines f & h.

Then, it was put back in disregarding the recommendation.
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  #13  
Old 5/7/13, 8:42 PM
Jay C. Murray's Avatar
Jay C. Murray Jay C. Murray is offline
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Default Re: Rule change

Seriously, can we just forward them a copy of the NACHI standards of practice. They seem to be trying reinvent the wheel with what HI's can and cannot do.



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  #14  
Old 5/7/13, 8:45 PM
Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI Eric C. Van De Ven, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmurray4 View Post
Seriously, can we just forward them a copy of the NACHI standards of practice. They seem to be trying reinvent the wheel with what HI's can and cannot do.
The standards are already there and one group decided to try and eliminate some things, without actually reading the first part of the SoP.

This should have been done prior to the law taking effect. As you said, we ain't reinventing the wheel here!
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  #15  
Old 5/7/13, 8:53 PM
Michael J. Meeker, CMI's Avatar
Michael J. Meeker, CMI Michael J. Meeker, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Rule change

Can someone explain to me why you do not want it as unrestrictive as possible?

Then you can do ten times the stuff required and sell the fact that you are the greatest thing since sliced bread.

You collectively have already screwed up by letting the State get involved in your business now the best thing you could possibly do is to keep them out of it as much as possible.

You should be trying for a SOP that says you have to sign the bottom of your inspection.

Reason being is then you can write your own Super SOP and show all the reasons you are so much better then the next guy.

Stop being fools and trying to make all involved do the same thing you are making yourselves equal in the eyes of the clients therefore reducing you percieved worth.


Wake the heck up.



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Quality Control Consultants. Pre-Purchase Building and Home Consultations
FLORIDA LICENSED GENERAL CONTRACTOR & CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR
Call 954-922-0584 or E-Mail Me For The Best Consultations or Inspections in Florida.
mike@meekerindustries.com
http://www.meekerindustries.com
Also Check out these two great sites below for a HEALTHIER LIFE !
mikemeeker.towergarden.com & mikemeeker.juiceplus.com
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