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  #46  
Old 12/28/17, 8:33 AM
Linas Dapkus, CMI's Avatar
Linas Dapkus, CMI Linas Dapkus, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

So if Dominic does not require his software customers to add a similar disclaimer into their inspection agreements, is he more susceptible to lawsuits??? It seems that all this crap started when ISN, HG and others sold out to the big guys.



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Dapkus Home Inspections

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  #47  
Old 12/28/17, 9:32 AM
Frank Rotte Frank Rotte is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by ldapkus View Post
So if Dominic does not require his software customers to add a similar disclaimer into their inspection agreements, is he more susceptible to lawsuits??? It seems that all this crap started when ISN, HG and others sold out to the big guys.
It might be prudent for Dom to include such language. He should probably consult his attorney.




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  #48  
Old 12/28/17, 9:40 AM
Roy Lewis, CMI's Avatar
Roy Lewis, CMI Roy Lewis, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

I use HIP and I'm greatly satisfied with it.
I don't use ISN or used the cloud service.
I like to keep it as simple as possible. Everything "in house".
Hence, I will have no problem with any of the s*hit you guys are referring to..Nope!




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  #49  
Old 12/28/17, 9:40 AM
Steve Taylor, CMI Steve Taylor, CMI is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by ldapkus View Post
So if Dominic does not require his software customers to add a similar disclaimer into their inspection agreements, is he more susceptible to lawsuits??? It seems that all this crap started when ISN, HG and others sold out to the big guys.
That is a good question that Dominic will need to consider. I have used HG for over 15 years and have been very happy with the product and service. I was disappointed to learn that HG sold out, even though I understand the reasons. I am getting concerned with all this "market disruption" in our profession. If all or many of the HG users jump ship to HIP, then Dom's data base and client list will continue to grow considerably and then he would be a target for this "disruption". So, the next question, can HIP resist the temptation when the big $$ comes calling?



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  #50  
Old 12/28/17, 9:46 AM
Frank Rotte Frank Rotte is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlewis5 View Post
I use HIP and I'm greatly satisfied with it.
I don't use ISN or used the cloud service.
I like to keep it as simple as possible. Everything "in house".
Hence, I will have no problem with any of the s*hit you guys are referring to..Nope!
And the same thing can be done with HG. You can use it as a stand-alone pdf report generator. The Inspector doesn't "need" to interact with HG. This is just a bunch of Chicken Little bs.




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  #51  
Old 12/28/17, 9:51 AM
Roy Lewis, CMI's Avatar
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by frotte View Post
And the same thing can be done with HG. You can use it as a stand-alone pdf report generator. The Inspector doesn't "need" to interact with HG. This is just a bunch of Chicken Little bs.
Agree!




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  #52  
Old 12/28/17, 9:52 AM
Linas Dapkus, CMI's Avatar
Linas Dapkus, CMI Linas Dapkus, CMI is online now
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by staylor7 View Post
That is a good question that Dominic will need to consider. I have used HG for over 15 years and have been very happy with the product and service. I was disappointed to learn that HG sold out, even though I understand the reasons. I am getting concerned with all this "market disruption" in our profession. If all or many of the HG users jump ship to HIP, then Dom's data base and client list will continue to grow considerably and then he would be a target for this "disruption". So, the next question, can HIP resist the temptation when the big $$ comes calling?
Yup.
Money talks.
Anything can be bought for the right amount of money.
Even Dom.



Linas Dapkus
Dapkus Home Inspections

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
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  #53  
Old 12/28/17, 9:55 AM
Roy Lewis, CMI's Avatar
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by ldapkus View Post
Yup.
Money talks.
Anything can be bought for the right amount of money.
How much would it cost to get you to leave the MB....?

Just Jokin' with you




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  #54  
Old 12/28/17, 10:29 AM
Ray Thoroman Ray Thoroman is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Russell,



Please define ''programs'' that you mention.

If I use your HG services HomeGauge Inspector Services is this a ''program''?

I would like a clear definition and list of ''programs'' please. Then you are saying if I use a ''program'' I will have to update my PIA to have your exact language?



Providing Residential Inspections in Georgia
Providing Commercial Inspections in GA, FL, AL, SC, NC, TN, KY
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  #55  
Old 12/28/17, 10:33 AM
Russell Buchanan's Avatar
Russell Buchanan Russell Buchanan is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Update response to the Terms and Conditions release from HomeGauge

Thanks for the feedback good and bad. We respect the relationship with the inspector and their customer. We tried a one clause fits all approach that covers the inspector that offers programs and the inspector who does not. That clearly is not going to work. What we need is language in your agreement that lets your buyer know that a 3rd party (such as HomeGauge) is storing their information.

If you already have language in your agreement that does this, you’re set to go!

If you don’t have any language that refers to 3rd parties yet, and you do not want to offer programs please use this language to let your buyer know their information will be stored at HomeGauge:
“In providing the property inspection and inspection report, information about the client, inspector, real estate professional, and property will be collected and input into HomeGauge inspection software and services, which inspector uses to produce the inspection report. This information may include personally-identifiable information about the client, inspector and real estate professional. This information may subsequently be used by the provider of HomeGauge, as set out in the HomeGauge Privacy Policy found at https://www.HomeGauge.com/privacy.html<https://www.homegauge.com/privacy.html>.”

If you the inspector don’t have any language that refers to 3rd parties yet, and do intend to offer programs where data might be sent to a 3rd party this language will work:

“In providing the property inspection and inspection report, information about the client, inspector, real estate professional, and property will be collected and input into HomeGauge inspection software and services, which inspector uses to produce the inspection report. This information may include personally-identifiable information about the client, inspector and real estate professional. This information may subsequently be used by the provider of HomeGauge, as set out in the HomeGauge Privacy Policy found at https://www.HomeGauge.com/privacy.html<https://www.homegauge.com/privacy.html>. Inspectors may choose to use this information to market new or related products and services to clients.”

Note: It can also be reworded to be shorter as long as you let your buyer know that a 3rd party is storing their information.

Summary: These changes are about letting buyers know how their data is stored, not about marketing to your customers. That will require you to opt-in to specific programs.



Russell Buchanan
HomeGauge COO
NC licensed Home Inspector
NC licensed General Contractor


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Last edited by rbuchanan1; 12/28/17 at 10:46 AM..
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  #56  
Old 12/28/17, 10:48 AM
Ray Thoroman Ray Thoroman is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

I'm listening and watching. This industry is very volatile right now. There is a big shift. Big business always wants a piece of the pie. The issue is that our industry is a very small pie. I said it before, vendors and service providers can only squeeze so much out of us.

Most people do not understand how closely we are monitored. Data mining has been around since the 1800's at least. It has evolved very rapidly in the past 20 years, more so than the last 200 years. Every key stroke you push on the computer, every time you fire up that smart phone browser, even every time you grocery shop or make a store purchase - your personal data is being mined. That information is used, sold and resold in many different ways. Some businesses get caught, some businesses bury it in TOS, some tell you up front more clearly. It's a necessary evil, I weigh it out every day...a trade off if you will.


The issue I have is we are a small industry and things can go from good to bad very quickly. I ask that our industry, association, and vendors please consider the respect and loyalty we give as customers. Don't taint this industry. There are ways to make money without chewing us up and spitting out pieces.



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  #57  
Old 12/28/17, 11:01 AM
Charles Lewis, CMI Charles Lewis, CMI is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Russell,

Thank you for working to address our concerns.

However, all of these options still reference your website for how HG (American Family) will use this information. Any competent lawyer would not allow language in a contract that relies on an outside, easy to change source. You could change your privacy policy overnight and it would change the meaning of every contract we have that includes your new language.

Also, as currently stated in your privacy policy, you could use our clients' personal information to "improve our software and other services we provide." Since you are now owned by American Family, that apparently includes whatever services American Family provides and wants to market to our clients.

Charles





Nonprofit Home Inspections
4127 NE 57th Avenue
Portland, Oregon 97218

Portland Home Inspection
Home Inspection Vancouver WA
Home Inspection Eugene Oregon
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  #58  
Old 12/28/17, 11:32 AM
Russell Buchanan's Avatar
Russell Buchanan Russell Buchanan is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Quote:
Originally Posted by clewis3 View Post
Russell,

Thank you for working to address our concerns.

However, all of these options still reference your website for how HG (American Family) will use this information. Any competent lawyer would not allow language in a contract that relies on an outside, easy to change source. You could change your privacy policy overnight and it would change the meaning of every contract we have that includes your new language.

Also, as currently stated in your privacy policy, you could use our clients' personal information to "improve our software and other services we provide." Since you are now owned by American Family, that apparently includes whatever services American Family provides and wants to market to our clients.

Charles
Actually the privacy policy clearly states we will not contact or use the data unless inspector opts in. You can remove the link in the clause too if you are not opted into any programs etc. One company sent me his clause that he has had in there before this announcement. It is worded very well:

The client’s information will be sent to other 3rd parties or service providers which provide hosting, storage and/or scheduling services to the inspection company, and are subject to their privacy policies. The inspection report must be given to other parties in the transaction and Company has no control over this shared information. Client agrees to hold all parties harmless for the transmission of basic personal data to third parties or related service providers.



Russell Buchanan
HomeGauge COO
NC licensed Home Inspector
NC licensed General Contractor


You can now import HIP, 3D, & InspectVue templates!

Compare software! See the difference!
Subscription offer $59 a month for HG Desktop, HG Companion (Android or ios) and HG Services.

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  #59  
Old 12/28/17, 12:05 PM
Charles Lewis, CMI Charles Lewis, CMI is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

Russell,

Apparently we are not reading the same HomeGauge Privacy policy. Here it is below with annotations:

"HomeGauge may send personally-identifiable information provided by you to other parties when: we have your consent to share the information this consent is given when they sign our agreement with your forced language; we need to share your information to provide the product or service you have requested; and when we respond to subpoenas, court orders or legal process.

We may also use personal information for internal purposes such as auditing, data analysis, research, and to improve our products, services and customer communications. Examples of such use are:

Personal information we collect allows us to keep you posted on HomeGauge's latest product announcements, software updates and upcoming events. If you don't want to be on our mailing list, you can opt-out anytime.

Personal information, as well as information collected via the inspection softwareThis means that information we collect in our inspection about the house will be available to American Family as well as personal information, helps us create, develop, operate, deliver and improve our software and other services we provide this means that you (American Family) can use it to market your services as well as to give confidential information about the home to American Family"

As one of my employees pointed out, all you have to do is figure out why American Family wanted to buy HomeGauge -- it's a treasure trove of personal, confidential information about people's homes. There's no way we're going to violate our trust with our clients in order to give American Family personal information about our clients and their homes.

Charles





Nonprofit Home Inspections
4127 NE 57th Avenue
Portland, Oregon 97218

Portland Home Inspection
Home Inspection Vancouver WA
Home Inspection Eugene Oregon

Last edited by clewis3; 12/28/17 at 12:30 PM.. Reason: clarify
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  #60  
Old 12/28/17, 12:53 PM
James H. Bushart James H. Bushart is offline
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Default Re: Homegauge behaving like Porch

I have assisted many families with American Family homeowners insurance policies, as well as dozens of other insurance companies, and have found them to contain many "land mines" that allow them to deny coverage to policyholders for damage to their home. I have successfully represented policyholders who had been denied coverage or had been underpaid by tens of thousands of dollars ... the most dramatic being a client whose claim was totally and improperly denied by American Family Insurance and for whom I recovered close to $80,000.00.

Here is one policyholder from another state who came to me too late for me to help: Milan family forced to flee home over toxic mold | WQAD.com

There is a special place in hell for any home inspector who provides private information about a homebuyer and his property to any insurance company ... directly or indirectly ... for their use in denying legitimate insurance claims.

As a licensed public adjuster, I will be watching for American Family (or any other insurance carrier) to use information like this to deny legitimate insurance claims and I will personally see to it that the home inspector who provided the information shares in their loss. I promise.

It looks like AmFam prefers ASHI inspectors, anyway. Get a Better Home Inspector | American Family Insurance

Last edited by jbushart; 12/28/17 at 2:57 PM..
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